Deep down inside, I don't think we should pull out of Iraq.

It seems a big reason I see people throwing around for why we should leave is "are our troops lives worth it" but I don't see how this is a relevant question. If we accept the Republican POV that we're fighting terrorism or whatever, then absolutely it is worth it, isn't it?

And if we embrace the liberal/progressive (in a general sense of the word) perspective that we are at least somewhat responsible for the rest of the world, then isn't it also worth it if we can restore stability to Iraq?

I understand as well it's a huge money and resource drain to fund a war that has many vietnam-esque elements to it, but I can't see how pulling out fixes this issue in the long run. Let's say we leave now. It's clear that Iraq is not really anywhere close to being able to rule itself successfully. At best, it turns out like SA (where most of the 9/11 terrorist were from) and at worst, it turns out like Afghanistan (where most of them were trained). So in another few years or so, we'll have the same problems we've been trying to deal with.

I think history can safely blame poor planning on the part of the Bush administration for the debacle, but that doesn't mean we still don't have to deal with the problems after Bush is gone.

The only way I can see a pull-out from Iraq working is that when we leave, the ordinary Iraqi citizen then sees their safety net gone, and the militia forces strengthen as a result to where they must come to a compromise. Or when we leave, it shows them that we really aren't interested in ruining their culture, and they being to take control at a more rapid pace.

12/17/2007 10:16:35 PM

For almost 5 years before we pulled out of Vietnam, people said we should stay or else all of Asia would fall to the Communist threat

and after we finally pulled out

noting happened

and it only took 58,000+ casualties to figure this out

12/17/2007 10:25:40 PM

pulling out of Iraq would be the worst mistake the US could make right now. Anybody who thinks we should still pull out is out of touch with reality.

12/17/2007 10:43:56 PM

I actually think it would be the second biggest mistake we could make.

The first biggest being staying in Iraq.

12/17/2007 10:53:43 PM

^^^ I'm not saying all of Asia would fall.

And you can't say "nothing happened" after Vietnam. Nothing happened to us but i'm sure there are tons of Vietnamese whose lives mostly changed for the worse.

Likewise, nothing would really happen with Iraq immediately. But after it had time to fester, we'd have conditions ripe again for a new 9/11.

We've done a lot of dicking around in the middle east and I think the situation in Iraq provides a good excuse for some actual progress in the region. And I am not talking about brash wars.

^ Can you explain why? I really don't understand why this would be a colossal mistake, unless you feel Iraq would come out better for it.

[Edited on December 17, 2007 at 10:55 PM. Reason : ]

12/17/2007 10:54:20 PM

Nothing happened when we pulled out of Vietnam? That's funny, I seem to recall something about a large quantity of civilians being slaughtered shortly after we failed to give them protection (like we had promised).

12/18/2007 2:11:13 AM

Quote :

"Nothing happened when we pulled out of Vietnam? That's funny, I seem to recall something about a large quantity of civilians being slaughtered shortly after we failed to give them protection (like we had promised)."

As opposed to the large quantity of civilians that were slaughtered by the govt's we backed?

12/18/2007 6:35:53 AM

^point??

12/18/2007 7:33:38 AM

If you can't see his point, you probably shouldn't be posting in this section.

12/18/2007 8:47:24 AM

As far as actions to take in the future...there is no point that i can see...other than dont back bad govts...which...is not relevant here anymore...

can you not see that?
nvm



[Edited on December 18, 2007 at 8:53 AM. Reason : nvm]

12/18/2007 8:52:59 AM

The main reason we should pull out is because it costs too much.

We have better things to spend those tax dollars on.

That's my cold-hearted opinion and I'm sticking to it.

12/18/2007 10:20:28 AM

you should always pull out early

it avoids all those expenses later

12/18/2007 10:44:07 AM

Quote :

"Nothing happened when we pulled out of Vietnam? That's funny, I seem to recall something about a large quantity of civilians being slaughtered shortly after we failed to give them protection"

yeah traitors to the popular uprising. I will give Iraq credit that at least we can say we took out a dictator. In Vietnam our support of a authoritarian despot is what led us into the conflict in the first place.

We just need to let those camel jockeys duke it out.

[Edited on December 18, 2007 at 10:47 AM. Reason : l]

12/18/2007 10:47:10 AM

Iraq != Vietnam... for the thousandth time...

12/18/2007 11:15:48 AM

I'm starting to feel the same way as the OP... I used to support staying, then around the time of the surge, I figured we should just leave, since it's obviously not working, and now that I'm hearing reports from actual soldiers that the surge is working and whatnot, I'm back in support of staying... so basically what little opinion I have on the issue depends upon the performance of our armed forces.

If only there was an unbiased and objective way to actually check progress in Iraq... I suppose the men and women on the ground are the closest thing to that.

12/18/2007 11:39:51 AM

I don't believe shooting people and dropping bombs are improving the situation.

We should withdraw and pay reparations.

12/18/2007 2:03:13 PM

Quote :

"If only there was an unbiased and objective way to actually check progress in Iraq... I suppose the men and women on the ground are the closest thing to that."

no shit

12/18/2007 2:04:05 PM