i was writing a paper on the book "We" and came across this speach.

http://freespace.virgin.net/pep.talk/Bland.htm

this dude is out there...

discuss

11/20/2006 1:16:34 AM

Quote :

"I honour Stalin as a great progressive figure who struggled all his life for the ending of the capitalist and imperialist system which is the cause each year of the misery and death of countless millions of men, women and children, especially in the neo-colonial world. I honour Stalin as one who struggled all his life for the greatest cause in the world - the liberation of mankind. "

These two lines are so sad that they break my heart. If only we could implant this guy into Russia during Stalin's reign.

Anyway, it sounds like the guy is just utterly infatuated with ending capitalism, and he's willing to justify it in any way. For instance, his statistic about an increase in manufacturing output is useless without base rates and even if it had base rates, it would not explain how much went into manufacturing inputs. If we throw every last societal dime into manufacturing and it goes up by +200%, it means less than if we simply made a few investments and the productivity gains had the same effect.

11/20/2006 7:46:37 AM

Quote :

"Indeed, it is an undisputed fact under the centrally planned economy instituted under Stalin, Russia was transformed in a few decades from a backward agrarian country into an advanced industrial country"

As much as we want to this result is not really in dispute. It is not surprising that the threat and application of force can effectively run an economy. The problem under later soviet leaders was an inability to incentivise good socialist behavior from the various classes (prevent hoarding, prevent price riots, prevent laziness, etc). However, this was not a problem under Stalinist Russia: these activities warranted the death penalty. So, many have argued, if Stalin-like successors had been put in charge the soviet economy should have performed much better than it did, potentially giving corrupt and unstable capitalist states a run for their money (Italy, Spain, Mexico, etc).

What is certain, however, is if the monarchy had survived WW1 (such as by staying out of it) and continued to pursue constitutional reforms (a miracle in and of itself) then using other recently free states at the turn of the century (Japan is one) then Russia would have industrialized quite a bit faster than it did for several reasons: 1. it would have killed fewer citizens (including capable business men and engineers) 2. it could have drawn on western investment and trade 3. it would not have suffered from systemic miss-management prevalent even under Stalin (sacrificing food production in pursuit of substandard industrial goods).

[Edited on November 20, 2006 at 10:27 AM. Reason : .,.]

11/20/2006 10:21:06 AM

he was a great leader in the sense that he got a lot accomplished, pretty much rebuilt the soviet union after the war.

but at too high of a cost and facing the wrong direction.

11/20/2006 10:24:04 AM

Quote :

"which is the cause each year of the misery and death of countless millions of men, women and children, especially in the neo-colonial world."

just ignore the 20 million he 'purged' from the ussr.....

Quote :

"he was a great leader in the sense that he got a lot accomplished, pretty much rebuilt the soviet union after the war."

correct, that's the best you can say about him though

Quote :

"Indeed, it is an undisputed fact under the centrally planned economy instituted under Stalin, Russia was transformed in a few decades from a backward agrarian country into an advanced industrial country"

not really, he just jump started the creation of some industry from practically none, however the vast majority of russians where still 'peasents' throughout stalins reign


[Edited on November 20, 2006 at 11:13 AM. Reason : best]

11/20/2006 11:10:34 AM

Quote :

"But, we are told, the people of the former Soviet Union are now ‘free’. - free to be unemployed; if they are lucky enough to have a job, free to go months without wages because their employer’s bank has gone into liquidation; free to buy Rolls-Royce cars if they happen to be Mafia millionaires; free to drink polluted water; free to be mugged in any side street for the equivalent of a few pennies."

this is the part that got me and its almost identical to D-503's beliefs in the book We.

11/20/2006 11:59:33 AM

11/21/2006 10:00:19 AM

All I give him credit for is saving the world and inventing the "Tom Selleck moustache"

besides that he was both a douchebag and an asshole

11/21/2006 10:19:20 AM

Stalin pretty much raped Lenin's idea of Russia and almost lost WWII for Russia.

He's not a very competent leader.

11/21/2006 10:31:16 AM