a new job has finally given me enough money so that i don't feel guilty or irresponsible purchasing an old(er) diesel car/truck/suv/whatever to be my "experimental" vehicle

i want (like many other people) to turn it into a veggie car...i already have a very fuel efficient gasoline car that i use for everyday travel...part of me wants to get something SUV-like to turn into a veggie car, simply because i find myself wishing i had a bit more room sometimes, but it's not something i need on a regular basis

other than the requirement of it being diesel, here's what i'd like:
- manual transmission
- "larger" vehicle - wagon or SUV (though something SUV-sized/style is preferable)
- reliable
- under $2000

any suggestions would be appreciated!

8/11/2007 5:18:17 PM

benz wagon
volvo wagon
1st gen. cummins dodge
6.9/7.3 idi navistar ford

you'll be hard pressed to find a diesel suv. the only thing i can think of off hand that was sold with any regularity here is a 1st gen. isuzu trooper. even at that, they're pretty hard to find. you've got excursions of course, but those are WAY out of your price range.

edit: i completely forgot about the 6.2 detroit k5 blazers and suburbans. i think one of those is going to be your best bet if you're set on an suv. they're a dog of a motor as far as power, but decent enough otherwise. they're fairly common also.

[Edited on August 11, 2007 at 5:48 PM. Reason : .]

8/11/2007 5:43:35 PM

even the wagons are out of his price range

8/11/2007 5:44:36 PM

http://raleigh.craigslist.org/car/392144973.html

8/11/2007 5:46:27 PM

i have an 85 300D benz it is sweet. not for sale. but the benz desiel turbos are fun cars to have.

8/11/2007 5:48:50 PM

Quote :

"even at that, they're pretty hard to find. "

How about nigh fucking impossible to find a diesel Trooper? The only year you can find the diesel option with any regularity is '86, and even then, finding one that someone is willing to part with (they really have a cult following, and the folks who own them rarely want to sell them). The big problems? The turbos on them may be a problem area, as few folks knew how to properly care for a turbocharger when these things came out. They absolutely MUST be idled for a couple of minutes before shutting down if you've been running them at load; otherwise, the turbo heat-soaks the lube oil that's left in the bearing cartridge, turning it into an insoluble carbon deposit...called "coking" the oil. Otherwise, Isuzu builds to this day some of the finest diesels on the planet, so if you find a turbodiesel Trooper in good shape with a good turbo and selling for a good price, go for it. That goes for any chevy Luv or Isuzu P'up diesel in decent shape (and none of these have turbos, so that's one less thing to worry about).

I like any of the older Volkswagen diesels. They're all based on the same platform (the diesel Vanagon actually uses the same engine as all the others, except it lays down on its side and hooks up to a traditional Vanagon transmission), and many folks will attest to their mechanical reliability. Volkswagen, however, couldn't engineer a decent electrical system until the mid '80s, so beware there.

I actually like the 6.2L diesel GM trucks, back when the 6.2 was actually built by Detroit (before GM sold the Detroit division to Penske). They are pretty fucking anemic but if you don't beat them to death, they get great fuel mileage and will last a long time. And they use an industry staple Stanadyne/Roosa Master injection pump.

The Navistar 6.9/7.3 engines in the Fords up to '93 are good engines with a long history. The Stanadyne injection pump is infinitely more reliable than the HEUI setup that Navistar adopted for the Powerstroke, and any shop can rebuild one. The big things to watch out for are breaking head bolts on the 6.9 and cavitation issues with the 7.3 cooling system that result in eroding the cylinder walls on the rearmost cylinders if the system has not been carefully maintained with quality coolant and a corrosion inhibitor/anti-cavitation additive.

Dodge? You know I love my Cummins, but the rest of the truck is a hunk of shit. The Cummins is, in my opinion, the finest diesel you'll find in a light truck. They all use Bosch injection pumps and components, but the years to get are '94 to early '98 (12 valve engines), as they have the rock-solid Bosch P7100 inline injection pump. The earlier ones ('89 to '93) use the Bosch VE pump, which can be reliable but requires that you use a lubricating additive with the advent of the low-sulphur and ultra-low-sulphur diesel fuels. The P7100 actually uses engine oil for lubrication, while the VE relies on the fuel itself for lubrication. Later model Dodges came with several computer-controlled injection systems, but the earliest (I think from late '98 to '01 or so) was the VP44 system from Bosch, and the pump tends to be a trouble spot.

Any Mercedes is excellent, as long as it's been maintained properly. I think that the 240D with a manual tranny is the way to go, even though it's a pig-slow car. No turbo to give problems (remember, early turbos often suffer from lack of proper care), and the automatics in a lot of the diesel cars gave more problems.

8/11/2007 7:39:58 PM

you are the man.

a lot of the old MB diesels are slower than they have to be because there is a lot of lost motion in the throttle linkage due to the linkage bushings wearing out. but dont expect any miracles when you replace them, the cars are still slow pigs from the era where 65mph was blazing fast.

8/11/2007 7:54:11 PM

/thread

[Edited on August 11, 2007 at 7:54 PM. Reason : ^^]

8/11/2007 7:54:14 PM

god knows, i miss you dan

heh...thanks for the tips...i've been wanting to do this for a while, but never gotten around to it

how do y'all feel about this? fixable? worth the effort? i realize looking at it first helps with estimations, but i'm willing to spend $1500 on fixing it up

http://raleigh.craigslist.org/car/382807793.html

[Edited on August 11, 2007 at 8:00 PM. Reason : .]

8/11/2007 7:58:00 PM

i wouldn't. sounds like it has "rebuild now" internal engine damage. i think you could find a newer (better) 300 model in good shape for what it'll cost you to get that one right.

8/11/2007 8:15:22 PM

benz wagon ftw...

8/11/2007 11:49:21 PM

Quote :

" I like any of the older Volkswagen diesels. They're all based on the same platform (the diesel Vanagon actually uses the same engine as all the others, except it lays down on its side and hooks up to a traditional Vanagon transmission), and many folks will attest to their mechanical reliability. Volkswagen, however, couldn't engineer a decent electrical system until the mid '80s, so beware there. "

There's your answer. If you can find an old Rabbit diesel, you can get em cheap and they run forever. Not only that, the parts aren't (from two buddies, one with a rabbit truck, one with a rabbit) nearly as expensive as an older MB model.

8/12/2007 3:56:07 AM

I was looking at MB wagons a while back. From what I saw, all the veggie greasers are driving the prices sky high on these things.

8/12/2007 1:57:14 PM

I saw a Luv diesel advertised on one of the NC craigslists this week. My neighbor had one that the body rusted away on but the drivetrain was very tough.

8/12/2007 5:20:12 PM

^have you ever seen a luv without the body rusted away?

8/13/2007 9:15:49 AM

i called about that it was $300 bux, turns out soem guys buddies were pulling a prank on him.

8/13/2007 9:22:28 AM

I'd still to this day like to own a TurboD Trooper.

8/13/2007 11:35:20 AM

Quote :

"volvo wagon"

That's one I would stay far, far away from. Volvo's gas burners from 15 to 35 years ago are nuke-proof (I had a 240DL), but that's nowhere close to the case with the relatively few diesel ones they made.

If it were me doing this, I'd spend a little more money and try to hunt up a clean 12-valve Cummins Dodge pickup with a manual transmission.

[Edited on August 13, 2007 at 11:53 AM. Reason : z]

8/13/2007 11:51:51 AM

^ didnt volvo use the VW diesel in their shit? that explains it.

8/13/2007 12:10:00 PM

^ except i don't need (or want) an engine that large...i'd like something with more room than a daily commuter, but with good fuel mileage as well...it seems like finding something SUV size will be nearly impossible, so something wagon-sized might be an option

8/13/2007 12:10:29 PM

Ricky...you could get the 6.2 diesel in the K-5 Blazer AND in the Suburban, but my guess is you definitely don't want anything that big. Those are pretty much the only older SUVs available in the U.S. with diesel engines (other than the aforementioned Isuzu Trooper)...and their mileage isn't exactly mind-blowing, even with an overdrive transmission (though much better than their gasoline counterparts).

Speaking of which, how's your dad's Suburban doing?

8/13/2007 1:09:02 PM

I had old Chevy pu with the 6.2 diesel. Mine was constantly on the rack...mostly from abuse and the 400K miles on the clock.

8/13/2007 1:41:40 PM

^^ yeah, i think i'll probably just go ahead and look for an old VW...as for the suburban, it's doing great...dad hasn't had any trouble with it recently (crossing fingers)...i'm convinced if anything DOES go wrong, he'd be willing to have it towed down to you to have it fixed

8/13/2007 2:06:57 PM

http://raleigh.craigslist.org/car/396876766.html

8/14/2007 2:12:49 PM

If you can, hold off for right now. Every owner of older diesels is trying to be an opportunist and listing their 250k mile Rabbit diesel for $4000k. They love to put something about "veggie oil" in the headline. 81-85 MB 300D Turbos that were doing $2000 a year ago are going for $4000 all day. I have seen fucking Rabbits for $4000, not kidding. Once the veggie oil craze dies down, these people who bought diesels in the current market are going to lose a lot of money. THAT SAID.......the MB diesels are the most driveable and liveable. The old VWs are just slow and loud. a 240d, especially with a manual trans, is a 500k mile car with max MPG. More liveable is the 300d Turbo, 81-85, which have good power. I could run 100mph in mine, and got high 20s (5cyl auto). These cars last forever and are comfortable daily drivers. But, again, good luck finding a good deal on one in the current market. Have it checked by a shop before you buy it. http://www.theforeignservice.com , local shop, charges about $100 for a full PPI.

8/18/2007 10:53:56 PM

thanks for all the advice...the "craze" has indeed jacked up prices, though i've wanted to do this for years, right after i met the guy who (originally) designed the veggie conversion...i can't remember his name (i could google it, but i'm too lazy), but he was a cool guy and his little kit was really pretty innovative (though, of course, diesels have, since their creation, been designed to burn such simple fuels)

anyway, again...thanks for the advice!

8/19/2007 12:37:41 AM