A far cry from the F1 in terms of price and engine. 1,000 units to be built in 2011.

3.8 litre TT V8
600 hp
433 lb-ft
$265,000
Highest hp/CO2 ratio of any engine on the market, including diesels and hybrids

Click below for a very long press release from McLaren with various tech details.

http://www.autoblog.com/2009/09/08/mclaren-mp4-12c-first-batch-of-details-and-images-surface/

It will be properly released tomorrow.

I don't know what's going on in the back, but the rest of it (esp the profile) is generic [boring] supercar styling. But technologically, this might be the most advanced supercar on the market, along with the new Ferrari 458 Italia.

The carbon fiber tub you will see below weighs just 176 lbs, and is one piece!!!

9/8/2009 9:54:22 PM

I like that super high redline, if it's any indication of what the real engine should actually do (And with a modern highly expensive 3.8L V8, 8500rpm is believable for me).

Is that an entirely composite chassis btw? I mean, obviously the rear is probably going to involve some metal for mounting the engine, but that tub appears to be a fully stressed member. Anyway, I give it even more respect son if that's the case son. Even more respect.

9/8/2009 9:59:25 PM

458 Italia:

9/8/2009 10:08:08 PM

noone gives a shit

9/8/2009 10:11:14 PM

I like it!

9/8/2009 10:38:13 PM

do want

9/8/2009 11:55:01 PM

looks good

kinda like honda's hsc concept

9/9/2009 12:50:18 AM

From the side the family resemblance to the F1 is strong but that front 3/4 view has Porsche written all over it.

9/9/2009 9:30:47 AM

Awesome car, I love high horsepower lightweight cars. Better than pigs like the 599GTB!

Quote :

"Highest hp/CO2 ratio of any engine on the market, including diesels and hybrids"

This is me caring...

9/9/2009 9:34:28 AM

all that CO2 crap is just marketing anyway

9/9/2009 11:48:42 AM

BTW, Gordon Murray, the McLaren F1's designer, separated from the company some time ago. He is making his own supercar to be released in a couple of years.

Some new real world pics...

Hi res pics here http://www.autoblog.com/gallery/mclaren-mp4-12c-0/

9/10/2009 3:14:59 AM

I like that first picture. Very nice

9/10/2009 8:32:44 AM

I'm excited about this car but I'm a little peeved too.

First of all, the name. MP4-12C. Maybe there's a nerdy explanation. But maybe there isn't. And either way, it's a letdown because it sounds like a damn part number. Either it tells us something about the car or it hides what it is. And a list of letters, by definition, has as many syllables as characters. And unlike multi-word names for cars, i.e. "360 Modena, 360 Stradale, F430 Scuderia, 599 GTB FIORANO, 458 Italia, Corvette Z06, M3 CSL, C8 Laviolette, db7 zagato....etc etc etc" where a car can be usually identified by any one of the words alone, here, because there isn't any indication that part of the name is the model and another part the trim, you HAVE to rattle off the whole name in order to identify the car, which sounds like you're bragging about something when you identify it, either b/c you are proud to have one or that you're proud to know so much. check these out to see what I mean:

EM-PEE-FOUR-TWELVE-SEE

EF-WON

THREE-SIX-TEE

EF-FOUR-THIRTY

SIX-TWELVE, SCA-LEE-ETTI

.... ok, now second: just look at that pic of the Mp4-12c next to the f1. It's safe to say that by most standards, the MP4-12c is a pretty sharp looking car, and for many, the f1 might be a little tame in appearance compared to what it represented, but in this pic, honestly, in 20 years, which car would you think is nearly 20 years older? I see so much unoriginal borrowing of Ferrari 360, gallardo, audi r8, lotus m250/elise/evora and even farboud/farbio GTS in the Mp4-12c that I feel a little bored of it already. The F1 (I can't even just call THAT car "the mclaren" anymore, dammit... it'll be "the mclaren f1" from now on in conversation...the mp4-12c has actually made the f1's name longer!), no matter what one thinks of its ultimate shape, is cut the way it is because that's what was necessary for the form. The driver and passengers have to fit in a particular way in front of and around the v12, in order to make the car as compact as possible, it needed a special transverse gearbox, the nose is low to take advantage of the special driver placement, the doors open dihedrally because it allows for a hinge and a door shape that cuts far into the roof and therefore brings a handle within reach of the centrally positioned driver... the same shape without a hinge at that location means a necessity of added roof structure, and thus more weight, if the door was to be stiff enough to not be sucked away at the innermost edge when doing 240+ mph... The mclaren F1 is a form matched to the machine, whereas the mp4-12c's sketches probably ran side-by-side, if not preceding, the engineering that was to define the machine.

Third, the output.
I thought this was supposed to be "mclaren moves downscale and into our hearts" not "mclaren is king of the hill again." With carbon tub and 600hp (and via turbos too), it sounds to me like someone wanted to use the diminishing cost of technology with time to not only put the "mclaren" magic in more garages but also to make a mclaren that didn't have to necessarily look UP to the older car in terms of spec. I'm all for horsepower-via-torque and minimum weight, but let's be honest about where this project ended up. This looks more like a noble M600 than an m12gto or rossion q1. All three of those cars, along with this car and the ferrari 458 Italia, will be 0-60 in 3.5 seconds or less. The difference is, only the ferrari will have a wailing, naturally aspirated motor. It'll also be why it's the only one to turn a profit as an all-new car. That's why the ferrari will be the most satisfying and why I'm sure it'll be Evo's COTY or the autocar driver's car of the year, etc etc... whenever it gets the chance. The others have gotten the performance the more cost-efficient way, by shoving in air accelerated by the otherwise kinetic energy "otherwise lost" into exhaust gases. Arguably, a clean 600 hp from a 3.8L v8 is impressive, but by the implied amount of hamfistedness across any owner population of a car, it's no more substantively empowering than the mere 425 hp that the noble M400 got out of its 3.5L FORD ESCAPE DERIVED v6. And that didn't really make the m400 all that much more quick or fun than the previous 350 hp in the M12 GTO-3 and GTO-3R. So what's the point? "Well, the mclaren will probably be heavier than the 2300 lb nobles, so to be JUST as fast, it better have dual clutch transmissions and the full output." But you know what? Acceleration isn't everything. I drove a 2002 Porsche Boxster, not even an S, yesterday, and it was fabulous. As fast as could be used on the roads available, and they were pretty damn good roads for greensboro, NC, and rock solid while offering tons of feedback, both feel and sound. It was easily the fastest feeling 220 hp I could remember. with 75k miles, the prestige-dealer's "ripoff" price was $16k. I guess what I'm saying is... if mclaren really wanted to impress me, they'd have made a 350-400hp cayman that weighed 500 lbs less. So basically, a noble, but with english f1 labor instead of south african blue-collar. They could charge 150k+ for that, and really, it'd be indistinguishably fast, since that's what a noble m400 will be compared to this car, since that's basically what a noble m400 is compared to an F1, at least along most tracks and definitely on real world roads.
Instead, all mclaren did was further the horsepower war. So 520 hp mercedes E63s will go on looking like a good idea, I guess. Someone has to hammer home the importance of LESS, sooner or later, and mclaren, unlike ferrari or lamborghini, had the cachet to pull it off without risking like looking like they brought a knife to a gunfight.

Fourth: two seats instead of three... Guess gordon murray's patent wasn't licensed to mclaren.

fifth: If the taillights were many rows of LEDs spanning the entire height of the left and right sides of the rear vents about the same width of the existing headlights, I'd probably grow to love the rear end of that car. Right now, it looks about as weird to me as the Vector w8 and Fisker Tramonto did when I first saw those. Why bother with a single strip of lights when you've got a great big ass of bodywork to make interesting. And even if you can't come up with something interesting and original, like aston martin's C-arc of reflectors off of a single rows of centrally-located-but-obscured LEDS, ROUND IS OK WITH PRETTY MUCH EVERYONE. Look at the alfa mito and ford gt ferchrissakes. Not every round light arrangement will be criticized for looking like a ferrari or corvette or lotus.

sixth: the mp4-12c sucks me dry of my dignity and the satisfaction of believing I've totally nailed the mp4-12c for its shortcomings because even my reasonable complaints don't feel satisfactory because it IS a damn good looking car, I'm sure it'll be critically acclaimed and will serve as some sort of benchmark, and I'll love it anyway.

9/11/2009 4:26:52 AM

dude


















you're fucking crazy

9/11/2009 11:10:03 AM

IKnowrite? Just gotta do the best I can with what I gots.

9/11/2009 4:26:37 PM

OEP's just making this thread so a couple months later he can make a "FINALLY FINALLY FINALLY BYE BYE MCLAREN MP4-12C!!!!!" thread

9/12/2009 5:43:40 AM

yeah very funny

9/12/2009 9:08:16 AM

No central driver's seat? Pedestrian.

9/12/2009 10:02:57 AM

^^^^^^WOW....you have a lot of free time. you know nobody read that?

9/12/2009 1:22:17 PM

I will be the first to admit that I did.

9/12/2009 4:11:54 PM

i read it all, nice synopsis

9/12/2009 10:14:08 PM

^^,^ : thnx.

^^^ : Actually, it just flows out of me, man. I write this stuff before I even know it. So it doesn't really take a lot of time to do. Still, it doesn't explain WHY I bother, right? To that, I think I do it because it's to serve as some sort of self-evidencing reflex. I'm kind of in a rut at the moment. I was supposed to wrap up some papers as part of my last semester in law school like... 4 months ago, and they aren't even that difficult, but I've got like a mental block on what I need to say for at least two of them. I'll go read a book on the topic over the course of a week and then fling out 20+ pages, no problem. I'll feel great about it, wonder what took me so long, think I'm ready to move on to the next thing and the next day I'll go back and read what I read, realize that what I read not only was entirely the wrong scope for the project, but that what I wrote equally blows and decide to start over, now having wasted over a week. I've been doing this bs for months. I've got until the end of the semester, or then shit gets REALLY messed up. It doesn't help that I know that my professors don't really care if what I write sucks. If what I wrote ITSELF had some value in being useful, independent of my need to turn it in for a grade, then maybe it'd just write itself the first time. As it is, I think about cars 24/7 and have to play jedi mind tricks on myself to do any of this stuff. I got my first degree right, mechanical engineering and cars are where my mind lives.... law school was more of a stab toward money/security. The rationale was: "better to be a C- lawyer than an A- engineer." Maybe that was tmi. whatever. You guys don't really care that much for me to need to worry about who reads or doesn't read this.

9/14/2009 2:53:00 AM

btw, I did write like 4 pgs of new material on the legal concept of "blasphemy" vs. laws under the labels of "obscenity", "profanity", "indecency," and others before visiting TWW tonight, and as that's a pretty small amount to write when I'm feeling inspired, maybe I didn't "sprint off into the wilderness" tonight like I've done before. The paper is about "blasphemy" laws in italy for a comparative constitutional law class. Only the "blasphemy" they seem to be trying to punish is only facially "blasphemy," since the news stories condemning 'blasphemy' are really places where the italian press is trying to drum up attention for where prominent people and athletes get caught cursing in public and during soccer games. The home of the catholic church has a greater expectation of condemnation for such things for its citizens when they get caught in the public eye than here, which is pretty funny, since we're much more likely to ACTUALLY condemn someone for the same behavior, but within the press, usually not. character assassinations are a part of a REAL prosecution here, whereas in Italy, it seems like it's the other way around. ah whatever. yeah, now it's starting to feel like what I wrote earlier is gonna read like bs tomorrow. Maybe I'll email it to my prof to see if I'm going in the right direction now. He hates that though. He just wants me to do it right, once, and then get it off both of our plates. I kinda wish I could just do that. The nested levels of bs are making it hard for me to rattle it off.

9/14/2009 3:03:21 AM

looks like a hyundai genesis and a ferrari put together

9/14/2009 7:54:03 AM

Gordon Murray disapproves, thought they should have gone further downmarket.

http://community.evo.co.uk/users/Harry-Metcalfe/blogs/index.cfm/2009/9/3/Gordon-Murray-on-McLaren

9/16/2009 5:17:23 AM

the headlights remind me a lot of the NSX's non-popups. in a lot of ways it almost looks like it could be a new nsx.

9/16/2009 10:49:21 AM

Jesus, I've been saying this for years

Every single new car that gets plastered on this website has you guys making comments about which aspects of the car looks like what aspects of some other car.

Just how many designs have their been since the 50s when cars started taking the general shape and appearance they have now. You do realize that most curves/angles/shapes are used up by this point, right?

Your rants about the powerplant are in the same ballpark. Sans doing something like a pure experiment that will never see production in that form, what do you really expect from a powerplant, something like a Veyron that generally hasn't been done before? Every car made can't be that car. Every new car made can't be that car that is perfection in your eyes.

You need to get a grip on reality.

9/16/2009 12:55:14 PM

i dont see whats wrong with mentioning what the car reminds you of or criticizing performance capabilities


fuck it, lets just talk about this gorgeous interior!

9/16/2009 4:42:23 PM

I'm with ^ & ^^.

I like how the climate controls are on the driver's left arm rest. Keeps a bitch from changing your shit

[Edited on September 16, 2009 at 4:45 PM. Reason : .]

9/16/2009 4:43:50 PM

@fail boat.

without variety, there would only be refinement. And really, if the only new cars that came out were the ever-civilizing of been-nailing-it-forever models such as the subaru impreza, the mitsu evo, the bmw 3 series, the porsche 911, the mustang gt, and the chevrolet corvette, I think I'd have to kill myself. Variety is the spice of life. Having said that, the above cars, in their recently available iterations, are all magnificent. But new permutations keep our obsessions more than merely selecting the best car. Factory Five, Spyker, the cadillac sixteen and cien and evoq (before watered down into the xlr), the chevrolet Volt, the tramontana, the carver, the mclaren f1, the veyron, the bentley hunaudieres, the SSC Aero, the koenigsegg CCX, the paganis, the tvrs, (particularly the tuscan, the sagaris, and the cerbera speed 12), the prodrive p2, the ams murtaya, the ultima GTR, the mosler mt900, the vw w12, the audi avus and rosemeyer, the saleen s7 and (to a lesser degree) aborted s5s raptor, the vw L1, the concept bluesport, the DSG transmissions, all are examples of the flavor that can be utterly pure and unfamiliar at the point of being absolutely new without also being utter shit right out of the gate but requiring endless refinement before becoming interesting.

It is not hard for a car to manage looking "not-derivative." The original Farboud GTS clay shape was one of my favorite ever shapes that didn't absolutely ape something specifically. (somehow something's been lost in translation to the very similar-looking farbio gts production model, IMO). But the significantly-rising wedge shape, almond-shaped headlights, exceedingly-forward reaching and ever-further-reclining windshield shape with ever-thickening a-pillars, inexplicably longer and lower front overhangs, ridiculously visible and therefore probably vainly-useless rearbumper diffusers is somewhat having a jelly-beaning effect on the cars that aren't attempting to do anything useful.

The way that a ford GT or alfa 8c (or the lambo miura concept from a couple of years ago... or the glickenhaus-pininfarina ferrari P4/5... actually another one was the osca 2500gt concept) stands out among lamborghinis (gallardo and murcielago etc) and ferraris (enzo, f430, etc) for old-world charm and soft edges shows that beauty can be managed uniquely when someone wishes to shape a car for looks but hasn't aimed for generic-supercar. Mclaren's effort on the MP4-12c is distinctly grab-bag compared with these. Shit, even without stabbing at absolute beauty a unique and eyegrabbing shape can be managed. Just look at the Jaguar XJR-15 or the Chrysler ME-412. Or what about the Orca C113 or the Vision k2? Or without going for mid-engine, what about the pininfarina argento vivo, the cunningham c7, the callaway c7, the ford GR-1? Sure these are all defunct. But maybe that's because they weren't derivative of the formula that's working. And that "do it this way or fail" stigma is why the mclaren probably looks the way that it does. Who knows what the fuck gumpert or ktm have been thinking lately though. I like the apollo and the X-bow as much as any car guy, but attractive-independent-of-other-merit those cars are NOT.

9/29/2009 4:20:59 PM

Quote :

"aborted s5s raptor"

wait what?!?!

9/29/2009 4:36:03 PM

^ your bewilderment was at the 'aborted' or the 's5s raptor'?

the Saleen S5S Raptor is a concept car shown 1.5 years ago. in my opinion, it has one of the best overall shapes of any supercar, and the front 3/4 view and the
headlights are probably the best of all modern supercars. it strikes the perfect balance of looking equally sensuous (like ferraris) and macho (like lambos).

saleen said at the time that they would sell it for $185,000 in 2010/2011, but who knows, in today's world.

it has a supercharged ethanol-burning 5 litre V8 developing 650 hp!







[Edited on September 29, 2009 at 8:22 PM. Reason : ]

9/29/2009 8:11:02 PM

^thanks, but it was the latter. I've seen the Raptor in person, at the NY Auto Show last year. I was unaware it was aborted?!?

9/29/2009 11:31:03 PM

I have to admit I don't remember where I read that. Maybe it isn't, but I'd be really surprised if it's still on.

9/29/2009 11:54:31 PM

So if the Raptor is not going to be built, that would mean Saleen is no longer a car manufacturer again. Sad.

9/30/2009 8:11:39 AM

Quote :

"Factory Five, Spyker, the cadillac sixteen and cien and evoq (before watered down into the xlr), the chevrolet Volt, the tramontana, the carver, the mclaren f1, the veyron, the bentley hunaudieres, the SSC Aero, the koenigsegg CCX, the paganis, the tvrs, (particularly the tuscan, the sagaris, and the cerbera speed 12), the prodrive p2, the ams murtaya, the ultima GTR, the mosler mt900, the vw w12, the audi avus and rosemeyer, the saleen s7 and (to a lesser degree) aborted s5s raptor, the vw L1, the concept bluesport, the DSG transmissions, all are examples of the flavor that can be utterly pure and unfamiliar at the point of being absolutely new without also being utter shit right out of the gate but requiring endless refinement before becoming interesting."

+1

add Mazda Furai and The Splinter to that. And a couple of those wild BMW concepts that were floating around here

9/30/2009 8:35:50 AM

Quote :

"Just how many designs have their been since the 50s when cars started taking the general shape and appearance they have now. You do realize that most curves/angles/shapes are used up by this point, right?"

that's like saying basically every rhythmic and melodic progression in music has already been covered, which is obviously not the case. If desired, they could have been much more adventurous with the styling. but i'm guessing mcclaren is going more for class than shock value.

that said, i'm really not that impressed with the interior, seems a bit domestic for an otherwise sleek vehicle

[Edited on October 1, 2009 at 12:13 PM. Reason : fghd]

10/1/2009 12:10:47 PM

weak sauce

10/19/2009 8:07:54 AM

Jay Leno gets a ride in a development mule on the Top Gear track... nice footage.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QszDj-aPvYo

12/22/2009 5:17:03 PM

Was it just me or did there seem to be a bit more body roll than you typically see with supercars?

Also, what was attached to the wiper when they were driving in the rain? I can't figure out anything that you would attach to the wiper like that. Anyone have any ideas?

12/22/2009 8:37:22 PM

Latest video. Jenson Button and Hamilton Lewis test drive the car.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zvjEQDNXlhU&feature=player_embedded

Official specs released:

592 hp @ 7,000 rpm
442 lb/ft @ 3,000 rpm
7-speed double clutch gearbox
2,866 lbs dry

3/18/2010 8:28:44 PM

i'll take the matte black one please....

i suppose the XP numbers of these cars continued where the XP number F1 cars left off?

and why no center driving position? they would have sold untolds more just for that very reason.

3/19/2010 1:38:42 AM

bump

7/12/2011 4:47:59 PM

dammit. no center seat. I'm not buying one now.

7/12/2011 5:10:13 PM

^ Thanks.

MP4 sets a phenomenal time on the TG track. Top 20:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Top_Gear_test_track_Power_Lap_Times

1:15.1 - Ariel Atom V8 500
1:16.2 - McLaren MP4-12C
1:16.8 - Bugatti Veyron Super Sport
1:17.1 - Gumpert Apollo S
1:17.3 - Ascari A10
1:17.6 - Koenigsegg CCX (with Top Gear Wing)
1:17.7 - Noble M600 (cold)
1:17.8 - Pagani Zonda Roadster F
1:17.9 - Caterham Seven Superlight R500 (cold)
1:18.3 - Bugatti Veyron 16.4
1:18.4 - Pagani Zonda F
1:18.9 - Maserati MC12
1:19.0 - Lamborghini Murciélago LP670-4 SuperVeloce
1:19.0 - Enzo Ferrari
1:19.1 - Ferrari 458 Italia
1:19.5 - Lamborghini Gallardo LP560-4
1:19.5 - Porsche 997 GT2
1:19.5 - Ariel Atom 2 300
1:19.7 - Nissan GT-R
1:19.7 - Ferrari 430 Scuderia

1:20.4 - Chevrolet Corvette C6 ZR1 (damp)
1:20.7 - Ascari KZ1 (damp)
1:21.6 - Audi R8 V10 (damp)
1:22.8 - Lexus LFA (wet)

7/12/2011 5:35:01 PM

i think the zr-1 would need a lot more then standard deductions..

i mean its not like its a finesse car... it NEEDS traction for brute force to be applied.

i wish they would have posted some vids with traction control off and show what 5th gear did.

that even with TC off stability management will try to kill you before it lets you drift.

7/13/2011 8:06:02 AM

I'm glad to see it trounce the Italia around the TG track.

7/13/2011 9:41:01 AM