Have any of you heard of this?

Long story short, the owner of my company encourages employees to take the 'forum' at cost to him, but I don't agree with its principles.

I can't come up with a reason to tell him I don't want to take it, without insulting something that he believes in. ( My belief: its a pyramid scheme that employs coercion to provide information to people that they could get through common sense, at a steep cost)

What do I tell him?

12/5/2008 1:35:54 AM

what principles don't you believe in?

12/5/2008 2:09:24 AM

lol, I bet they give your boss a report card if he is picking up the bill.

12/5/2008 2:27:39 AM

Point your boss here: http://www.rickross.com/groups/landmark.html

They have had dozens of lawsuits filed against them, and have frivolously filed TONS of lawsuits for "defamation" by many authors and journalists who outed their company as being a cult. Note that all of their suits that I could find were dismissed.

Ask him if he will foot the bill for you to go see a licensed psychiatrist or psychologist, to get REAL help on improving yourself. If not, he doesn't really have a case.

FWIW, it's not a pyramid scheme, but they do prey on the weak minded.

12/5/2008 2:47:23 AM

12/5/2008 3:12:12 AM

Oh man, these douchebags did a seminar at my grandfather's church once. We were the smart aleck assholes ruining their cult game that afternoon

12/5/2008 6:29:38 AM

my cousin works for them and talks about it. She's been trying to convince us to take the course but
1) it's expensive and I could think of better ways to spend the $
2) it seems like common sense self help stuff...

If my boss was willing to pay for it then I'd probably do the forum but it's not something I'd personally pay for.

12/5/2008 10:46:21 AM

bump

5/11/2010 7:01:29 PM

My bff's husband's boss is making him take this course before he will allow him to go to more manager training. The fucked up thing is that he has to go on his own dime. I have been researching it and it seems so sketch to me.

I really wish this personal type bullshit would not interfere with someone's professional development.

http://www.culthelp.info/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=1243&Itemid=12

the video is in French so I know people will not watch it but it does go into a forum. These people are so secretive that someone had to go hidden camera on their asses. These people seem to be psychoanalyzing random people and they are not trained to be doing so.

I am just worried for my friend and her family. I don't want him to lose his job over this. His boss is such a bastard that I could see him getting butthurt over his employee not believing the same shit he does.

Anyone else have any advice about Landmark? It totally sounds like a pyramid scheme wrapped up in a cult.

5/11/2010 7:10:05 PM

My advice to him would be start looking for another job. I personally would not pay to go to their nonsense seminars.

If he really wants to move up the ladder though it sounds like he doesn't have a choice. His best bet is to go and keep a low profile and bring a notepad to doodle in.

5/11/2010 8:25:44 PM

So I ended up actually going to the thing (since it was payed for and i got payed to go).
I can give you more detail if you like, but it's basically just existentialism. The theory they try to push is

1: life has no inherent meaning or beauty
2: you have the capacity to create meaning for every event in your life
3: Therefore life has exactly the meaning you create for it.


Of course they drag this out over three days in a controlled environment that pressures you into approving of these theories and doesn't give you any time for critical reflection.


It's nothing you couldn't get from smoking a joint and taking a walk in the woods.

If your bff's boss isn't paying for it, I wouldn't go and I would tell him you're not going for financial reasons. The counter argument that they will give is "what is the price tag you put on changing your life." Be prepared for that, and counter with something like "The journey through life is the only price that leaves me with a tangible product, unless you prove to me a priori that this will change my life, it's not worth me taking time away from things that I already know do, like weekends with my family. "

You can also argue it from a religious perspective, and claim something like "the meaning in your life is given through christ, which is in contradiction to the teachings of landmark, I would feel uncomfortable in that setting." As an employer, they cant do anything without violating some of your rights.

if they are paying for it, id say go, its a quick lesson in some types of philosophy, just be prepared for extreme pressure to pay more for the next course

5/11/2010 8:30:46 PM

Oh snaps! I went to an introductory session of this! At this one part, you got paired up with a "graduate" and had to stand like three inches away from them, hold their hands, and stare into their eyes for like five minutes straight.

I was so out of it in general though. I didn't even know what it was or the name of the program--just that it seemed really important to my friend that I go and show support...when they started in with the recruiting, it was just like, "Uhhhh, sounds nice and all, but this is really gonna cut into my time to get high and watch TV..."

So, yeah, pretty much a cult that probably helps a few people, destroys a few people, and rips off a bunch more...had they offered up some weed and reruns of Taxi, a playa woulda been all over it though.

5/11/2010 8:47:05 PM

My cousin did it. Here's something he sent me from a year or two ago. I never looked into it because I figured it was a cult or pyramid scheme.

Quote :

"Also, before you look into getting back into school (or perhaps while you're in the process) I have a course I would HIGHLY recommend. It's a weekend seminar called the Landmark Forum. I believe they have a center down in Raleigh (and perhaps one other in NC). They have a curriculum called the Curriculum for Living. I'm actually training currently to lead their programs because they've made a huge impact on my life and how I handle it and what I have as a result. It's 510 bucks and they give you a 10 session seminar in the cost of the tuition (the amount of instructional hours you get in that price is ridiculous -you get about 70+ hours of class time, so it comes down to about $7.20 an hour). You can check dates in NC and register online if you go to http://www.landmarkeducation.com. I've done their entire curriculum plus their communication curriculum and their leadership program (taking it for the second time at the moment... it's amazing... and RIGOROUS!!!) and it's the kind of thing where I can't believe what life used to be like verses what it's like now, like two different worlds. And I relate to my Landmark Forum (October, 2005) much like one might relate to their wedding day or some other life-altering experience. (it's funny, too, because on top100expo.com they have it rated as the second greatest adventure on their list of top 100 adventures, and the only thing ranked above it is civilian space travel! haha) Oh, and they have an online introduction you can watch to get a sense of what the course is like (after a bit of intro stuff they give you video clips of actual course content you can watch)."

5/11/2010 9:16:19 PM

i would run as far away from that shit as I can.

5/11/2010 11:36:17 PM

^ I'd actually recommend going if they pay for it and you are confident in who you are. It's a surreal experience, to see how easily people are manipulated by their emotions and societal pressures. It's also a great test of logic and willpower to pick apart the arguments as quickly as they move onto the next topic. Just leave your checkbook and credit card at home so you can use it as an excuse to avoid the inevitable push to get you in the next class.

5/11/2010 11:57:40 PM

I mean if that's what grills your cheese, i'm sure that could be rewarding, but I, like most people have myriad other things that I would rather do with my time and only 168 hours per week in which to do them.

Exposing myself to people who have nothing but malicious intent just doesn't seem like a good use of my time.

5/12/2010 12:01:31 AM

^ I can totally see that, for me it was a fun mental excercise, equivalent to a 3 day chess match.

5/12/2010 12:08:13 AM

Yeah I don't see anything wrong with going if

a) you're a confident person
b) someone else is paying for it
c) you have nothing better to do that day

Like 1985 said, it's amazing to see how quickly people lap this stuff up. I was highly amused the one time I went but I would never bother going again unless b) and c) were in play.

5/12/2010 12:59:38 AM

to me, this seems like it would appeal to the same people who say "have a blessed day" every chance they get, to me

5/12/2010 9:32:52 AM