Not sure who the Falcons could trade for him, but the Raiders seem to ba happy with Daunte and Russell isn't to happy about playing for the Raiders. It was suggested on PTI that Atlanta could/should trade for him. This would be very interesting if it were to happen. Not sure though with all the money tied up in Vick. Perhaps if they are able to recoup some of the Vick money etc, and void the rest of his contract, they could throw that money at Russell. Doubt this will happen but it would be a great solution for both teams problems.

8/22/2007 6:14:14 PM

Well, Atlanta will recoup their money, at least a large portion of it, from Vick's contract so that's not really an issue. What can they offer the Raiders that they would really want? Oakland needs help at O-line and I can't imagine Atlanta would really want to give up experience on the O-line in exchange for a new QB. It could potentially be a good trade for both teams, but it'd be mighty hard to work out.

8/22/2007 6:17:46 PM

Kornheiser just probably thought that up while he was taking a shit on his bus coming back from the MNF game. Those 2 guys say the same random shit as everyone else, they just have a national forum to do it.

8/22/2007 6:18:31 PM

I agree, it would be very difficult to work. mainly like we both pointed out, Atlanta doesn't have too much talent they can part with. But you never know with crazy Al Davis. Atlanta needs to do something to make the fans happy, so I could see them letting go of some O-line to bring in a QB like Russell.

8/22/2007 6:23:26 PM

why exactly did the raiders sign culpepper anyway? i mean i personally think he'll be really good again, but why waste the #1 on a QB then. surely they must've had an inkling they'd sign him

8/22/2007 6:28:29 PM

Exactly. You would think the Raiders would have tried to negotiate some with Russell before the draft to get an idea on where both teams stood contract wise. I suppose they just aren't that smart, afterall they are the Raiders. They are supposed to fuck shit up. Cullpepper throwing anywhere near like he did with Moss and having Calvin Johnson to throw to would have been sick.

[Edited on August 22, 2007 at 6:32 PM. Reason : .]

8/22/2007 6:32:02 PM

if the basis of this thread is from what i saw kornheiser say on PTI, then sign me up for lockin this thread

8/22/2007 6:44:05 PM

Its an interesting idea brought up by two people who know a shitload more about sports than all of us on here. So its a fun topic to discuss. Is it going to happen? Probably not, but it could, and crazier shit has happened.

And I am sure the thought has crossed Blank's mind. There is 0 out there as far as quality starting QBs to sign, and Jamarcus is just sitting out there disgruntled and the Raiders aren't wanting to pay him what he wants. I am sure Blank would have no problem signing him if they can work something out to get the rights to him.

And yes, I know he wouldn't go right into Atlanta and start, but he would give the fans something to be happy about, and he is the best thing out there right now that the Falcons could have a chance at signing.

[Edited on August 22, 2007 at 6:54 PM. Reason : .]

8/22/2007 6:51:47 PM

Quote :

"why exactly did the raiders sign culpepper anyway? i mean i personally think he'll be really good again, but why waste the #1 on a QB then. surely they must've had an inkling they'd sign him "

Look at Jamarcus Russell.

Look at Daunte Culpepper.

Notice anything similiar?

8/22/2007 6:58:03 PM

They both have really big hands?

8/22/2007 7:00:33 PM

they're...black?

8/22/2007 7:09:06 PM

I hadn't noticed. I just see them both as QBs

8/22/2007 7:13:18 PM

Quote :

"Look at Jamarcus Russell. Look at Daunte Culpepper. Notice anything similiar? "

Jamarcus is like Daunte 10 years ago?

both have strong arms...and can scramble, but have more power than some other scramblers like vick...oh yeah and they're both black QBs

[Edited on August 22, 2007 at 7:17 PM. Reason : .]

8/22/2007 7:16:11 PM

I really hope he doesn't sign with the Raiders and either reenters the draft next year or gets traded. How an NFL franchise can be run so terrible in this day and age is beyond me.

8/22/2007 7:25:22 PM

Quote :

"Jamarcus is like Daunte 10 years ago? both have strong arms...and can scramble, but have more power than some other scramblers like vick...oh yeah and they're both black QBs"

They're basically the same quarterback. Who better to learn from as a rookie than someone who's just like you? Especially when the guy you're learning from used to be good!

8/22/2007 7:39:47 PM

^^and to think they were in the superbowl just a few years back

^ah ok, true that

[Edited on August 22, 2007 at 7:41 PM. Reason : .]

8/22/2007 7:40:24 PM

All of that is pointless if you aren't gonna sign your #1 pick.

8/22/2007 7:40:48 PM

yeah but culpepper is only 30 years old. he could feasibly be the main guy for 5-6 more years. thats a long time to "learn," and usually the #1 overall makes an impact early

8/22/2007 7:50:19 PM

Then they need to just go ahead and trade the rights to Jamarcus

8/22/2007 7:52:28 PM

The Raiders will sign Jamarcus Russell before regular season starts. The Raiders and Russell aren't as far apart as ESPN will have you believe. Granted a deal isn't imminent, but they aren't at square 1 as John Clayton says. Once Russell is signed, or once the deal is imminent, Oakland will trade either Josh McCown, Andrew Walter, or Daunte to Atlanta. It'll probably be McCown, because Culpepper seems to be the most capable of the three to start, and they have Walter signed through 2009.

8/22/2007 9:26:16 PM

is that you al davis?

8/22/2007 9:26:57 PM

what, it's more feasible that they trade the rights to russell?

and you think they'd keep four qb's on the roster once they sign him?

and you think any team's a more likely landing spot for the odd man out than atlanta?

8/22/2007 9:33:03 PM

This wouldn't be a bad idea, if they could get Atlanta's 1st and 2nd round picks from next year. You know they will be pretty good picks, definitely top 10.

8/22/2007 9:33:18 PM

no i'm wondering more about how you know more than john clayton

8/22/2007 9:35:07 PM

i'm a raiders fan. i read the news that comes out of the bay area. last week it was reported that the raiders had met some of russell's demands. and as of monday, the raiders and russell's reps have been meeting face to face. these are signs of progress, but everytime i hear john clayton talking about it, he says talk are going nowhere, etc.

8/22/2007 9:43:43 PM

So, you don't believe John Clayton, but instead will believe some local reporter from Oakland. Believe me, John Clayton and ESPN have got far more resources and connections than some local reporter for whatever the fuck the name of the Oakand newspaper is.

I am sure they have met some of his demapnds, just not the major ones which is what is hanging this up. And just because they are meating face to face does not mean that the talks are going anywhere. The demands they have probably met have nothing to do with his signing bonus or guarantees which is what the entire hold out is about.

8/22/2007 11:24:31 PM

Russell is in no hurry and neither are the Raiders. Both sides know that Russell was not going to be starting at all this year so they have time to mess around with the numbers and try to gain a few. JR will be in a situation similar to Rivers and that is a good thing. Russell is not at all ready for NFL football. Culpepper will be a great front man for him to learn by. I actually think the Raiders have handled this pretty well (acquiring Culpepper, try to squeeze a few last dimes out knowing there is no rush to get Russell in in, keep your franchise in the news for free publicity)

8/23/2007 2:00:04 AM

Wow, are you fucking joking? You think the Raiders have handeled this well? And you think Russell wasnt going to be starting this year? They only brought in Culpepper because they can't work out anything with Russell and Culpepper was available and was better than the other 2 options at QB they had. Have you heard some of the shit they are trying to pull with Russell? Its a fucking joke, and the fact that you think they have handeled this well is just fucking amazing.

8/23/2007 2:02:29 AM

Rookie contracts are getting to the point that I wouldn't want a top pick anymore, especially if I needed a QB.

8/23/2007 2:38:36 AM

Agreed, they should be like the NBA.

I think the majority of a rookie NFL contract should be performance based. There are just way way way to many busts in the NFL drafts. You would think the owners would opt for this by now.

8/23/2007 2:51:35 AM

Quote :

"Wow, are you fucking joking? You think the Raiders have handeled this well? And you think Russell wasnt going to be starting this year? They only brought in Culpepper because they can't work out anything with Russell and Culpepper was available and was better than the other 2 options at QB they had. Have you heard some of the shit they are trying to pull with Russell? Its a fucking joke, and the fact that you think they have handeled this well is just fucking amazing."

Not joking at all... As mentioned the delays in signing a top pick QB are standard these days. The likelihood of signing one at any decent time before camp is pretty much nonexistent. Culpepper, an established NFL QB that just so happens to be the mold your draftee is built in, was available so you pick him up as leverage, insurance, and teaching tool. You no longer have to worry about getting your inexperienced QB (that has no business playing, let alone starting, at this point in his career) signed quickly so you can haggle with contract numbers. The Raiders have the leverage in contract talks that one of the better NFL QB's is now on the roster and going to start regardless so holding out only hurts Russell. When Russell does sign, which will be very soon, he now has the absolutely perfect mentor for his style of game. The Raiders are better off right now than they were the day they drafted Russell.

8/23/2007 10:20:01 AM

personally i thnk they should integrate a rookie cap...with bonuses attached such as if you pass for a certain amount or win a certain amount of games and what not thennnnn you get the money.

this guaranteed money crap is destroying rookies ability to get into camp and get a start on a team that fans want to see.

its just dumb

put say a million dollar cap on their season with bonuses.

8/23/2007 10:23:23 AM

^^ yeah, i actually don't disagree with this. there's always a lot of gloom-and-doom talk when the #1 pick hasn't been signed by the beginning of the season, but it rarely matters in the long run. and if anyone has handled this poorly, it may be russell's agent. russell is now at the mercy of culpepper, similar to how rivers was with brees - if culpepper comes back and has a great season, russell may not see the field for a long time.

[Edited on August 23, 2007 at 10:33 AM. Reason : ..]

8/23/2007 10:32:31 AM

Quote :

"Well, Atlanta will recoup their money, at least a large portion of it, from Vick's contract so that's not really an issue. "

but if they cut him it'll really hurt their salary cap for the next few years, even if they get money back from him, which is still questionable.

8/23/2007 10:35:39 AM

Quote :

"if anyone has handled this poorly, it may be russell's agent. russell is now at the mercy of culpepper, similar to how rivers was with brees - if culpepper comes back and has a great season, russell may not see the field for a long time."

EXACTLY!

Quote :

"but if they cut him it'll really hurt their salary cap for the next few years, even if they get money back from him, which is still questionable."

Wouldn't surprise me if the NFL has a clause for handling special cases like your player being in prison for a significant length of time. I'm sure they can step in and render the contract void.

8/23/2007 10:40:07 AM

haha, no freaking way this happens. First of all, The Raiders may be happy with Daunte now, but he is no way able to be the franchise QB they need. Too old, and he's on the decline. The Raiders picked up Russell to be there guy for 10 years at least (that's the hope when you draft a franchise QB). They just need to pay the man.

If the Raiders ever made a move like that they would completely lost all credibility as serious team in the NFL EVER. But I dunno. Maybe trading Russell for DeAngelo hall, Jimmy Williams, and Alge Crumpler would be worth it.

8/23/2007 10:45:23 AM

^^maybe, but i've seen a few articles that say they'll take a pretty big hit over the next two years if they just cut him.

[Edited on August 23, 2007 at 10:50 AM. Reason : .]

8/23/2007 10:50:17 AM

^It's actually treated as a defaulted contract. The Falcons would be in the clear since Vick would be the one defaulting on it.


They'll get their money back.

8/23/2007 10:55:01 AM

even the guaranteed money?

8/23/2007 10:58:44 AM

atlanta is going to suck, and will probably get the first pick which they would take brain brohm, from UL, where Petrino just came from.

They wont get russel.

8/23/2007 11:02:02 AM

while difficult to deal with i agree ... guaranteed money is a very good thing for nfl rookies

8/23/2007 11:04:27 AM

Guaranteed money is written into the contract. If he goes to jail, the contract will be voided.

8/23/2007 11:09:03 AM

did the falcons trade this year's pick for schaub or next year's?

8/23/2007 11:09:42 AM

Quote :

"Maybe trading Russell for DeAngelo hall, Jimmy Williams, and Alge Crumpler would be worth it."

3 NFL proven starters for a player who could be Ryan Leaf and doesn't want to play for you?

Sounds like a good deal to me.

8/23/2007 11:21:20 AM

Quote :

"but if they cut him it'll really hurt their salary cap for the next few years, even if they get money back from him, which is still questionable."

They don't have to cut him, his contract becomes void once he pleads guilty to a felony. The guaranteed money can be recouped on a prorated basis.

So in other words, the Falcons are gonna have A LOT of money to spend.

[Edited on August 23, 2007 at 1:32 PM. Reason : .]

8/23/2007 1:32:18 PM

the Falcons have a lousy head coach

8/23/2007 1:36:21 PM

Quote :

"The Falcons have no choice but to move on,though Vick’s decision Monday to plead guilty to federal dogfighting charges will have long-range ramifications. Instead of having one of the NFL’s most dynamic players, Atlanta must turn over the quarterback position to former No. 3 overall pick Joey Harrington, a flop in both Detroit and Miami. Down the road, there will be major salary cap issues to address as the Falcons deal with the leftovers of Vick’s $130 million contract. "

from msnbc Aug 21st.

My understanding of the nfl salary cap is:

suppose they gave him a 30 million signing bonus. they can prorate that out many different ways for cap purposes.....say they prorate 1.5 million each of the first 2 years and 9 the next 3 (of a 5 year contract). if after 2 years he goes to jail and has to pay back 3/5 of the bonus or 18 million, the team still has a 9 mil hit on the cap (they still have to account for the 12 - 1.5(2), because of the way it was prorated).



[Edited on August 23, 2007 at 2:19 PM. Reason : .]

8/23/2007 2:13:40 PM

Quote :

"3 NFL proven starters for a player who could be Ryan Leaf and doesn't want to play for you? Sounds like a good deal to me."

pretty sure he was speaking from the point of view of the raiders

8/23/2007 4:35:36 PM

Quote :

"did the falcons trade this year's pick for schaub or next year's?"

That makes no sense at all.

8/23/2007 5:05:07 PM

^sounds like someone's mad b/c they were wrong.

8/24/2007 2:04:30 PM