Quote :

"Maybe if the government did its job and restricted our borders so these items didn't get shipped in, I wouldn't be able to get one."

Thats worked well for drugs hasn't it.

11/10/2008 5:58:56 PM

I guess all drugs should be legal also.

Free heroin!

11/10/2008 5:59:20 PM

you're comparing apples and oranges, moron

11/10/2008 6:00:05 PM

Treetwista did it first

11/10/2008 6:00:16 PM

don't YOU actually think all drugs SHOULD be legal? maybe i've been misinterpreting some of your views in TSB

11/10/2008 6:00:20 PM

Maybe if we took your same mentality about harsh punishments and executed anyone in possession of a fully automatic weapon we wouldn't have those people with them anymore?

11/10/2008 6:01:26 PM

so you want to kill innocent people?

11/10/2008 6:01:48 PM

YOU PEOPLE

no one is going to take away one of the amendments of the bill of rights, especially not the 2nd amendment.

our guns aren't going anywhere. it will not happen, ever.

come back down to earth you fucking maniacs

11/10/2008 6:02:00 PM

Quote :

"so you want to kill innocent people?"

if they're in possession of an illegal weapon, they're not innocent

11/10/2008 6:02:52 PM

it's not illegal in many cases...

[Edited on November 10, 2008 at 6:03 PM. Reason : ^^thanks, you can return to sucking that dick you were working on earlier]

11/10/2008 6:03:11 PM

Quote :

"you're comparing apples and oranges"

If you use a plan to stop people from importing oranges and it doesn't work, i will go as far as to say it wouldn't work on apples either.

11/10/2008 6:05:02 PM

gg on twisting the context!

11/10/2008 6:06:05 PM

Quote :

"you can return to sucking that dick you were working on earlier"

do you expect people to engage in debate with you when you act like this?

grow up son

11/10/2008 6:06:40 PM

acting no different than you, really.

11/10/2008 6:07:47 PM

oh? i've instructed you to go suck a dick? missed that one

11/10/2008 6:08:44 PM

no, the actual words are different, but the tone, manner, and contribution to this thread are the same.

just showing you how you are contributing!

11/10/2008 6:10:12 PM

considering i was never directing anything to you specifically, you're entirely wrong.

but whatever. continue the internet big-dick contest guys....

11/10/2008 6:11:49 PM

Quote :

"Anyone can cherry pick statistics, Sobturbo, but tell me why there are so many more gun deaths here than in foreign countries without as many guns? "

OK God, Im not trying to sound arrogant but I majored and studied this crap and the liberal brainwashing didnt take on me.

The reason violent crime is higher in this country than other industrial nations has more to do with our culture and history then guns. This country is unique in that our population is far more heterogeneous than other similar nations. We have more "groups" and "history" of conflict between groups than other nations, post industrial revolution i mean. All groups compete for a chance at a better life, or the American dream, this causes strain, and some inevitably fall short. Some of our past mistakes, ie civil rights oppression, have left certain minorities in positions that may foster "strain" and the creation of an "underclass". All of this can be found in Strain theory by Robert Merton. We have always had an influx of new immigrant populations increasing our heterogeneity, therby increasing strain for "American Dream Resources...ie jobs, wealth, education etc". The more strain the more conflict and crime. With these various groups some will suceed and some will fail. Those who fail may resort to crime or just become part of an underclass whose children may then resort to crime as it is harder to succeed. The competing ethnic groups, and new groups trying to assimilate has always led to some people straying from a "normal life" into a life of crime due to failure, fear, or feeling like an outcast. This same principle of ethnic groups feeling left out or picked on has always led to gangs, which again leads to violent crime.

Fast forward to modern times and this past history has not changed. We still have an influx of new ethnic immigrants, many from violent 3rd world nations. Just look at how MS13 got started in LA and you will see my point. People fleeing violence end up getting together for protection from existing gangs but soon become a violent gang themselves. New ethnic groups still band together and we still have gangs. The level of violence has really somewhat decreased towards the end of the 20th century but the principles that cause strain in this country remain the same. As some heterogeneous groups do well and assimilate, some in the groups still dont. So we have new underclasses as well as ones from previous generations. What makes this country different is the sheer number of different groups and potential underclasses than in other countries.

People who then fall out of traditional norms may look to achieve the dream another way or just dont care about traditional norms at all. Generally underclass values tend to focus less on the future (living with only concern for the present), less on the traditional family (fatherless houses), males tend to be hyper masculine (lack of role models and no identity as a successful breadwinner so they may be more violent prone and promiscuous) and an increase in conspicuous consumption and decrease in saving or acquiring real wealth (buying or stealing things with no real long term value but street noticability...ie rims, fancy clothes, jewelry, cell phones etc). You combine that with a modern pop culture that glamorizes crime and conspicuous consumption, and appeals to underclass kids as an alternative to the traditional route to achieve the dream, and thus more crime/gangs and the fulfillment of a cycle of the underclass. On top of existing underclasses more continue to develop. Also some people who come here do so only to commit crime and take advantage of our nations perceived wealth.

Now every society is going to have its sociopaths, those who commit crime for no reason or due to psychological issues, and that is harder to explain or study on a macro scale. There are also crimes of passion which happen everywhere and cant be predicted. Everything I said is a large part of the problem when looking at crime on a Macro scale and it is a uniquely American problem. You find me another modern industrial nation with that long term history and culture of competing heterogeneous groups. There are other ways to explain our crime such as our laws, criminal justice punishment policies, drug policies etc... but what I said is able to explain much of our so called violent crime (shooting, robbery, break ins, home invasions, theft) on a macro scale. I know this because I have studied it and see it daily. There will always be sociopaths or random unexplainable crimes or crimes of passion. Hell there have been school shootings and massacres in Europe as well as Canada. These are harder to study and analyze large scale, but if you want to know why America is different than similar modern nations.....there is your answer. Enjoy.

11/10/2008 6:13:54 PM

you directed it to anyone in this thread, thus you directed it at me.

AND I DO HAVE THE BIGGEST E-PEEN, BITCH.

11/10/2008 6:13:59 PM

PERSONALLY, I THINK God HAS THESE BELIEFS BUT DOESN'T HOLD STRONGLY TO THEM. RATHER, HE HOLDS STRONGLY TO BEING A DICK BECAUSE HE THINKS HE'S GETTING A "RISE" OUT OF OTHERS.

IN REALITY, I THINK THE GUN SUPPORTERS HAVE BEEN LAUGHING AT HOW CLUELESS HE IS THE WHOLE TIME. HIS KNOWLEDGE LEVEL IS SO LOW AND THE ARGUMENTS HE PRESENTS HAVE BEEN SO THOROUGHLY DEBUNKED THAT IT'S NOT EVEN WORTH ADDRESSING AGAIN.


^^ THIS POST IS INCREDIBLE, IT SHOWS JUST HOW SHALLOW THE LEVEL OF THOUGHT God PUTS INTO HIS COMMENTS IS. HE SEES PROBLEM A AND AUTOMATICALLY ATTRIBUTES IT TO OBJECT B WITH NO ESTABLISHED CAUSAL RELATIONSHIP. PLUS, AN INANIMATE TOOL BEING THE SOLE OR MAJOR CAUSE OF CRIMINAL ACTIVITY IS KIND OF ODD TO BEGIN WITH.

11/10/2008 6:16:56 PM

Quote :

" that's real mature "

well that's what im shooting for
ha
get it

11/10/2008 6:35:53 PM

I'VE GOT IT.

WE'LL BAN ALL GUNS IN AMERICA. TAKE THEM OUT OF PEOPLE'S HANDS. AND CRIMINALS WILL TURN IN THEIR GUNS TOO, SINCE IT'S ILLEGAL. AND WHILE WE'RE AT IT, WE'LL DISARM THE MILITARY AND TURN THEM INTO THE PEACE CORP. THIS IS SURE TO WORK. THERE IS NEVER A NEED FOR WEAPONS AND DEFENDING YOURSELF. AMERICA WILL BE THE FIRST ACTUAL UTOPIA! I CAN SEE IT NOW.

11/10/2008 6:36:50 PM

^^haha, you've redeemed yourself.

[Edited on November 10, 2008 at 6:37 PM. Reason : ^]

11/10/2008 6:36:58 PM

^^Because we're "under attack" right?

You people buy into the hype wayyyy too much.

11/10/2008 7:26:31 PM

yeh, there were no crimes today were there?

11/10/2008 7:26:55 PM

THERE CERTAINLY HAVEN'T BEEN ANY SHOOTINGS, ARMED ROBBERIES OR RAPES AROUND NCSU THIS SEMESTER, HAVE THERE?


OH WAIT.......


I ALSO LOVE HOW God DISMISSED THE PAGE LONG POST JUST A FEW POSTS BACK THAT WAS ENTIRELY DIRECTED AT HIM. THAT'S HOW HE WORKS SONS, HE ALWAYS CHANGES THE SUBJECT LIKE A WHINY BITCH INSTEAD OF ARGUING ANY GIVEN POINT. HE KNOWS HE'S LOST SO HE JUST ACTS LIKE A TODDLER INSTEAD.

11/10/2008 7:27:59 PM

Quote :

"YOU PEOPLE no one is going to take away one of the amendments of the bill of rights, especially not the 2nd amendment. our guns aren't going anywhere. it will not happen, ever. come back down to earth you fucking maniacs"

this is how i feel. thank god i'm not stupid enough to think the world is going to come crashing down at any moment. i can't imagine how it must feel to live in fear all the time. must be super stressful...how do you people cope? ahhh muslims ahhh gays ahhh they're going to take away our guns and give all my money away to poor crack babies. damn those poor crack babies for not having jobs and supporting themselves. ahhh the wrath of god. ahhh abortion. ahhh gay muslims will take my guns and use them to perform abortions. AHHHH. AHHH. AHHHH.

11/10/2008 7:36:37 PM

yes, discussion of possible future political happenings, or topics related to such is so crazy!

if those are your arguments, then go to TSB, and tell them that, because that section is full of it. go get proved afool



[Edited on November 10, 2008 at 7:39 PM. Reason : .]

11/10/2008 7:38:27 PM

i am not worried about the govt taking guns away completely. i'm pretty certain that they'll at least let us keep what they deem to be a "hunting firearm"

however, many politicians support banning handguns and other certain types of weapons that i feel should be legal.

"arms" encompasses a lot of different weapons. there are no absolutes in this. it's a matter of what they will and what they will not let us keep.

11/10/2008 7:41:09 PM

i don't think handguns are going to be banned, either

11/10/2008 7:51:36 PM

ARE THEY GOING TO TRY TO BAN ALL HANDGUNS OUTRIGHT?

NO, AND WITH GOOD REASON. THEY'VE LEARNED BY NOW THAT OUTRIGHT BANNING DOESN'T GET YOU ANYWHERE. THEY WANT TO PICK THE PIECES APART BIT BY BIT BECAUSE THAT WAY THEY CAN WORK TOWARDS THEIR ULTIMATE GOAL WITHOUT HAVING TO BE AT A STANDSTILL. THEY WORK IT THEIR WAY PIECE BY PIECE.

PEOPLE LIKE YOU AND THAT OTHER IDIOT ARE THE PEOPLE THAT ENABLE THIS SLOW CHIPPING AWAY OF OUR RIGHTS TO OCCUR. YOU SAY, "OH, WELL YOU DON'T REALLY NEED MORE THAN 10 HAMBURGERS PER PACK, SO WHY DO YOU CARE IF THEY OUTLAW PACKS CONTAINING MORE THAN 10 HAMBURGERS?" THAT'S A SCARY ATTITUDE TO SEE IN THIS COUNTRY. I BELIEVE SOMEBODY LIKE JACKSON WOULD HAVE BEATEN YOU SENSELESS WITH HIS FUCKING CANE UPON HEARING YOU SPEAK.


SO ANYWAY, NO THEY WONT TRY TO BAN HANDGUNS OUTRIGHT AT THIS TIME. BUT DOES THAT MEAN LEFT WING POLITICIANS AREN'T GOING TO TRY TO RESTRICT MAG CAPACITY AND OTHER FEATURES WITHOUT ANY UNDERSTANDING OF FIREARMS?

ABSOLUTELY NOT, AND THERE'S NO REASON TO BELIEVE THEY WONT TRY. ALL EVIDENCE POINTS TO THE FACT THAT THEY WILL. READ THE RECENTLY PROPOSED ASSAULT WEAPONS BAN AND TELL ME IT'S NOTHING MAJOR. IT BANS HUNDREDS OF FIREARMS FOR THINGS AS STUPID AS HAVING A HEAT SHIELD, OTHER COSMETIC FEATURES OR EVEN A PISTOL GRIP. NOT A PISTOL GRIP LIKE WHAT YOU LAY PEOPLE THINK OF AS BEING ON A "SAWED OFF SHOTGUN" (A "CRUISER" TYPE SHOTGUN) I MEAN THEY WILL OUTLAW A GUN WITH A BUTTSTOCK AND A PISTOL GRIP LIKE AN AR-15, AN AK-47 OR ANY OTHER GUN. YOU WILL NO LONGER BE ABLE TO HAVE A GUN WITH A PISTOL GRIP IF IT ISN'T A PISTOL. WHAT IS THE POINT OF SUCH LEGISLATION?! THE PROPOSED AWB IS CHOCK FULL OF THAT KIND OF SHIT.

11/10/2008 7:55:17 PM

^exactly. why can't people see this shit coming?

11/10/2008 7:58:29 PM

because the current mentality of the supreme court favors handguns?

11/10/2008 7:59:53 PM

and the trifecta of far left ideology in the top 3 government positions can nearly ensure anything happens in the next 4 years

11/10/2008 8:00:52 PM

^^ WE AREN'T TALKING ABOUT HANDGUNS ASSHOLE, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT ALL CURRENTLY LEGAL FIREARMS, AMMUNITION AND ACCESSORIES.

NOT TO MENTION THINGS ARE ABOUT TO "CHANGE" AS WE ALL KNOW.

11/10/2008 8:01:59 PM

Quote :

"however, many politicians support banning handguns and other certain types of weapons that i feel should be legal. "

i was talking about handguns, bitch

oh, oops, i mean SON

11/10/2008 8:02:41 PM

this God guy sounds dumber than Jay Leno

11/10/2008 8:03:33 PM

Quote :

"I BELIEVE SOMEBODY LIKE JACKSON WOULD HAVE BEATEN YOU SENSELESS WITH HIS FUCKING CANE UPON HEARING YOU SPEAK. "

That would've been the best case scenario for you, given his other favorite pasttime.


...and yeah, I don't think I've ever met a single person with a solid knowledge of firearms who was in favor of strict gun control. Anti-gun people tend to base a lot of their stances on total ignorance and misunderstanding.

11/10/2008 8:04:03 PM

Quote :

"That would've been the best case scenario for you, given his other favorite pasttime."

HAHA, DUELING.

11/10/2008 8:04:19 PM

you know, it's not out of the left's conspiracies, to chip away at gun rights a little bit at a time, or to take larger steps by severely limiting or even banning handguns or concealed carry, and continue their ways until they have effectively disarmed innocent, law abiding citizens, leaving them open for crime to slaughter them and their families

11/10/2008 8:04:59 PM

AND LEAVING THEM OPEN TO BEGGING FOR THE GOVERNMENT TO SAVE THEM, RESULTING IN THE HANDING OVER OF ALL OF THE CITIZEN'S POWER TO THE GOVERNMENT.

11/10/2008 8:06:41 PM

i'm not anti-gun. i'm just saying i don't think the second amendment is going anywhere.

Quote :

"leaving them open for crime to slaughter them and their families"

if this was true, wouldn't all the people who don't own guns currently be getting slaughtered by all the criminals running rampant in the street?

i guess i just don't share the same fear mongering ideology. again, i am not sitting here in constant fear that someone is going to come eat me in my sleep. i've thought and think about getting a concealed carry license and i want to go into the military after law school (well that is one of my top choices of careers, at the moment). so i'm not anti-gun. i'm not ignorant. i don't think gun control laws are effective at all since violent crimes are usually committed with illegal(ly modified AND obtained) and stolen weapons. so any laws restricting guns WOULD probably only affect the law abiding citizens. i get it. i'm not retarded. i'm just not shaking in my boots because i seriously do not think the 2nd amendment is going anywhere. i don't think handguns are going anywhere. i don't think concealed carry is going anywhere. and i don't think that we honestly need guns to protect ourselves from criminals since i don't support vigilante justice. i think the 2nd amendment at this point is more about principle.

11/10/2008 8:15:44 PM

^no, but crime would increase. not everyone would be victims.

Quote :

"JUST WATCH THIS, DOOFUSES! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RR9RN_iSKtg"

answers it all

11/10/2008 8:16:51 PM

Ahh yes, the 20/20 "EXPOSE"

11/10/2008 8:25:05 PM

this shit blew the fuck up

11/10/2008 8:33:50 PM

BLOATED GIRTH

RIFE WITH NOTHINGNESS

11/10/2008 8:34:49 PM

Quote :

"YOU PEOPLE no one is going to take away one of the amendments of the bill of rights, especially not the 2nd amendment. our guns aren't going anywhere. it will not happen, ever. come back down to earth you fucking maniacs"

11/10/2008 8:37:25 PM

I heard Obama was gonna go after our right to free speech next!

Fucking Commie!!

11/10/2008 8:39:29 PM

Quote :

"YOU PEOPLE no one is going to take away one of the amendments of the bill of rights, especially not the 2nd amendment. our guns aren't going anywhere. it will not happen, ever. come back down to earth you fucking maniacs"

Many of the guns we are discussing here WERE illegal to purchase from 1994 to 2004, and the way things are going, it looks like they will be illegal after 2009, but this time without a sunset.

I'm all for "common sense" gun legislation. Just like how you can't yell FIRE in a crowded movie theater, you shouldn't be able to discharge a firearm in city limits unless for defense of life or property.

[Edited on November 10, 2008 at 9:06 PM. Reason : ]

11/10/2008 9:05:39 PM

People who fear inanimate objects need help.

11/10/2008 10:34:08 PM