Should the law giving automatic citizenship to anyone born in the US be repealed?

4/30/2007 10:55:20 PM

against

4/30/2007 11:00:11 PM

Against. Unless it applies to everyone, including people with american parents. Make everyone earn that shit like immigrants.

4/30/2007 11:01:34 PM

No, it shouldn't be.

4/30/2007 11:01:40 PM

4/30/2007 11:20:55 PM

I think it needs to be amended. Like you can't sneak across the border illegally and give birth for the sake of having them a citizen. That sort of amendment.

4/30/2007 11:33:37 PM

^ I don't think it needs to be amended. Just chage the imigration laws so that if you're staying due to connection with a current US citizen, that person must be 18+

4/30/2007 11:52:02 PM

leave it the same with the exception that if you are born while your mother is in the country illegally, then you don't get citizenship.

5/1/2007 12:31:46 AM

^ What would be the point of doing that? It would do absolutely nothing in terms of fixing any problems related to illegal immigration.

5/1/2007 12:49:27 AM

How about enforce the laws we already have so it wouldn't need to be amended/repealed?

5/1/2007 2:59:56 AM

How about we start letting a reasonable number of folks come in legally?

5/1/2007 3:09:39 AM

last i checked. you don't get citizenship just because your child is born in the US. it doesn't work that way anymore. Your child gets it but you don't

5/1/2007 4:13:25 AM

So enjoy foster care...and get the fuck over it. No sympathy.

5/1/2007 4:34:47 AM

No need to change the law. You just enforce it. If an illegal "drops anchor" here, give them 2 options only. 1. take your kid with you when you are deported, or 2. your kid will be placed, and you will be deported. Its thier choice. If we had the balls to do this and fight the aclu, this might actually stop alot of this. However, I see no way this happens.

5/1/2007 9:21:46 AM

If only we had the balls to fuck over women and children who are making Americans wealthier (&*#$&(*


God some of you are fucking idiots.

5/1/2007 9:25:38 AM

^if by fucking over you mean obeying the law, I agree with you.

5/1/2007 9:29:31 AM

Way to be one step behind in thinking, as usual. The law is obviously wrong.

5/1/2007 9:38:11 AM

yeah that whole sovereign nation thing is overrated. We clearly dont need borders or immigration laws. Just one big happy free for all.

5/1/2007 9:49:24 AM

Quote :

"f we had the balls to do this and fight the aclu,"

what in the world does the aclu have to do with this?

5/1/2007 10:07:43 AM

You know the aclu would jump all over this, if we "split families". Its a decision that the parents make. If they knew that they wouldnt be able to stay in the US with thier anchor baby, or would just have to take thier baby back to mexico, you basically take away the incentive for coming in illegal, at least one avenue.

5/1/2007 10:13:37 AM

so you made it up. ok.

5/1/2007 10:17:05 AM

you can call it more of an assumption. I cant show you any evidence bc they arent doing what I suggested. I base this assumption on the fact that the ACLU is fighting for illegals rights NOW. Ironic isnt it.

5/1/2007 10:23:32 AM

Quote :

"If only we had the balls to fuck over women and children who are making Americans wealthier (&*#$&(*"

I fail to see how we're fucking someone over. They fucked themselves over when they broke the law. The parents came here illegaly, which also means they have no right to stay here. The child, as a consequence of being born here is a US citizen, which means he is entitled to stay in the US. Therefore, when the parents are caught, their options are to leave and take their child with them (leaving them in the same situation they have always been in, except now INS isn't looking for them) or the child stays in foster care (thus enjoying his bennefits of being a US citizen) and the parents are rightfuly deported.

Look I strongly feel that we need to seriously reconsider our imigration policies, but if you break the law, you shouldn't get a pass just because you're a mommy.

5/1/2007 10:45:03 AM

^^how in the world is that ironic? and as far as i know, the aclu works within the laws of the united states as they stand.

5/1/2007 11:20:28 AM

^ The irony is in the assumption that "we the people" applies to non-citizens. If your reading is that the constitution is meant to protect only American citizens, then it's ironic.

Whereas the apparent position of the ACLU is that those rights apply, in their totality, to anyone who happens to be standing on US soil at any given time. (And arguments to the contrary are insinuating not that illegal immigrants are "non-citizens" but "non-people"... which would directly contradict with their reading of the document)

I'm gonna say that the law as it stands is sound, but that the expected level of education for born citizens and naturalized citizens about the government should be the same. (Or maybe even a higher expectation for those born into the system)

5/1/2007 11:27:23 AM

you have no idea about what the aclu actually does do you?

5/1/2007 11:29:50 AM

^ Are you talking to me or the guy above? I know a great deal about what the ACLU does. My point was that the reason he sees their work as ironic is based on who he feels basic human rights apply to under the constitution.

5/1/2007 11:34:10 AM

Quote :

"Look I strongly feel that we need to seriously reconsider our imigration policies, but if you break the law, you shouldn't get a pass just because you're a mommy."

You should get a pass because the law is stupid.

5/1/2007 11:40:56 AM

Good posts honkeyball(like the name too). I find it ironic that the AMERICAN civil liberities union is fighting to protect the rights of mexican nationals in this country illegally, and fighting to keep them here.

5/1/2007 11:41:18 AM

Quote :

"I'm gonna say that the law as it stands is sound, but that the expected level of education for born citizens and naturalized citizens about the government should be the same. (Or maybe even a higher expectation for those born into the system)"

we should have tests to see which citizens are eligible to vote too. we see how well that has worked out in the past.

^the aclu represents people who they feel have been slighted under the current laws. for instance you can look at the aclu's website, they have a whole section on immigration. one of the stories is about children of illegal immigrants kept in what they describe as prison-like conditions. they are representing them because they feel that violates precedent already set about minimal conditions for the detention of children.

5/1/2007 11:46:01 AM

I didn't mention a test. I'm talking about education reform.

5/1/2007 11:53:06 AM

i think the federal gov't noses around in education too much as it is.

5/1/2007 11:56:23 AM

^something we agree on. I think the govt noses around in too much as is. My question about detaining children, why not deport them? Why are we "holding" them? Im at work, ill read more on their website later.

5/1/2007 12:00:22 PM

I also didn't mention federal. I agree, it's a local issue, but an issue nonetheless.

5/1/2007 12:00:43 PM

sarijoul, I read this article from the ACLU website. http://www.aclu.org/immigrants/detention/hutto.html

It appears my assumption wasnt very far off. From the article,
"The lawsuits ask that the children are released and not separated from their families,"

This article also makes my opinion of the aclu even less than it was.


"In addition, access to adequate medical, dental, and mental health treatment is severely limited"
Oh noes, so because you are hear illegally you somehow have a right to these? None of which are a right.

They point out that the kids/families are being treated like they are in prison. Why would that be? Maybe bc they broke the law? Thier parents put them in that situation, its that simple. And they fight to release the children and not seperate them from family. So we are just supposed to let them go bc they have a kid? WTF kind of deterent is that. I guess I could rob a bank as long as I have a kid? Esp if i was trying to provide a better life?

5/1/2007 12:33:38 PM

I think the Mexicans are going to win so theres no use debating it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GIW-BZ8oLrk

5/1/2007 12:51:26 PM

Nothing like being slowly invaded by another country, and having half of the country loving it

5/1/2007 1:21:42 PM

man those immigrants have sure been a pain in the past. the irish, the poles, the italians. what good have they done our country?

5/1/2007 2:13:36 PM

^ None of their invasions were nearly as pervasive as the current influx of straw men.

5/1/2007 2:20:32 PM

are you trying to imply that what i said was a straw man?

5/1/2007 2:22:34 PM

To be fair, there weren't as many Poles, Italians, whoever coming in such numbers so quickly... and you know... illegally.

NPR had a blurb this morning about illegals holing up in churches to avoid being deported. The woman that they interviewed had been working at O'Hare with a stolen/false Social Security number (Go Airport Security!) and she was being deported because this is a federal crime from what I gathered. But it was like she was the victim, having to hole up in a church hoping ICE wouldn't come get her.

The thing that irks me the most is that these new a lot of this brand of immigrants come here illegally and don't think twice about breaking our laws. That is a major difference between now and a century ago.

5/1/2007 2:26:57 PM

^^ I'm implying that the comparison is apples to oranges. There are a multitude of factors at play here that complicate this situation far beyond industrial revolution era immigration from europe. Corporate interests, political interests with regards to possible future voters, a painfully stretched healthcare system, in many cases a failing education system, many labor camps & farms with substandard living conditions & wages, and on and on...

And before you respond, I'm not blaming any one person (or for that matter, immigrants) for any of these issues, but they are all impacted by, and have to be considered with regards to the current immigration situation.

5/1/2007 2:40:24 PM

Quote :

"The thing that irks me the most is that these new a lot of this brand of immigrants come here illegally and don't think twice about breaking our laws."

there's no good way for most of them to come here legally. that's the difference.

also, per capita, there was more immigration into the united states in the late 1800s and early 1900s than there is now.

5/1/2007 2:45:11 PM

So they come here illegally, ok fine. But then they commit fraud by procuring false documents(SS Cards/#s, Drivers Liscences, etc), They are also never insured (auto), which causes tons of problems and headaches even if they are at fault.

Total immigration may be the same per capita, but last century the immigration was from wide variety of countries. Where as now, the vast majority of illegals come from one country. Thus, assimilation will take longer and be more difficult. (Not to mention the fact that we have no clue how many illegals we actually have in the US.)

It is highly unfair to those in other countries(in Africa, Asia, Europe) that want to immigrate here legally. Just because you can run the border doesn't mean you should have the right to be here. Citizenship isn't a human right.

5/1/2007 3:03:51 PM

i wouldn't call 25% a "vast majority". just because you can't tell the difference between different latin american countries doesn't make them all the same.

5/1/2007 3:09:02 PM

Quote :

"Citizenship isn't a human right."

Freedom of movement is.

5/1/2007 3:10:13 PM

^^and this comes from here:

http://tinyurl.com/2frp43

[Edited on May 1, 2007 at 3:11 PM. Reason : ^^]

5/1/2007 3:11:44 PM

^ You are joking right? Did you actually read the link/reference? Tell me, is that legal or illegal immigration? Illegal = Undocumented.

Quote :

"Freedom of movement is"

So I am free to move into your house? Right.... Freedom of movement between two sovereign states is NOT a basic human right.

5/1/2007 3:19:59 PM

lots of welfare programs in the late 1800s. Major difference. Many come here to work, other come to get paid not to.

5/1/2007 3:20:29 PM

everyone's an immigrant what's the big fucking deal. My family came here from somewhere else and so did yours.....get the fuck over it

5/1/2007 3:20:54 PM