Is there anyway to promote additional growth in your puppy? He's already a little larger than average for his breed but I'd love to see him grow a bit more and add around 5-7lbs. He's obviously still growing somewhat (only 6 1/2 months old) but I was just wondering if there is anything that encourages additional growth. I give him supplemental vitamins every day, and someone told me to keep him on puppy food longer.

Am I being retarded, or is this logical?

1/16/2007 1:38:36 PM

damage the pituitary gland

1/16/2007 1:43:28 PM

thats just wrong

1/16/2007 1:47:27 PM

There's not really a healthy way to do this...maybe you shouldn't have gotten a shiba. If you keep them on puppy food too long it just makes them fat. Too much protein.

1/16/2007 3:51:26 PM

Ha, that's retarded. Dogs are supposed to be a certain size for a reason. Stretching it out will cause problems, weak bones, joint issues, organ problems. It's never a good idea to force something to do something it naturally should not.

1/16/2007 4:17:43 PM

Quote :

"Too much protein"

you mean too much fat, right?

1/16/2007 4:20:14 PM

Better question, is there a way to make kids grow bigger after they reach their estimated size?

No...so why would there be for dogs...

1/16/2007 4:21:49 PM

steriods always seem to do the trick

1/16/2007 4:46:35 PM

well he's on the big side of the breed, and the breeder said he might get to be around 35lbs. I think he's around 25 right now.

don't worry I won't do anything unhealthy to him. I'd just like him a little bigger, like the breeder said might happen.

1/16/2007 9:16:04 PM

just feed him as recommended for his breed, size, and activity level. Don't try to force him to grow too quickly. let him grow at his own rate. Don't keep him on puppy food once he is an adult. Adult dogs need different stuff than puppy. That is why there are different formulas for different age groups and dog size.

1/16/2007 10:15:50 PM

The healthiest way to get him to put on a little size is to probably encourage him to gain muscle mass by getting him to "work." You can get a little doggie back pack and load it down with some weight whenever you take him out on a walk or run. You can get him to pull wagons, haul things, etc. I don't know what your particular breed was built to do, but if you can harness his natural talents you'll certainly have a happier and healthier dog.

Keeping him on puppy food isn't going to be good for him.

[Edited on January 16, 2007 at 10:34 PM. Reason : damned L]

1/16/2007 10:16:46 PM

Quote :

"You can get him to pull wagons"

hahahaha

for a second i thought that i might have clicked on the "looking like a poor child in Nicaragua" thread

1/16/2007 10:24:56 PM

^Well...for an Akita that'd be gold, not so much for a Shiba. I'd recommend getting him a little pack (Petsmart, REI, online) and put not too heavy things in for him to carry on his regular walks (maybe a beanie baby in each side or something). I honestly don't think it'll help him get taller, but it will certainly make him well behaved and easy to get along with.

1/16/2007 10:38:09 PM

If you get some good suggestions, let me know.. cause I could stand to grow a few inches... puppy growth can't be that much different from human growth.

1/16/2007 11:24:42 PM

Keep him wormed. I wouldn't suggest you do this but some owners just like their animals on the healthy side. This however is Fact \/

Quote :

"Stretching it out will cause problems, weak bones, joint issues, organ problems"

But if you want your animal to gain lbs, just mix a little cat food in the dry dog food. I know it sounds crazy, but it's 100% safe. Cat food has more nutrients than dog food, and especially good for puppies. This came directly from my Vet, who has 30 yrs in the business so I did not make it up.

1/17/2007 12:26:10 AM

pat, did you buy one of those little ankle-biter dogs.

you should get a real man's dog.

btw where the hell does he shit? i thought you live in the middle of NYC

[Edited on January 17, 2007 at 12:43 AM. Reason : l]

1/17/2007 12:42:08 AM

anyone ask what the point of getting him bigger would be?

1/17/2007 1:11:51 AM

you can't encourage a dog to grow more than is already set out in their dna. a breed offers a slight range of weights and body types, depending on the quality of breeding, but unless you are looking for an overweight or undernourished dog, don't try to tinker with his size. his adult weight will be what it was meant to be, whether you like it or not. just feed him properly and make sure he gets the right amount of exercise. If you DO get a doggie backpack, don't weigh it down with more than 7-10% of his current body weight and make sure it distributes the weight over his shoulders, not his spine.

If you feed him a quality dog food there isn't necessarily any need for supplemental vitamins. You can add some salmon oil to his food to promote healthy and itch-free skin.

just fyi, you don't HAVE to feed the dog puppy food. Canidae offers an all life stages food that you can feed your dog from puppy to adulthood. In larger breeds, you actually want the dog to grow SLOWER and consequently you want a food that is lower in protein...fast growth IS bad on still developing joints. I know shibas are a small breed, but again, just fyi.

I'd love for my dog to hit 80 but that extra 8 pounds isn't healthy for her. She's strong, energetic, and has a beautiful coat. I feed her timberwolf organics.

1/17/2007 6:35:56 AM

Quote :

"But if you want your animal to gain lbs, just mix a little cat food in the dry dog food. I know it sounds crazy, but it's 100% safe. Cat food has more nutrients than dog food, and especially good for puppies. This came directly from my Vet, who has 30 yrs in the business so I did not make it up."

I really wish Earl would just die. I don't think I've ever seen a good suggestion from him. DO NOT do this. Cat and dog food are VERY different and should NEVER be cross fed. I cannot stress this enough. Talk to an animal nutritionist at State if you want to know the details. Yeesh. Is this the same vet who taught you how to crop and dock dogs yourself or whatever?

1/17/2007 7:16:27 AM

Eating cat food will make your dog fat. My mom started feeding one of the out door cats indoors and didn't take the food up, so my Shih Tzu started chowing down on cat food. It didn't take more than two weeks for him to chunk up. Don't feed him cat food.

1/17/2007 8:33:02 AM

Dogs should stay on puppy food at least a year, some breeds it is recommended they stay on it up to 2yrs.

1/17/2007 9:41:31 AM

and you also gotta remember pat that even if he's going to be 35 lbs, he probably won't max that out until he's 2 or 3 years old. sabrina has JUST stopped growing and she's right around 40 lbs, but looking at her you wouldn't be able to tell b/c she's been the same size since she was about 1-1.5 yrs old, she's just been filling out as she matures, but now she's done.

1/17/2007 9:44:15 AM

i can see pat snuggling with something like this

1/17/2007 11:49:26 AM

My vet recommended that I keep my dog on puppy food fo 6 months. Actually now I am feeding my dog high quality food that is safe for puppies and dogs. It's called Canidae, expensive but it lacks perservatives and foods that dogs cannot digest.

1/17/2007 12:34:34 PM

^That's cause she's a Papillon probably, they really don't take as long to grow as bigger breeds.

1/17/2007 12:57:05 PM

Quote :

"pat, did you buy one of those little ankle-biter dogs. you should get a real man's dog. btw where the hell does he shit? i thought you live in the middle of NYC"

If you and Shultz weren't such morons maybe a click into my profile would show you what kind of dog I have

And where does the dog shit? are you kidding?!

Yeah, I suppose I should just figure how long they normally grow. I've been told this breed can live to be 20, so he probably will continue to grow for another year at least

[Edited on January 17, 2007 at 1:08 PM. Reason : k]

1/17/2007 1:07:31 PM

Trade him in for a new one. I keep trying to convince my parents to get rid of the worthless Golden Retriever and get a real one. No luck so far..

^ It must shit on the street because surely there can't be any grass in NYC.

[Edited on January 17, 2007 at 1:11 PM. Reason : x]

1/17/2007 1:09:17 PM

hahaha

1/17/2007 1:11:06 PM

wow . . JSnail is the only one really offering sound advice.
It is unecessary to give your dogs vitamins . . it gets all it needs from the dog food - it has to according to AAFCO standards.
DO NOT FEED THE DOG CAT FOOD. Dogs and cats have different nutritional standards, that is why they have dog and cat food and not just "pet food".
If you keep the dog on puppy food longer it will just grow out, not up (= fat). A dog should not be on puppy food for more than the first year of it's life.

I'm honestly not trying to sound like a jerk, but why would you want your dog to get bigger? Shiba's are cute little fiesty dogs like they are, why not just try and keep it the healthiest that it can be. It would be alot more satisfying

1/17/2007 1:15:31 PM

^ there is new dog fighting league in NYC. The weight limit is 35 pounds. A 25 pound Shiba would stand no chance in that weight group. He needs to pack on a bit of muscle to compete with the mutts.

1/17/2007 1:19:15 PM

^I really hope you're kidding

1/17/2007 1:20:14 PM

^^Bryan I told you that in confidence.

Its b/c I'd prefer a slightly larger dog. Hence why I picked the biggest of the litter. I guess I should just be patient

1/17/2007 1:21:49 PM

Like the Guns and Roses song?

1/17/2007 1:28:09 PM

right...be patient. good idea.

1/17/2007 3:43:00 PM

yeah...just be patient

and thanks Troop

1/17/2007 6:43:23 PM

Lutra My god what is your deal with me? You just act like you know everything and I'm always wrong. No, this is NOT the same vet b/c I never asked a PROFESSIONAL VET about me performing the ear crop operation.

Yes the vet at Oberlin road told me it was safe to do that. Read the ingredients on the back of a can of cat food. What does it include that isn't safe for a DOG to eat? I guess that you would object iguanas eating cat food also? Or baby lions drinking goats milk? Stop being so disrespectful towards me because of your MISUNDERSTANDING. You simply are wrong in this case. Why don't you simply call a vet and ask, if you don't believe me?

[Edited on January 17, 2007 at 6:56 PM. Reason : /]

1/17/2007 6:55:36 PM

Baby lions should not drink goat's milk. They need milk from their own mother. All milk is not the same, and certain animals need different amounts of sugar, fat and protein. That's a little off-topic, but thought I'd add that imput.

Anyways, I can't believe that vets would actually tell people to feed cat food to dogs!

1/17/2007 7:29:02 PM

Quote :

"Baby lions should not drink goat's milk."

I guess you never watched animal planet huh? I watched an episode yesterday about a guy raising a black leopard and fed it "puppy milk". Nutrients are nutrients!! What is wrong with you people. Vets do this all the time. I can't believe you're acting as if this is something Extraordinary

These are animals, not humans. They can eat nearly anything!

1/17/2007 7:42:21 PM

yep. but notice I said "should not" not "could not"

Quote :

"These are animals, not humans. They can eat nearly anything!""

What, again, makes humans different? I've seen humans eat all sort of things...and we drink cows milk!



[Edited on January 17, 2007 at 7:54 PM. Reason : !]

1/17/2007 7:44:16 PM

How about "WHY NOT"?

How about "How could it hurt"?

1/17/2007 7:45:04 PM

funny thing, we talked about this in animal nutrition today. For the reason I said above.

1/17/2007 7:46:53 PM

http://www.healthypet.com/faq_view.aspx?ID=49&sid=1

It's not that it won't "hurt them", it's just a way to beef them up if they suffer from malnutrition. This is not something you do on a regular baisis, let me clarify that. Breeder do diet tricks all the time to 'better' certain aspects of their animals. For example, they feed it different foods to 'make the coat prettier' or toughen the foot pads and strengthen muscles. Just like humans do.

1/17/2007 7:53:27 PM

Alright Earl, what Puppy is trying to say is that every animal has different percentages of composition of fat, protein, and milk sugar. Goat milk is composed 3.1% casein, 3.5% fat, 4.4% lactose. I couldn't find anything on lions off hand, so I'll use cat milk composition: 10.6% casein, 10.8% fat 3.7% lactose. Dogs are 9.5% fat, 7.5% casein, 3.8 lactose. If you've had a course in nutrition you'll remember that protein is used as the building blocks in the growing animal and that the fat and sugar are energy. Lions have a lot more growing to do than a goat, relatively speaking.

Giving milk from another species won't hurt it necessarily, but the effect of it being malnourished or receiving too much of one thing can lead to other health concern during its development.

1/17/2007 8:04:36 PM

^I understood what she was trying to say. I was initially rebutting a statement that Lutra had made about me. And I understand that some animals have different chemical balance percentages.

My main point was that it is not ALIEN for a species to get nutrients from different food sources. Like the article said "dogs are omnivorous" so they can eat cat food. I never said for the animal to "live" off cat food. Puppies need more nutrients in some cases and reg puppy food dosn't have it. It is okay to supplement, for a brief time, cat food with dry dog food. The 'smell' alone stimulates eating habbits in puppies who aren't use to eating dry dog food. Canned dog food is normally not healthy for puppies, b/c it gives them runs'.

1/17/2007 8:37:05 PM

my god the stupidity in this thread is amazing.

just feed the dog the appropriate amount of food according the bag for his age and weight. dogs aren't done growing til 2-3 years old so just give him some time.

just like people and other animals, individual dogs have their individual max height/weight/etc. feeding them more fat, more protein, more food is not going to make them bigger than they are supposed to be except in a bad way. your dog will be fat/overweight/obese/etc.

and just like people and other animals, if you want your dog to gain muscle, get him to exercise. run with him, have him pull something, etc.

keeping him on puppy food longer will just add more weight as fat. get him working, then feed him higher protein DOG food. not cat food. cat food is more expensive per unit anyway.

jesus christ no wonder the majority of america is fat.


long story short: more food =/= bigger dog in a healthy way

1/17/2007 10:34:05 PM

I guess I worded this thread horribly.

I really meant to ask what to do to make sure whatever potential he has is fully reached. And it would seem that I am doing that.

Thanks, and let this die now

1/17/2007 11:46:38 PM

^ x 8 & 9 the main thing is starting a baby what ever it is on the mothers milk. usually w/ in the first 3 days there is a lot of colostrum (sp?) in the milk. this boost the immune system of that species gives anit bodies that the mother has.

1/18/2007 12:34:17 AM

Quote :

"iguanas eating cat food "

Quote :

"my god the stupidity in this thread is amazing. "

iguana's are herbivores. mine eats a salad everyday.


and to reiterate- no, don't feed dogs cat food. dogs are not true carnivores such as cats. they have slightly similar but DIFFERENT digestive systems and nutritional needs.

do you have have an animal science degree? a nutritional degree? ever worked in a vet? ever worked with animals beyond any personal pets?



how do you spell Moron?



btw Patrick - cute puppy and it's not a dumb question. just feed the dog premium dog food and make sure he gets plenty of exercise and he'll ne healthy and reach his potential size. I wouldn't do anything out of the ordinary.

[Edited on January 18, 2007 at 9:32 AM. Reason : why do i bother]

1/18/2007 9:31:54 AM

who are you talking to?

1/18/2007 9:34:13 AM

I'm not getting in a debate with you Earl. Every animal related thing you have uttered on tdub has gone against everything I have ever learned in Biology and Animal Science. I would be happy to give you the name of an animal nutritionist at State. And I asked for the name and title of the person who told you about dog and cat food, you have yet to give me that (and no, I do not consider a website to be the end all be all of animal resources).

That said, no, your dog/cat will not instantly die if they eat the others food. However, they should not eat each others food if at all possible. They both have very different nutritional requirements that will not be met if they eat primarily the other's food.

[Edited on January 18, 2007 at 10:06 AM. Reason : I'm out]

1/18/2007 10:01:40 AM