k i'm ready to finally drop some shit in teh jetta.

i'm def. gonna start w/ an ECU upgrade and exhaust. recommend any other basic stuff I could do along with that, to ensure that I don't blow my shit to smithereens. is a downpipe absolutely necessary for such a basic upgrade?

also, what is the difference btwn a diverter/blowoff/bypass valve?

8/6/2005 11:01:14 PM

you want a diverter valve, it releases the pressure back into your intake. Look for Forge 007 as your best bet.
A blowoff valve vents to the atmosphere and can make you throw a code.
A downpipe is what comes off your turbo to the exaust. It is your most restrictive point and will get the most results, especially with a chip/ reflash.

For upgrades, I would start with new diverter valve, programming, and a 2.5'' turbo back exaust.

[Edited on August 6, 2005 at 11:05 PM. Reason : .]

8/6/2005 11:03:44 PM

great start

thanks a lot man. . so no downpipe?

[Edited on August 6, 2005 at 11:06 PM. Reason : eh]

8/6/2005 11:05:53 PM

downpipes usually have the catylitic (sp?) converter(s) on them too... soo they're always nice to ditch and help that suckka spool alot faster

8/6/2005 11:08:46 PM

the downpipe is after the turbo, so when he says "turbo back" exhaust, he means downpipe (DP is how you'll see some people refer to it), high flow catalytic converter or test pipe, and cat-back exhaust.

just remember that with no cat(s), it could be a pain in the ass to get inspected.

and typically, especially on turbo cars, the upgrade path is to start at both ends and work inward.

generically,

1. intake/cat-back exhaust
2. boost control (i'm sure your chip/ecu flash would do this)
3. downpipe, test pipes and high-flow cats

after that, it depends on the car, but typically involves a bigger turbo, bigger fuel pump/injectors, bigger intercooler (IC) piping, and conversion to front mount intercooler (FMIC), and/or a bigger intercooler (IC)...and somewhere along the line, you need a stronger clutch, and maybe beefed up driveline parts, etc. it's always simply a matter of finding the biggest restriction or weakest link, then replacing it and finding the next one.


there are tuning companies that specialize in that engine. they've already played around and determined what works well, and they'll tell you what to do. some of them will sell bundled "staged" upgrade packages.

[Edited on August 6, 2005 at 11:15 PM. Reason : asdf]

8/6/2005 11:09:24 PM

ooooohhh so it'd be best to just stick w/ my stock exhaust and just throw a bigger DP on it, huh?

8/6/2005 11:10:16 PM

Quote :

"2.5'' turbo back exaust."

he's suggesting everything from the turbo to the back of the car

8/6/2005 11:12:35 PM

You can do that if you don't really want to change the sound of your exaust, and not get as much as you can from your car. If you keep the stock cat back, you will still have those stock restrictions. A Turbo back is the down pipe, which comes off the turbo and has the cat, and the cat back, which is the back pipe and muffler.

For the biggest increase you do the whole exaust.

Go here and do searches and read the forums. http://forums.vwvortex.com/zeroforum?id=4

Do the chip first. It adds 20+ (+++) hp and tq.
[Edited on August 6, 2005 at 11:13 PM. Reason : .]

[Edited on August 6, 2005 at 11:14 PM. Reason : .]

[Edited on August 6, 2005 at 11:15 PM. Reason : .]

8/6/2005 11:13:02 PM

the chip + exhaust + downpipe at the cheapest will be about 1000.


^^^^I had a boost controller once. . .the lag was awful. I've heard the chips are much more responsive at lower RPMs

[Edited on August 6, 2005 at 11:16 PM. Reason : asdf]

8/6/2005 11:14:25 PM

if you can find all of that, especially for an Audi, for $1000, you have stumbed across a very, very good deal.


unless you get used shit. nothing wrong with used exhaust parts.

[Edited on August 6, 2005 at 11:17 PM. Reason : my cat back cost that much. a header costs that much again.]

[Edited on August 6, 2005 at 11:18 PM. Reason : header is analagous to a downpipe, but is on a naturally aspirated or supercharged car]

8/6/2005 11:16:37 PM

what i found was this:
http://www.bahnbrenner.com/media/php/catalog.php?pid=666

http://www.bahnbrenner.com/media/php/catalog.php?pid=355

and a $250 downpipe at newdimensions.com.

8/6/2005 11:19:21 PM

It is more expensive, but check out APR and REVO for software.
The TT exaust is a good upgrade.

8/6/2005 11:21:29 PM

i checked out APR a couple years back, and it looks like the upsolute and APR stuff are similar in quality

8/6/2005 11:22:04 PM

APR can flash your ECU on the spot, no down time. Unlike Upsolute where you have to send off your computer.

8/6/2005 11:23:25 PM

so there's absolutely no way to have it done here?

btw, give opinions of these, if possible:

http://search.ebay.com/1-8T-downpipe_W0QQsofocusZbsQQsbrftogZ1QQcatrefZC6QQfromZR10QQsatitleZ1.8TQ20downpipeQQsacatZ-1QQcatrefZC6QQmppfqyZ1.8TQ20intakeQQsargnZ-1QQsaslcZ2QQsadisZ200QQfposZQ5AIPQ2FPostalQQftrtZ1QQftrvZ1QQfsopZ1QQfsooZ1

8/6/2005 11:24:58 PM

You can have APR software put on your car here at BFI. http://www.blackforestindustries.com
This downpipe looks like the best one on the first page. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/NEUSPEED-SS-Downpipe-GTI-Golf-Jetta-New-Beetle-TT-1-8T_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ42610QQitemZ7991647909QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW

8/6/2005 11:26:51 PM

hahahah duurrrr i coulda deduced that by the cost

what i really want to know is, which ones are pure crap?

8/6/2005 11:27:47 PM

It is pot luck on what might be crap. No one can tell till they get it in their hand.

8/6/2005 11:31:03 PM

how are those autotech Q-chips at that BFI place?

8/6/2005 11:32:15 PM

I don't really know. I am trying to keep warranty on my car. Give them a call on monday.

8/6/2005 11:34:12 PM

ha i see

my warranty (a shitty, shitty, expensive warranty) dies in 4,000 miles.

8/6/2005 11:34:51 PM

I still have 55k left on mine. About to go use it for a diverter valve and a window regulator.

[Edited on August 6, 2005 at 11:36 PM. Reason : I'm out for tonight. PM me if you have more questions.]

8/6/2005 11:35:32 PM

you need to do some SERIOUS reading and research before you jump into any of this. there is a lot of dos/donts. some chips cause surging with turboback exhausts, which can damage your stock turbo. some 3" exhausts will give you error codes, which will be a pain in the ass if they keep reoccuring, let alone give you problems when car is due for inspection. you need to know what you are doing, where to look for help before you add shit to the basket and "checkout".

personally, i would save the money for a big turbo upgrade, which pretty includes everything you need to make the car go. from software to diverter valve. chip+TB+misc small shit=50fwhp AT MOST. this is peanut power considering how much money you spend (and it will be about 1/2 of money that you would spend on a big turbo setup such as "disco potato" -GT28R or GT28RS). ~$2.5k vs ~$5k for big turbo.

all in all, keep your stuff stock until you have more money for mods that will really make a noticable difference. do some light mods....euroswitch, rear fogs, bla bla...something cheap and aesthetic that looks cool or different, yet it supresses the big mod bug.

[Edited on August 6, 2005 at 11:48 PM. Reason : .]

8/6/2005 11:46:14 PM

i can't imagine getting a good, full T28 package for anywhere near $2500.

i wouldn't get that deep into modding it. i'd do the intake/exhaust/boost control (software, in your case) stuff, and call it quits. that stuff won't hinder streetability at all, and any driveability/longevity tradeoff would be small enough not to worry much about it. get in deeper, and there is generally a price to be paid somewhere (besides the rather substantial cost of buying the shit to begin with).

furthermore, we are dealing with a FWD sedan, here. if you want to go faster than the I/E/boost route will take you, it's time to get something with a proper sporting chassis, including RWD or AWD layout.

[Edited on August 6, 2005 at 11:57 PM. Reason : honestly, i'd stay stock everything on that car, with the exception of the software "mod".]

8/6/2005 11:56:04 PM

^i was saying his chip, tb, and small other stuff will be about $2.5k. 1.8 vw engines can take a lot and are probably good to 400whp before you need to upgrade internals, with a clutch exception. stock turbo puts really no stress on that engine. people also claim they are completely "daily drivable" even with big turbo setups. to what extent, i dont know...

but, yeah id stay stock with that car, until you either get more money or move onto something else.

[Edited on August 7, 2005 at 12:05 AM. Reason : f]

8/7/2005 12:04:22 AM

lets be realistic. chip it and then worry about the rest

8/7/2005 12:19:18 AM

Intakes are good for sounds only on a 1.8t
Software will generally range about 400-500
DP's from 200-400, depending on whether they have a cat or not
Catbacks another 500-1000 depending on brand

Now as far as a BT set up, unless you go striaght there you will pay more for software to upgrade when you do that, reguradless of who's it is.

The stock DP is the main restriction in the exhaust. The cat back portion changes very little, especailly with the stock turbo.

That and when your talking about 1.8t's torque is the name of the game, more so than hp. Software+DP= 30-40hp and 60-80ftlbs of gains.

A DV upgrade is for durabiltiy, it won't give you any power it will just hold up to higher boost level unlike the stock valve

8/7/2005 12:37:45 AM

^what is the stock exhaust on 1.8T GLI/20th?

2"? 2.25" ?

8/7/2005 12:57:43 AM

Quote :

"A DV upgrade is for durabiltiy, it won't give you any power it will just hold up to higher boost level unlike the stock valve "

just clarifying for PvtJoker...

holding up to higher boost pressures effectively gives you more power...or rather, it allows you to make full use of the boost you are producing. stock valves will often leak past a certain boost pressure. for example, let's say your stock boost is 10 psi. let's say that your software upgrade turns it up to 14 psi...that alone should give you at least 40 more hp...but if your stock DV/BOV can't hold more than 12 psi, you won't realize the full gain.

but yeah, what he's saying is that there's no reason to upgrade that valve unless you're pushing it past its capabilities. if it can hold the boost pressure you want to run, leave it be.

8/7/2005 1:03:56 AM

2.25, well actually 55mm

But the DP from the turbo flange to the cat is only 50mm and has 2 big bends in it for no real reason

Pics worth a 100 words






Thats stock vs a 2.5" dp

8/7/2005 1:03:57 AM

thanks. i guess those two curves are there to keep it quiet?? doesnt make much sense...

8/7/2005 1:07:29 AM

doubt it would help much with the stock turbo as it would add as much pressure loss as it would cool the intake charge more, but a good front mount intercooler and set of hardpipes is a good upgrade to do before upping the boost or going to a bigger turbo to keep the knock count at or close to 0 while maintaining full timing advance

8/7/2005 2:21:17 AM

chip before front mount, don't listen to him

8/7/2005 12:21:28 PM

sorry, let me qualify that "upping the boost" with significantly. I mean I doubt that tiny stock turbo would except the limits of the stock intercooler and plastic pipes, but just keep in mind car companies do intercooler plumbing as cheap as possible and only to work well with a factory spec engine.

8/7/2005 12:52:27 PM

man, what kind of english is that?

[Edited on August 7, 2005 at 1:00 PM. Reason : f]

8/7/2005 12:59:39 PM

[chip]

8/7/2005 1:18:57 PM

editted for clarity, reposted for that damn 30min rule..

sorry, let me qualify that "upping the boost" with significantly (upping the boost significantly.. possibly with a bigger turbo). I doubt that tiny stock turbo would exceed the limits of the stock intercooler and plastic pipes. just keep in mind, car companies do intercooler plumbing as cheap as possible and only to work well within factory boost specs and not much more.

[Edited on August 7, 2005 at 1:24 PM. Reason : .]

8/7/2005 1:23:36 PM

so in short, you're an idiot. espeically when it comes to all things VAG.

8/7/2005 6:30:26 PM

ugh..

go to http://www.ncdubs.com

there are a few guys who have been messing around with the 1.8t for a few years now. they all know their stuff.

8/8/2005 10:17:15 AM

ha

8/8/2005 5:42:20 PM

ha what?

8/8/2005 6:31:06 PM