http://blog.wired.com/cars/2008/06/dont-get-taken.html

Quote :

"Everyone who's ever found themselves at the side of the road in a car that's died has thought, "What's this gonna cost?" and suspected they're about to get reamed. It's a common feeling because most people have no idea what it really costs to, say, replace a fuel pump. A California start-up has launched a Web site that will give you an idea of what it ought to cost so you know if your mechanic is on the level. RepairPal.com used reams of auto industry data and insights from more than two dozen mechanics to create a database it says covers more than 20 billion estimates to repair just about anything that could happen to just about anything on the road. Think of it as the Kelley Blue Book of auto repair. "We're bringing transparency to a huge industry," says CEO and co-founder David Sturtz. "Our goal is to minimize the anxiety and uncertainty that consumers typically feel when they service their cars." Sturtz says Americans make about 2 million visits to a repair shop every day, and in most cases they have no idea if they're paying too much. He didn't, which is one reason he launched the site. "I didn't like the fact I couldn't tell if I was getting screwed or not," he told Wired.com. He started building the site about 18 months ago, when he called several mechanics to get estimates for basic repairs like changing the oil and replacing brake pads. The estimates were all over the map, even within the same city, with no rhyme or reason to it. Then he had women make the same calls to the same shops - and found the quotes they got averaged 17 percent more than the ones he got. "Women are clearly a big target" user for the site, Sturtz says. "They almost universally feel they're getting ripped off, an our data suggests that they are." Sturtz enlisted the help of more than two dozen mechanics and an army of number-crunchers to build the database and search engine that drives RepairPal.com. The dataset includes everything from the cost of a spark plug to the time required to install a clutch. They drew on their own experiences, automakers' factory labor time guides - huge books, generally available only to professional mechanics, that outline how long specific repairs should take - and piles of service receipts. "We've ... run statistical analyses to determine pricing patterns across geographies, brands and service channels," Sturtz says. In other words, you can use the site to figure replacing the clutch in your 1993 Civic will run you $658 to $1,032 if you live in Oakland or putting a muffler on a 2005 Pontiac G6 will set you back somewhere between $283 and $482 if you're in Boston. That's a ballpark as big as Yankee Stadium, but Sturtz says it accounts for price variances between dealerships and independent shops as well between genuine OEM and generic parts. The site covers 500 makes and models going back to 1990, a figure Sturtz says includes 94 percent of the cars on the road. It covers about 75 percent of the repairs anyone might ever have to make - from replacing a headlamp bulb to installing new CV joints - and offers a rundown of things that might have caused the problem in the first place. Of course, all that info isn't much help if you have the car hauled to a shady shop, so RepairPal.com has a database of 286,000 repair shops and will recommend some in your area. As people use the site, they'll be asked to provide reviews of the shops they use. The site's free - Sturtz plans to use targeted advertising to pay the bills - but if you're willing to spend a few bucks, you can get advice from a certified mechanic. Photo by Flickr user Ryan Stone."

now you can find out for sure if you're getting ripped off on turn signal fluid or muffler bearings

[Edited on June 12, 2008 at 4:18 PM. Reason : .]

6/12/2008 4:17:16 PM

Anyone can call around for pricing.

The real problem in my opinion is mis-diagnosis (often intentional) and mechanics who opt to throw parts at the problem rather than troubleshoot it. I'd rather pay an honest mechanic a fair price than to get a discount from someone who is telling me to buy things I don't need.

6/12/2008 4:24:20 PM

Quote :

"Anyone can call around for pricing. "

if they are to lazy to do that, and too lazy to look it up. then they deserve to get fucked

6/12/2008 4:34:08 PM

Quote :

"The real problem in my opinion is mis-diagnosis (often intentional) and mechanics who opt to throw parts at the problem rather than troubleshoot it."

yeah this site seems to attack the wrong problem. Book time is book time to an extent, and labor rates at shops are generally within $10-15 of each other.

6/12/2008 4:41:04 PM

from their site 2003 1.8t jetta timing belt job

Quote :

"Parts: $18 - $43 Labor: $275 - $351 "

that parts cost is higher than wholesale on the required components (belt, tensioner, tensioner roller) and doenst even include the water pump as far as i can tell...

it basically looks like a tool fucktards are going to use to try and lowball shops. dealership will charge over $800 for this service (w/ WP, parts + labor) and most independents will be ~$600

[Edited on June 12, 2008 at 5:18 PM. Reason : ..]

6/12/2008 5:18:03 PM

Quote :

"it basically looks like a tool fucktards are going to use to try and lowball shops"

pretty much.

6/12/2008 5:33:10 PM

^^^^^yeah, but then people bitch and complain about the price of diagnostic fees. there's also the fact that it's not an exact science. even the best mechanics in the world come across problems that might present themselves as one thing, but turn out to be another. sometimes your only option is to narrow it down to a couple of things, and take a chance. or, it might be cheaper in the long run to just replace 2-3 parts vs. the extra time of eliminating any other possibilities. i get your point though, and agree... just saying it's not always that simple.

^^^^it figures you'd have that attitude. you're a prime example of why blue collar stereotypes like this continue.

^^spot on.

this site is just another example of a know it all self important idiot. i can't stand people who feel like it's their job to monitor how other people make a living and try to discount it. they don't mind taking top dollar for their work, but fuck anyone else that expects the same. this guy would probably be outraged if someone created a system to check up on the value of his job/expertise.

the auto repair industry is no different that any other. there are hacks, cheats, etc. everywhere. if we're going to police them, why don't we do something about the really ridiculous ones like medical, legal, etc. first? furthermore, why does price really matter if your primary concern is getting screwed? so you pass up the most expensive quote at an honest shop in favor of the closer to average quote at the dishonest shop. brilliant!



[Edited on June 12, 2008 at 5:45 PM. Reason : .]

6/12/2008 5:43:46 PM

doesnt matter what the hell they put on that site, no shop is gonna do it for those prices and they can tell you to go fuck off, that is what i would do, and when they come back realizing you are the cheapest, quote em double

6/12/2008 8:11:42 PM

its a tool for common people to use to determine if they've been quoted an astronomical rate for something. it appears to not list exact values so its only really useful to determine if you're being ripped.
I highly doubt this site will affect any honest shops, since their quotes will be in the range on the site, the shops most affected will be the ones quoting $800 to fix an issue that this site lists between $400-$500.

6/13/2008 12:15:29 AM

^

Quote :

"furthermore, why does price really matter if your primary concern is getting screwed? so you pass up the most expensive quote at an honest shop in favor of the closer to average quote at the dishonest shop. brilliant!"

i work in the construction industry, and our labor rate is one of the highest in the area and we charge by the hour for every job. there are a number of reasons behind it, and one of them is specifically to try and eliminate ignorant people like this from even contacting us. a lot of auto shops do the same thing.

the old term "you get what you pay for" definitely applies here. "fast, good, cheap: pick two" comes to mind also. if the research was done on people that are actually screwed in some way, the percentages would be significantly higher at the places with below average-average prices. some of it on purpose, a lot of it not. if you're giving bargain pricing, you can only afford bargain mechanics. honesty and competence aren't likely to be on their resumes. again, we can turn to slowblack96 as the poster child for this.

6/13/2008 3:56:10 AM

^i havent alwasy foudn this to be true, ive had fast good and cheap mechanics, but usually after a referral.

Plus, alot of these places charge you a diagnostic fee for and then either A. Fail to diagnose the problem, or B. diagnose it as what you aready told them it was.

6/13/2008 6:54:09 AM

^^maybe you misunderstand what I'm saying. This site is a filtering tool. Nothing more. I certainly will pay a bit more for an honest, competent mechanic; however, a 200% premium, not so much. What this site allows me to do as a consumer, is take a look at "average" cost of a service. This range should be used when determining who to get the work done by.

I agree with your cheap, fast, good argument. When I get work done on my car I don't use that approach. I want: average price, decent turnaround, good enough quality. This site lets me at least filter out the above average price, it doesn't say anything about the other two.

6/15/2008 9:28:26 AM

Quote :

"diagnose it as what you aready told them it was"

the day you let the customer start telling you what the exact problem is, is the day that you start losing your ass

6/15/2008 11:08:36 AM

^ ive had a shop refuse to work on a car without the diagnostic fee, even though the problem was already diagnosed at another shop. If they fixed it and it didtn work, then fine, ill eat the money. But some of these places the diagnostic fee might as well be a Mandatory surcharge.

6/16/2008 10:14:07 AM

No place will just fix whatever the customer asks them to fix without double checking the diagnosis. No good place anyway. A good mechanic ALWAYS verifies the problem. Sure you say that you'll eat the cost of the bad diagnosis by the other shop if necessary, but in real life, it never happens.

[Edited on June 16, 2008 at 11:32 AM. Reason : b]

6/16/2008 11:31:04 AM

Not always true.
Back when I was writing, some people would come in and say: "I want xxxx replaced."
I would try and determine why they wanted said part replaced, and some would here nothing of diagnostics.
They would sign a waiver saying that we were doing what they asked, and we were not responsible for anything after the fact.

6/16/2008 11:50:04 AM

http://repairpal.com/

6/16/2008 4:58:16 PM