So I've had Timewarners HD-DVR service for a few months now, the HD looks great, but I'm getting sick of the crappy cable boxes needing repair all the time, and the price is a bit higher than directtv or dish, has anyone on here had both and do you have a recommendation for which is better?

2/21/2008 9:21:46 PM

yes, i've had both

directv has about 392582035 more HD channels than time warner

BUT

their DVR sucks, it goes out a lot when it rains, and you don't get all the local channels in HD, only cbs, abc, and nbc.

i have time warner now and it's not too bad...


i hate time warner's boxes all around. i went out and bought a tivo series3 and had time warner put cablecards into it - maybe you could look into that? much better than using their crappy SA box.

2/21/2008 10:07:15 PM

so the tivo series 3 is your DVR? what do you mean they put cable cards into it?

2/21/2008 11:03:34 PM

I'm for Directv. Get the HR-20 and you can get locals in HD via antenna. The HR-21 require a separate tuner, the AM-21 for OTA. I don't think the DVR is that bad, they're continually updating it and making things better. The number of HD channels outweighs the few issues I've had with their DVR, over TWC. I really hated Time Warner's DVR though. Rain fade hasn't been much of a problem for me yet either.

2/22/2008 12:22:55 AM

https://www3.tivo.com/store/boxdetails.do?boxName=300hourseries3hd&boxsku=R64825#top

http://www.tivo.com/whatistivo/ccfaqs.html

http://www.timewarnercable.com/Corporate/products/digitalcable/CableCARD.html


read up, son
google is your friend

2/22/2008 3:10:53 AM

I've enjoyed dish network moreso than twc. Outtages have been minimal at best - I'm certain that i could watch tv all day on a rainy day like this with no problems.

There's about twice the hd availiable. I dont have the DVR, but supposedly its rated the best when compared against the ones given out by tv providers.

I'm thinking of switching to directv thou as soon as they have that media center box availiable.

2/22/2008 8:23:52 AM

Quote :

"their DVR sucks, it goes out a lot when it rains"

Unless it's a torrential downpour, you shouldn't get rain fade if your DirecTV system is installed correctly and has an unobstructed view of the sky. The new line of DirecTV dishes (> 2004) provide an additional 8dBi of gain to overcome the rain fade issues of the older dishes.

I remember doing the calculation... Statistically in Atlanta based off of average rate of rainfall, my dish would succomb to rain fade for a total of approximately 58 minutes throughout the entire year.

When I had TWC in Raleigh, my cable could be out for hours at a time, several times a year. So when you think about it, 58 min/yr isn't bad.

As for the DVR, I hate that they got rid of the HD Tivo, but their new DVR isn't all that bad. It totally kicks the ass of Comcast's DVR (my girlfriend has one at her place). I can't remember how the TWC DVR was.

2/22/2008 8:36:15 AM

Quote :

"Outtages have been minimal at best - I'm certain that i could watch tv all day on a rainy day like this with no problems. "

I'm sure the drought has had nothing to do with this.

2/22/2008 8:49:23 AM

plus i had already dropped $500 on a tivo series3

and they don't work with satellite

2/22/2008 9:10:38 AM

Quote :

"directv has about 392582035 more HD channels than time warner BUT their DVR sucks, it goes out a lot when it rains, and you don't get all the local channels in HD, only cbs, abc, and nbc. "

let me debunk the latter, you now get all locals in HD with the new dish and the MPEG-4 system, and their DVR isn't bad at all, and mine has not gone out at all since I had the new dish installed, I did have it moved to a ground pole next to the house versus on the near the roof. You can also get the channels using an OTA to get all the 5.# stuff, etc. The only thing I don't get is News 14, which is a good thing!

2/22/2008 9:15:21 AM

Quote :

"i went out and bought a tivo series3 and had time warner put cablecards into it "

do you have access to the on screen guide? how about on demand channels?

2/22/2008 9:35:17 AM

you don't need the on-screen guide because tivo has its own (which is much better than twc's will ever be... in fact, the whole interface is just THAT MUCH better)

no on-demand, although they're working on a fix for this. the problem is that the current generation of cablecard-ready devices are one-way, on demand needs 2-way communication... there's supposedly an OCAP firmware version in the works for tivo.. we shall see.

i never really watched on demand anyway.

i get every other channel just fine, though.

2/22/2008 10:45:15 AM

You would, without a doubt, have to be the world's biggest moron to consider TWC for HD programming

Their channel lineup sucks

Their boxes are an complete and utter abortion of technology

Their channel compression is pure LOL. A&E HD shouldn't even be considered HD.

And they charge as much or more the DirecTV.

Furthermore, if you're worried about rain fade in a drought devastated NC, consider that my signal hasn't been interrupted yet and I've had DirecTV for 4 months now where's I'd have to reboot my 8300HD box every couple of days and weight 15 minutes for it to finish its count. Of course, I'm jinx'ing myself, but whatever.


Lastly, ToonHD. Nuff said.

2/22/2008 12:25:21 PM

I would go direct-tv if i were going to pay for HD channels. I just watch OTA.

2/22/2008 6:25:35 PM

I will switch to whichever network carries SciFi HD first, for Battlestar Galactica.

2/22/2008 6:53:51 PM

i could be mistaken here--- But a pretty big perk to DTV is that "EVERY' regular channel is inm 720p to begin with and of course the additional HDTV channels are in 1080... moral of the story= all the channels are atleast 720p as opposed to 480 with TWC

2/22/2008 7:07:42 PM

when i had directv, standard def channels looked waaaay worse than they currently do on my series3/time warner

2/22/2008 7:12:46 PM

how long ago? I would say I am 99% sure that they are far better now.... The "everything in 720p" Is the pitch they fed me when I was considering switching from TWC to DTV although I have not yet made the change

2/22/2008 7:34:29 PM

Quote :

"Their channel compression is pure LOL. A&E HD shouldn't even be considered HD."

I havent seen the new DirecTV MPEG4 channels, but if TWC compression is LOL, then DirecTV MPEG2 channels are ROFLMAO. They are beyond god awful. Youre right about A&E though...but thas mostly just because there is a huge lack in HD programming and stretchovision on that channel. Same with TBS and TNT to a lesser extent. TWCs only blame is for adding these channels rather than something with actual HD content (while their reason for not adding CinemaxHD here is that its too similar to HBO).

One problem with the Tivo/cablecard setup on TWC: if and when TWC gets SDV going, you wont be able to pick up any of the channels that are setup for SDV without that two-way communication.

Quote :

"i could be mistaken here--- But a pretty big perk to DTV is that "EVERY' regular channel is inm 720p to begin with and of course the additional HDTV channels are in 1080"

You are. In fact I believe DirecTV downrezzes their SD to 480x480 from what has been said on AVSforum.

The Dish DVR kicks ass from everything Ive heard (3 tuners, can output to 2 TVs, etc), but Dish is still missing a few key channels DirecTV has (SciFi, Speed, etc). They are launching new satellites later this year I believe, so bandwidth shouldnt be an issue for them in the future. Im looking to move soon, and the inability to install a dish will be a dealbreaker for me. TWCs picture quality is ok with me, but their snail-pace at adding new HD channels (and adding crappy ones half the time) and ever-rising bills is pushing me away.

2/22/2008 9:39:07 PM

I have scifihd, phillip though I never watch it so I dont know how good it is.

And any argument you make about compression is null and void on the basis that TWC box hardware is so fucking awful that you'd end up poking your eyes out and reading braille books rather then suffer menu navigation and HD tunning.

2/23/2008 2:37:58 PM

Having had all 3 in the last 2 yrs i would say that there is good bad for all of them
TWC: good: doesnt go out as much as sat and requires no maint
Bad: Snowy, crapy crapy box, only up to 1080i
Direct Tv, good: many HD channels and only one to do 1080p (unless dish has changed recently)
Bad: well if the dish moves or guy who sets it up sucks then it goes out in storms
Dish good: awsome menu selection and by far the best box that is given
Bad: again its a dish and they use two sat so placing of dish is very important, again still only 1080i is the highest output

so that is my experience with the 3 companies again somethings might have changed since ive had them, currently im on my 3rd box from TWC (got free hbo with this one) and looking to change back to dish (get an awsome discount)

[Edited on February 23, 2008 at 3:41 PM. Reason : .]

2/23/2008 3:41:13 PM

TWC has some 720P channels. CBS and ESPN come to mind, but there maybe others as well.

2/23/2008 4:27:39 PM

DirecTV HD >>>>> TWC HD

The HR-20 lets me get OTA HD channels as well. I get all premium channels in HD (HBO, Showtime, Cinemax, Starz -- several of each). The latest firmware update to the DVR fixed everything I had issues with. HD channel quality is much better than TWC. I haven't watched any standard definition TV since I got DirecTV HD. Hooked up a 1 TB hard drive to the eSATA port on the DVR for ridiculous quantities of recorded TV. I've never lost service either.

Quote :

"I will switch to whichever network carries SciFi HD first, for Battlestar Galactica."

DirecTV has SciFi HD

2/23/2008 5:07:06 PM

Looks like I need to switch.

2/23/2008 5:49:25 PM

Quote :

"Direct Tv, good: many HD channels and only one to do 1080p (unless dish has changed recently)"

What channel broadcasts in 1080p?

2/27/2008 12:31:23 PM

Quote :

"Hooked up a 1 TB hard drive to the eSATA port on the DVR for ridiculous quantities of recorded TV."

How difficult did you find this to be, and how well is it working for you? That sounds like an awesome idea as I would like to get more storage out of my system.

2/27/2008 1:39:38 PM

Avsforum.com has a how to thread somewhere.

i have a 500 gig on mine and have 20 some movies recorded in hd and still get pissed off at the clutter of tv shows before any hourglasses show up (too long of a menu under list)

The only issue i have is you can't rewind live tv anymore

2/27/2008 2:00:46 PM

Well, after next week I'll have some very recent comparisons for everyone.

My history: I've had HD for over 8 years. I currently have a big 65" HDTV that is large enough to make a poor quality HD feed noticeable.

First provider was DirecTV. I was using one of the best every HD Decoders made (I think it was the Sony HD-300). Picture quality was 'ok' on the HDs. I could see too many gradient lines on color changes. Had DirecTV for about 5 years. Got fed up with the requirement for a phone line and ignorant customer service. Was spending over $160 a month for top tier programming and with $20 a month to the phone line I didnt use.

Switched to Time Warner on an 18 month really good deal [I think in 2004] (saved me almost $70 a month). Immediately noticed MUCH better HD quality. Very happy to switch. Very happy with having an HD DVR for $12 a month instead of paying $800 to buy one for HD on DirecTV. My promotions have ended, and after battling with customer support, am tired of paying $155 a month for my service (NOT including internet). Placed a disconnect for March 5 after finding out DirecTV no longer requires phone line.

On March 5, DirecTV will be installed (again) with the latest sat, a HR-21 HD DVR. I will be a pretty good judge of the quality of HD given the fact that I watch almost all my shows exclusively on a 65" HDTV (shows all the defects that wouldnt be as easily seen on a smaller screen). So, send me a message next Friday if I forget to update the thread.

[Edited on February 27, 2008 at 2:32 PM. Reason : .]

2/27/2008 2:29:18 PM

Quote :

"Unless it's a torrential downpour, you shouldn't get rain fade if your DirecTV system is installed correctly and has an unobstructed view of the sky."

Ive been harping on this for years. When installed correct I might lose my signal 2 or 3 times a year and its just when those big thunderbooms roll right over me. Problem is finding the right guy who knows what they are doing. Took 5 different times for they sent someone out who knew what the deal was. course this was right when the new box came out but I knew i was in trouble when I knew more then 2 of the guys they sent out.

2/27/2008 2:43:30 PM

Carzin,

I too had/have the Sony HD box, and it worked great, until it had to be upgraded when the new HD dishes came out. As for the phone line issue. I have NEVER hooked up a phone line to my boxes. If I want to do PPV I just log onto their website and do so, you do not have to have one. Like you I watch almost all of my TV on a 57" and I think their quality is good, but I have no cable experience to compare to.

2/27/2008 4:18:50 PM

i wonder how much directv would cost with one hd box/dvr, two standard boxes and dsl

i'm canceling time warner on friday - i have to take my shit all the way to garner to cancel

i guess they're gonna charge me for my broken controller

2/27/2008 5:15:57 PM

Quote :

"How difficult did you find this to be, and how well is it working for you? That sounds like an awesome idea as I would like to get more storage out of my system."

1. Buy eSATA hard drive, got a cavalier 1 TB from buy.com for $180
2. Turn off DVR
3. Attach drive to eSATA port on DVR
4. Turn on DVR

The DVR will take like 15 minuites to boot while it formats the new drive. All the information on your internal drive will remain intact. Nothing from theinternal drive is transferred to the new drive, so you'll have to set up your recordings and preferences and favorites again.

Quote :

"On March 5, DirecTV will be installed (again) with the latest sat, a HR-21 HD DVR. I will be a pretty good judge of the quality of HD given the fact that I watch almost all my shows exclusively on a 65" HDTV (shows all the defects that wouldnt be as easily seen on a smaller screen). So, send me a message next Friday if I forget to update the thread."

You don't want the HR-21. It's essentially the same hardware as the HR-20 MINUS the off-air tuner. The HR-20 will record OTA HD. If you don't care for OTA, then it doesn't make much difference. D* has all the locals for Raleigh in HD I've heard. You never needed a phone line, so it's your own damn fault you blew $20 a month on it.

We get the premier package for a promo rate of $99.99/mo. You can get it for $64/mo for 2 months followed by $87/mo for like 10 months. I love it. It's awesome. We've got it on 3 HD TVs and it looks superb on all of them. MUCH better than TWC (Wilmington).

2/27/2008 5:17:51 PM

I had NFL Sunday Ticket. I was told that I had to have a phone line. It may have been a bunch of bull, but supposedly those units were supposed to dial out periodically. I can tell you that they said it was a requirement, not optional, to have a phone line several years ago.
I know all about the difference between the HD21 and HD20. I actually have an antenna in my attic for HD. Since all the local channels are apparently broadcasted for this area, I wont be using it. I want to benefit from the apparent menu processor upgrade which makes things go a little faster. One thing I cant stand is a slow menu.

2/27/2008 6:46:42 PM

I've had D* for about 8 years or so... never once had a phone line hooked up....

2/27/2008 10:18:40 PM

i just read that the phone line is only for sending payment info for payperview type stuff, if you dont have a line you have to call in and pay an extra fee to get payperview

2/27/2008 11:04:22 PM

Ok, I do remember the other reason I had the phone line. DirecTivos required the phone to dial out and get updates. This is before they took wireless. If you didnt have it plugged into the phone, it would stop working.

2/28/2008 8:30:07 AM

^^ or go online and order it, no fees there

^ that makes sense...

2/29/2008 8:57:27 AM

Ok. I had problems with DirecTV for the first week. The installer didnt tighten a bolt enough, and my sat was blown out of position 2 days after the install.

Summary: Too early to tell. Happy with my bill, not thrilled with the DVR or HD quality. very happy with channel selection.

Initial Impressions:
The DVR is not as easy to operate. it is slower, and I prefer the explorer system to setup recording. There must be a way to tell it to only record new stuff, but I havent found it yet.

High Definition Quality: Not really there. There is a lot more color gradients on DirecTV than what I was experiencing on Time Warner (next to none). I also see more artifacting when the picture is quickly changing (think a chase scene in the Bourne Identity). On my 65" screen, the quality is a definite hit. It still looks nice, but no where as clean as Time Warner. I dont have a list of the MPEG4 converted channels, so if there is interest, I will try to hunt this down, and see if the MPEG-4 is better than the MPEG-2.

High Definition Channel line-up: very nice. Probably wont be beat by cable anytime soon.

Writing this up quick. Ask any questions you want, and I'll try and respond in a few days.

3/18/2008 4:04:58 PM

MPEG-4 > MPEG-2

3/18/2008 4:14:22 PM

why not dishnetwork?

i've had both twc and dish, and dish is way better to me. the dvr is better and was rated higher than tivo. directv's interface was horrible to me (my aunt and uncle have it). last i heard dish had more HD channels too. i have the ViP622, dual receiver hd dvr box and i heart it.

[Edited on March 18, 2008 at 4:21 PM. Reason : ]

3/18/2008 4:16:58 PM

If TWC could get the software worked out on the SA 8240 HDC and SA 8300 HDC along with Switched Digital Video they will gain a tremendous edge over DTV and DISH.

But these two things are TWC's biggest problems right now too, so time will tell.

3/18/2008 4:17:38 PM

Tremendous edge how?

DirecTV only has to fire a new satellite into space and force a dish upgrade.

TWC has to invest in new equipment nationally.

And besides, both will be utterly beasted by Verizon.

3/18/2008 4:21:32 PM

Quote :

" DirecTV only has to fire a new satellite into space and force a dish upgrade. "

*only* hahah

3/18/2008 4:58:03 PM

Well I mean

That

Or digging up switching equipment across the nation.

3/18/2008 5:01:40 PM

you can replace a lot of vault mounted equipment for the cost of a $200 million satellite installation.

3/18/2008 6:29:32 PM

Dish Network had a satellite launch failure a few days ago. It didn't reach orbit and now they have some decisions to make. It will probably be a while before Dish gets a large number of new HD Channels.

Hopefully DirecTV won't suffer a similar fate when their satellite is launched tomorrow. Launchpad cam: http://www.navigon.net/sl/pictures/.

and TWC sucks

3/18/2008 6:48:34 PM

Why not get FTA and be done with it.

3/18/2008 8:34:48 PM

eleusis : no.

TWC upgrades in NC alone are approaching 200 million for switched digital.

3/19/2008 12:50:30 AM

Quote :

"There must be a way to tell it to only record new stuff, but I havent found it yet."

There is... it's in the record options where you can tell it to start early, end late, record new or all, then how long to keep it, or how many episodes to keep etc. You might have to look at the To Do List and edit it through there if you selected the record function via the guide and not a search.

3/19/2008 8:34:33 AM

Quote :

"TWC upgrades in NC alone are approaching 200 million for switched digital."

that's cost of labor and equipment. the satellite launch alone would cost $200 million, and that won't include the cost of the satellite or additional switching equipment needed at uplink sites, among other things.

3/19/2008 11:25:37 AM