kill sat. radio, eventually? Or at least make it harder for them to make money?

4/2/2006 3:12:15 PM

not for a while - satellite radio will morph into music videos accompanying the music - traffic info tied in with nav. systems to suggest faster routes

4/2/2006 3:15:05 PM

I'd say that terrestial digital radio will kill satellite radio before mobile wireless does. I'm actually kinda surprised that digital radio hasn't really gone anywhere in the US.

4/2/2006 5:26:32 PM

Quote :

"satellite radio will morph into music videos accompanying the music "

I'm a bit skeptical here. Sure, you have built in screens but somehow I see a big hurdle to get over in regards of offering a service that is basically promoting poor driving. Sure, it can/should be designed and marketed for passengers, but the government might not see it that way, and lets face it, drivers are going to be trying to watch it, too. It's one thing when there is a law that says a driver can't view the display while driving and he has to act in multiple different ways to break the law (installin the in dash, disabling the park break feature, purchasing the dvd, playing the dvd), but quite another when a company offers a prepackaged service to be played on your built in nav.

Quote :

"I'd say that terrestial digital radio will kill satellite radio before mobile wireless does. I'm actually kinda surprised that digital radio hasn't really gone anywhere in the US."

Ahh, I had forgotten about that, I need to do some reasearch. Before reading anything about this, my hunch is the FCC combined with greedy stations that don't want to do the invest in the new equipment/licensing are what is preventing this so far (and probably paying off lobbyist to block legislation too).

4/3/2006 12:09:27 PM

Quote :

""I'd say that terrestial digital radio will kill satellite radio before mobile wireless does. I'm "

if barely anyone has heard of it, i doubt its going to overtake the satellites anytime soon

4/3/2006 12:12:43 PM

Christ synapse, just go ahead and own yourself next time.

http://forums.digitalinsurrection.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=163097

Quote :

"To date, over 300 terrestrial stations in over across the USA have received the go-ahead from the FCC to begin digital radio broadcasts."

4/3/2006 12:18:13 PM

i think he was talking about consumers, and not stations
and 300 doesnt really same that high even for stations (but i have no idea how many stations there are)

4/3/2006 12:20:52 PM

Quote :

"I'm a bit skeptical here. Sure, you have built in screens but somehow I see a big hurdle to get over in regards of offering a service that is basically promoting poor driving. Sure, it can/should be designed and marketed for passengers, but the government might not see it that way, and lets face it, drivers are going to be trying to watch it, too. It's one thing when there is a law that says a driver can't view the display while driving and he has to act in multiple different ways to break the law (installin the in dash, disabling the park break feature, purchasing the dvd, playing the dvd), but quite another when a company offers a prepackaged service to be played on your built in nav."

you must not know about the success in rear dvd players for passengers - mainly in minivans/suvs - but they are working their way into the car market also - people will pay money to appease passengers - especially kids

4/3/2006 12:21:45 PM

Up to 600+ now

http://www.ibiquity.com/press/pr/010406-1.htm

4/3/2006 12:26:45 PM

and yet... no one has heard of it

4/3/2006 12:29:12 PM

Quote :

"you must not know about the success in rear dvd players for passengers - mainly in minivans/suvs - but they are working their way into the car market also - people will pay money to appease passengers - especially kids"

Of course I know the success they have had in people haulers, I can see it firsthand every time I drive.

That is a passenger specific item. Music videos are a successor to just the music, which is for the majority of cars on the road, a drive specific item. This completely ignores the bandwidth peice of the puzzle, which is to say, not insignificant.

I don't know how many people toters are going to want to pay or even have the need to let their kids, who are going to be younger than video watching age anyway, watch streamed videos when DVDs fit this role perfectly.

Quote :

" and yet... no one has heard of it "

I mean really, what is your point? You've never heard of a lot of shit that is on the verge of dropping, doesn't mean it isn't out there.

[Edited on April 3, 2006 at 12:32 PM. Reason : x]

4/3/2006 12:30:56 PM

In the end a widespread wireless network providing broadband internet would be preferable to all other over-the-air signals.

Since its application independent it would just extend the reach of normal computers into mobile platforms.

The only people with the infrastructure to do this will be the cell providers, But since consumers are more than willing to pay retarded ammounts for their shitty service, this wont change. Combined with the barrier to entry that would be creating the infrastructure it may be a while to we see something like this. Which is a huge dissapointment.

HD terrestrial radio is probably comparable to sat. radio in quality of service, but they differ in content. Content is why satellite radio is so much better than current am/fm. Even if HD terrestrial replaces all current AM/FM its still gonna be faggot djs spinning faggot music and faggot ads.

[Edited on April 3, 2006 at 12:39 PM. Reason : .]

4/3/2006 12:37:48 PM

you stupidly jumped on synapses balls for pointing out no one has heard of it

4/3/2006 12:38:52 PM

Quote :

"traffic info tied in with nav. systems to suggest faster routes"

ehhhh
not from sat radio

they're already having troubles because some stations have started reporting traffic info for the larger cities

something that TR stations are saying is in direct violation of certain agreements (not to provide local information)

4/3/2006 12:51:36 PM

^^ My statement still stands. Just because noone has heard of it doesn't mean it isn't out there. A metric shit ton of people, people that have massive DVD collections, haven't heard of HD-DVD or Blu Ray either. It must mean it isn't going to overtake regular DVD anytime soon.

4/3/2006 12:54:04 PM

it will overtake DVD b/c the media has been hyping the hd-dvd/blu-ray issue for quite a while. i don't hear anybody talking about radio except for geeks and those in the industry.

4/3/2006 12:55:47 PM

Quote :

"it will overtake DVD b/c the media has been hyping the hd-dvd/blu-ray issue for quite a while."

This simply isn't true about media hype. There hasn't been a media campaign outside the past quarter dealing with this emerging technology. They haven't even finalized on the standards yet. Just because your favorite tech sites (ars, slashdot, etc) post about HD/BRY doesn't mean it is media hype, and just because you don't see anyting about HD radio doesn't mean it isn't coming.

4/3/2006 1:11:00 PM

Quote :

"You've never heard of a lot of shit that is on the verge of dropping, doesn't mean it isn't out there. "

Quote :

"Up to 600+ now"

600 bagillion stations out there in the airwaves and customers actually out there buying digital radio sets are two totally different things.

Quote :

"Even if HD terrestrial replaces all current AM/FM its still gonna be faggot djs spinning faggot music and faggot ads."

exactly. if i can pay $10,$12,$15 or whatever a month and get over 100 channels, with all music being commercial free, i dont give two shits about the hd radio stations in my area...unless theres like 80 of them (which there wont be) and they're all commercial free. (which they wont be). ntm can i go from one coast to the other listening to the same station? if not then why would i bother. its all about a shitton of content from one central source. people like that, not this traditional radio crap. so we'll go from static filled shitty music and annoying car commercials to crystal clear shitty music and annoying car commercials. awesome, calling sirius to cancel.


traditional radio is to satellite radio as blockbuster video is to netflix
its an outdated business model



[Edited on April 3, 2006 at 1:28 PM. Reason : ]

4/3/2006 1:17:33 PM

Let me ask you, do you pay extra for digital cable and boxes or are you fine with the standard?

Just because you buy XM for the content and don't care about digital radio for the lack of content, doesn't mean you represent the majority.

Your original argument said that digital radio won't overtake satellites anytime soon. In general, we shouldn't even argument it this way. Going forward, digital radio will begin to overtake analog as the standard such that all automobile radios and aftermarket head units will be digital. And since terrestrial is still dominating sat. for listeners, it will still be on the burden of sat. to overtake the terrestrial that has now become digital.

You could argue that by the time digital terrestrial gets here, sat. will have taken the lead, but the subscribers and the numbers don't show this happening anytime in the near future.

4/3/2006 1:27:59 PM

and hopefully before any of that happens we'll have a better nationwide broadband wireless network making it all moot.

4/3/2006 1:43:42 PM

Quote :

"Going forward, digital radio will begin to overtake analog as the standard such that all automobile radios and aftermarket head units will be digital"

there is no "overtaking" here. its simply clear channel etc upgrading their equipment.

Quote :

"You could argue that by the time digital terrestrial gets here, sat. will have taken the lead, but the subscribers and the numbers don't show this happening anytime in the near future."

digital, analog, blah its all the same company, all the same crap. the real question is how fast will sat radio grow? XM and sirius currently have 10 million households, 10% of the market. Not bad for a practically brand new business. Sirius had 190% growth in subscribers last year, while a nice chunk of it was due to howard stern, they and xm have had some nice growth. and as they continue to add the big name entertainers to their content list, their growth will continue.
http://www.telematicsjournal.com/content/newsfeed/6785.html


http://www.fool.com/news/commentary/2006/commentary06032310.htm

4/3/2006 1:58:48 PM

^^ i dont know, i dont think ip is the answer for everything.

4/3/2006 1:59:23 PM

Quote :

"there is no "overtaking" here. its simply clear channel etc upgrading their equipment. "

Well, this is what I meant, not literally overtaking.

But which is it, you first said digital radio won't be able to overtak sat. then you conceeded

Quote :

"digital, analog, blah its all the same company, all the same crap. the real question is how fast will sat radio grow? XM and sirius currently have 10 million households, 10% of the market."

that sat. radio is the one that has to do the overtaking.

Most analyst are worried that XM has akready reached its saturation until the service and equipment gets cheaper (thus bringin on more subscribers). This is evident in the fact that Wall Street 2006 likes to see growth, and XMs stock price is down to ~23 from a high of ~37 not even a year ago yet.

4/3/2006 2:31:48 PM

Quote :

"and hopefully before any of that happens we'll have a better nationwide broadband wireless network making it all moot."

I hope so too, which was the basis (the forward thinking if you will ) of this thread. A wifi IP based network would be more desirable to me as a geek than a royalty/proprietary based system.

I was envisioning a box in my car that could tune in to ShoutCast stations just like I tune into radio/xm stations today.

[Edited on April 3, 2006 at 2:34 PM. Reason : shit, sorry to double post folks]

4/3/2006 2:34:05 PM

Quote :

"Most analyst are worried that XM has akready reached its saturation until the service and equipment gets cheaper (thus bringin on more subscribers). "

do you mean xm in particular, or satellite radio. because if its the latter then sirius, with their 190% subscriber growth last year, would disagree with you. analysts can say what they want, but when i see my near retired afraid-of-technology dad using, and loving sirius i know they're on to something.

4/3/2006 2:40:53 PM

Do more research, that huge jump was on Stern alone and it wouldn't luck so large if Sirius had a real customer base to speak of anyway. It isn't like sat. can keep adding these guys and keep making numbers jump, it doesn't work that way.

Sirius is also losing gobs of money. What is it to do? Raise subscription prices? Will those that jumped on the bandwagon for Stern stay on when the cost to hear him goes up? He isn't nearly as interesting when he has free reign to curse and be explicit without FCC fear like before, and that was part of his allure.

Quote :

"but when i see my near retired afraid-of-technology dad using, and loving sirius i know they're on to something."

I can find anecdotal cases for everything. You probably set it all up and showed him how to use it too.

4/3/2006 2:53:22 PM

Quote :

"Sirius is also losing gobs of money. What is it to do? "

sure, sirius and xm are both losing tons of money. but if you do some simple math, with constant subscriber growth they'll be in the black where they'll stay. many companies have to make growth vs profit strategic decisions. that have sacrificed profits to continue substantial growth. it won't always be that way.

Quote :

"and it wouldn't luck so large if Sirius had a real customer base to speak of anyway."

you're right, 3.3 million subscribers is crap for such a young company

Quote :

"You probably set it all up and showed him how to use it too. "

incorrect assumption, he does read instructions fairly well. he actually had it for a few weeks before i heard anything about it.

and whats that about the analysts?
http://finance.yahoo.com/q/ao?s=SIRI

[Edited on April 3, 2006 at 3:25 PM. Reason : ]

4/3/2006 3:24:22 PM

speaking of, i have a kenwood sirius tuner and kenwood antenna i'm looking to sell for $25

/stuff that should be in classifieds

4/3/2006 5:16:53 PM

Quote :

"with constant subscriber growth they'll be in the black where they'll stay."

http://techdirt.com/articles/20060511/0944239.shtml

Not so constant, eh?

5/11/2006 3:17:00 PM

its kind of sad that you brought back a thread from over a month ago so you could pwnt someone

5/11/2006 6:50:27 PM

I'm not sure what is sadder. You being completely fucking off base about why I added to the thread or...

yea, I win.

[Edited on May 11, 2006 at 8:28 PM. Reason : x]

5/11/2006 8:27:49 PM

synapse, your problem is that you see satellite radio as satellite radio. They are much more than that. I would prefer the term "national digital radio". Reason being that they are not averse to using the Internet to broadcast their programming. As of now, the only such technologically feasible medium is the satellites. In the future, it could be the Internet, but XM and Sirius both are already proving more Internet radio stations than satellite. In the end, programming will win. Satellite or Internet are just the carriers.

Internet radio as it is currently is not progressive. Who do you blame for bad programming? Is there someone you can trust? XM/Sirius are all that and more.

5/11/2006 9:08:53 PM

I honestly can't understand what the fuck you just said, and I'm not trolling.

Quote :

"As of now, the only such technologically feasible medium is the satellites."

What? To do what?

Quote :

"In the future, it could be the Internet, but XM and Sirius both are already proving more Internet radio stations than satellite."

Did you mean "providing"?

Quote :

"Internet radio as it is currently is not progressive. Who do you blame for bad programming?"

What the hell are you talking about "not progressive"?

Quote :

"Is there someone you can trust? XM/Sirius are all that and more."

Again, god damn. What the fuck are you talking about?

5/11/2006 9:12:57 PM

just ignore Chance when it comes to anything that requires a brain.

5/11/2006 9:17:50 PM

sattelite can get radio to cars...wireless intarweb cannot at the time (unless using a sattelite heh). methinks that was the point.

[Edited on May 11, 2006 at 9:24 PM. Reason : on wide scale]

5/11/2006 9:24:28 PM

I pretty much knew you were going to reply with that gargadouche. If you were confident that you could actually explain what you were trying to say in clear English, you'd clarify yourself.


^ ummm, mobile broadband != satellite. It might not be quite quick enough to stream 128 or 192kbps shoutcast streams, but I think it could do 32-64 and higher rates are just around the corner anyway.

[Edited on May 11, 2006 at 9:34 PM. Reason : x]

5/11/2006 9:29:05 PM

gtfo of America, Chancy

5/11/2006 9:29:56 PM

I

5/11/2006 10:02:34 PM

WIN

5/11/2006 11:02:59 PM

why cant their just be a giant wifi network above america and internet costs like 5 bucks each

5/12/2006 1:11:39 AM

bump per request

2/20/2007 3:43:29 PM

I don't care good terrestrial digital radio gets. I still don't want to hear the "drive at five" or the same dumbass dj's spinning the same tired overplayed songs. I have satellite because I like the choices, the content and it has none of the bullshit.

2/20/2007 3:59:00 PM

I agree. Fuck the shitty morning zoos and the same Top 40 stations and channels.

To speak about the variety on satellite music stations, I regularly record XM's Squizz, and then listen to it later on my Nexus while on the job at work. Whats great is that I had about 20 hours of programming, and was shocked how little fucking repeating they had. Many of the songs had only been played once, with a few hitting 2 or 3 times. Think that would happen on testicle radio? Fuck no. You'd have the same Nickelback song 10 times. Green Day probably 8 times. Chili Peppers 7 times. Shit like that. This is why I'm a diehard fan of satellite radio.

2/20/2007 6:15:59 PM

You know, XM and Sirius maybe merging if the FCC allows it, so no more choosing which one to subscribe too. Would definately make satellite radio be more viable.

http://www.bizjournals.com/buffalo/stories/2007/02/19/daily11.html

2/20/2007 6:53:19 PM

^^
I actually did as my semester project for one of my classes. A specific large company published their playlists online for some of their radio stations, the true format of which was an XML file. I was able to collect about a month's worth of playlist data from 400 radio stations across the US (roughly 1/3 total). The lack of diversity and the number of repeats was scary.

Anyways, I see in 20-30 years traditional radio needing to change their business models if they are going to survive. Record companies were a bit unfortunate and got blindsided by some college kid wrecking the way they did business; they've had 10 years to change for the better and still haven't for the most part. I hope traditional radio doesn't make the same mistake ... I'd hate to see it die.

[Edited on February 20, 2007 at 8:21 PM. Reason : .]

2/20/2007 8:20:12 PM

I haven't listen to normal radio in a very long time. I never listen for stupid shows or pathetic music playlists that plays the same damn nickleback song ever 10 mins. I listen to cds in my car when I do drive it, but I mainly ride my bike and I'll listen to the music of 105bhp engine screaming past other motorists. Music to my ears.

And I totally agree with the music industry is still playing catch up, even though they've had ample amount of time to do so. If a satellite radio service was incorporated into an mp3 player as small, nimble, and user friendly as an ipod, I'd definately buy it and sign up for the monthly service too. Wasn't there an mp3 player that had that feature and you could save any song and download it to listen to it later? I forgot the name of it now.

2/20/2007 9:18:29 PM

Quote :

"Many of the songs had only been played once, with a few hitting 2 or 3 times. Think that would happen on testicle radio? Fuck no."

i'm not the biggest knc fan, but they rarely play two songs by the same band in a 24 hr period, let alone the same song by the same band in a day.

2/20/2007 9:31:30 PM

College radio doesn't fucking count, as it is not a real business and not a real competitior.

Whats ironic when you talk about playlists and local content is that groups like Clear Channel, who claim that they represent local variety and satellite threatens to kill this, are basically using the same half dozen playlists on 2000 radio stations, with no local flavor, except for the advertising. Hell many of the morning shows locally are dead, replaced with nationally syndicated crap.

As for Satrad and MP3 players, both companies have these. Some of these play satellite radio live. The Stiletto on Sirius and the Inno and several others play XM live. I have a 1 gig Nexus that can record XM content but doesn't play live when its not in my truck. I can also load it with mp3s from home if I want too. I ended up spending $49.99 for this on Black Friday 2006.

2/21/2007 6:39:35 AM