http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball

mod edit: to discourage this asshole from writing anything more like this, don't read the article from the site:

Nudged out by 'Pack, Sendek getting best on both sides
Sep. 25, 2009
By Gary Parrish
CBSSports.com Senior Writer
Tell Gary your opinion!

The first quote was typical and anticipated.

"I don't have any great need to compare," Herb Sendek said. But he must've known that wasn't going to prevent me from trying to make him. If not, he was about to find out. Because four seconds later I tried again with a slightly different approach.

"It's important to stay in the present and really not spend a lot of mental energy trying to compare and label and categorize different things," Sendek said, and now I was taking it as a challenge.

You know, like a game.

Things are good for Herb Sendek at Arizona State. (US Presswire)
Things are good for Herb Sendek at Arizona State. (US Presswire)
I decided right then I wasn't getting off the phone until I got Herb Sendek to pat himself on the back a little bit. I wanted him to talk about how well he's been doing since N.C. State fans pushed him to Arizona State in 2006 despite the fact that Sendek was coming off five consecutive NCAA tournament appearances, and I wanted him to contrast it to the current struggles in Raleigh.

North Carolina State hasn't returned to the NCAA tournament since Sendek exited, in case you didn't know. Meantime, Sendek has transformed ASU into a relevant Pac-10 program -- proof being how he won 25 games last season, took the school to the NCAA tournament for the first time since 2003, had one player (James Harden) selected third in the NBA Draft and another picked 31st (Jeff Pendergraph).

Translation: Things are good at Arizona State.

At N.C. State, not so much.

And that's all I wanted Sendek to say.

I wanted him to tell me about how it was obvious given his record (more on that in a minute) that he was a good coach doing good things at N.C. State, and how he now looks back and laughs at those fans who just knew they deserved better. And I wanted him to tell me all this while dropping in various remarks about how nice the weather is in Tempe and how the new practice facility is off the charts, and if he wanted to comment briefly on the quality of ASU's student body, I was ready to listen to that, too.

In other words, I wanted Herb Sendek to say what I'd say.

To be like I'd be.

And probably how you'd be, too.

"It's human nature to be that way," Arizona State senior Derek Glasser said. "But one of the things Coach Sendek always talks to us about is how to not worry about the last play or the last game or anything like that, how to just let it go. So I really don't think he focuses on N.C. State at all, because he's not the type of person to focus on the past."

Well, then allow me to do it for him.

Because Sendek really has pulled off a rarity.

He's not only doing better than the previous coach (Rob Evans) at his new school (ASU), but he's also doing better than the coach (Sidney Lowe) his old school (N.C. State) hired to replace him after his old school -- and its fan base -- decided it no longer appreciated his talent. The way Sendek was treated looked silly then, and it looks even sillier now considering the Wolfpack have finished 10th, 12th and 10th in the ACC standings the past three seasons with zero NCAA tournament appearances and 15 league wins.

How does that compare to Sendek?

The Wolfpack finished third, fourth, second, sixth and fourth in the ACC in his final five seasons with five NCAA tournament appearances and 46 league wins. So it's not even a comparison, really. And to all the N.C. State fans who like to highlight Sendek's not-so-great record against in-state rivals North Carolina and Duke, I would just remind you (for the 487th time) that almost anybody would have a not-so-great record against UNC and Duke, and to judge Sendek at N.C. State against those two monsters would be like me judging myself against Brad Pitt and George Clooney.

I'm finishing a distant third in that race every time.

Why?

Because I'm not Brad Pitt or George Clooney, that's why.

Just like N.C. State isn't North Carolina or Duke, and that N.C. State didn't realize that three years ago now has the school picked by many to finish last in the ACC this season (that would make four consecutive 10th-or-worse finishes) while the coach it ran off spends his days being appreciated 2,100 miles west. To be clear, I can't tell you Sendek will return to the 2010 NCAA tournament because he lost his top two players from last season's team. But what I can tell you is that he won't finish last in his league or get fired come March, and that, by definition, means he's doing better than the guy hired to replace him at the school he left behind when said school's fans wouldn't get off his behind and just let him win.

N.C. State wanted more.

But now it's accomplishing way less.

And Herb Sendek couldn't care less, best I can tell.

He could be bitter and arrogant, and it would be justified, for sure. But Sendek honestly doesn't seem to think about N.C. State at all, instead choosing to focus his energy on a present that's enjoyable and a future that seems bright given that he's already committed three prospects from the Class of 2010 -- among them Keala King, a 6-foot-5 guard whom Rivals.com ranks as the nation's 25th-best recruit.

"There's no question that we've made considerable progress on every front and that there's a very different perception of Arizona State basketball on a national level," Sendek said. "We have a fair amount of momentum right now."

At N.C. State, not so much.

For more from Gary Parrish, check him out on Twitter: @GaryParrishCBS

9/27/2009 12:15:42 PM

Old..just old

9/27/2009 12:16:20 PM

I don't have the time like yourself to watch every post on here...

9/27/2009 12:17:27 PM

it's cool, we have Sidney Lowe.



edit: I forgot to add my rolly eyes

[Edited on September 27, 2009 at 12:21 PM. Reason : []

9/27/2009 12:19:39 PM

ibtl

9/27/2009 12:20:27 PM

gay


how many times are they going to put lipstick on a pig?

this has been done sooooo many times

he doesnt even use SOS, recruiting ranks, anything other than wins and losses and he hardly even uses them.

9/27/2009 12:22:12 PM

http://thewolfweb.com/message_topic.aspx?topic=400622

9/27/2009 12:24:13 PM

He actually posted a follow up that is even more scathing. Bottom left on the main page of that link.

^^ well, to be fair, Herb's last class (2005) was ranked higher on Scout.com than any class we've had under Lowe. So, to say that he is recruiting "better" than Sendek is uninformed at best and revisionist lying at worst.

** I just realized that may have sounded like I was calling YOU a liar JT3, but I didn't mean to... just the people that use that argument, which does happen on here. I know you gave no opinion on it.

[Edited on September 27, 2009 at 12:27 PM. Reason : x]

9/27/2009 12:24:51 PM

i dont follow sendek anymore, but does he still use that princeton offense stuff over in tempe

9/27/2009 12:27:14 PM

im comparing ASU to NC State

not Herb to Lowe which is ridiculous.

9/27/2009 12:27:15 PM

I would argue the better comparison is Herb to Lowe while here... ASU and the southwest is a totally different recruiting scene. Just my opinion...

Anyway, this whole argument is so overdone...

9/27/2009 12:28:28 PM

what's he doing writing this article in september of this year? this is bush league journalism at best. he obviously hasn't done any of his homework and really didn't have much posted from his said interview. how weak do you have to be to write an entire article about what you wish the man had said instead of what he actually said. he's just trying to increase his readership by pissing people off because he's obviously struggling.

9/27/2009 12:29:01 PM

He could have wrote that article in one sentence:

Herb Sendek is a better coach than Sidney Lowe.

9/27/2009 12:29:42 PM

I thought the reader comments were good especially the first post.

9/27/2009 12:31:07 PM

Quote :

"what's he doing writing this article in september of this year?"

maybe because the basketball season starts in 4 1/2 weeks

9/27/2009 12:34:26 PM

This year will be a good year for really judging Herb out there. I don't follow GaySU, so I have no idea what they have recruited lately, but you just have to assume it isn't going to be easy to repeat last year when you sent a #3 and #31 pick to the next level.

9/27/2009 12:42:13 PM

^^reading it seems very dated though, he doesn't offer any new information to support his argument, he's still bringing up stuff from 3 and 4 years ago.

[Edited on September 27, 2009 at 12:43 PM. Reason : .]

9/27/2009 12:43:00 PM

^^ at least he did something with those recruits. We had our chance with Hickson and we sucked cock.

9/27/2009 12:44:35 PM

Fuck off. My comment had nothing to do with NC State.

9/27/2009 12:45:55 PM

here it comes...

9/27/2009 12:47:07 PM

who gives a shit how old the article is. It's painfully accurate.

9/27/2009 12:48:42 PM

Quote :

"I have no idea what they have recruited lately"

the best part about this season's recruits is that with his five 2009 recruits, he fills all 5 positions....granted it was only one 4-star and four 3-stars

[Edited on September 27, 2009 at 12:50 PM. Reason : /]

9/27/2009 12:49:35 PM

[Edited on September 27, 2009 at 12:51 PM. Reason : oh ok, i was confused why you directed that to me]

9/27/2009 12:50:59 PM

added the article to the first post, don't give this guy pageviews please

9/27/2009 1:14:30 PM

does this bother you because of how right he is? i hope it stings a little

9/27/2009 1:53:59 PM

This guy is right. I miss Herb.

9/27/2009 2:17:57 PM

^well, that' like, your opinion man.

9/27/2009 2:31:12 PM

i always liked herb when he was here, as some of you may remember, and am not surprised to see him succeed at arizona state. i still think we have a good coach in sidney lowe though, and a transition from herb's style to sid's is something that takes time. i think the next 2-3 years for sid will be the real indicator for where our program is heading with him at the helm.

9/27/2009 2:53:22 PM

yeah, he looks like someone who went to UNC

9/27/2009 3:30:56 PM

^^agreed. i always supported him while he was here and i feel like he made the best move to leave when he did. i think we'll be better off as time progresses and it'll taste even sweeter since the whole world is doubting us.

^also, nice orange tanner, eh?!

[Edited on September 27, 2009 at 3:34 PM. Reason : .]

9/27/2009 3:33:52 PM

i don't wanna beat this anymore...i liked Herb when he was here, but he had a ceiling. The writer is sortof admitting that and then chastises us for not accepting mediocrity. It wasn't that we didn't get to the Elite Eight, its HOW we didn't get to the elite eight. The loss that year to Vanderbilt...just unacceptable really. And that was sendek, weave and heave. [/me]

9/27/2009 4:20:17 PM

will the first article written about Herb Sendek's retirement be "Coach has successful career after being forced out from NC State" ?

9/27/2009 4:21:31 PM

^^I contribute the loss to Vandy on Matt fucking Freije making everything and a ridiculous phantom intentional foul call on Marcus Melvin. Not sure how Sendek could be blamed for that one. Wisconsin maybe but Vandy wasn't much in his control.

9/27/2009 4:27:51 PM

Wisconsin maybe?

9/27/2009 4:31:23 PM

Quote :

"ridiculous phantom intentional foul call on Marcus Melvin. Not sure how Sendek could be blamed for that one."

i remember writing this about that vandy game after it happened

Quote :

"we made a great comeback in the second half, and evtimov had a wonderful performance with 28 points, 5 rebs, and 4 assists. our shooting was terrible in the first half (like most games), but it really looked like we were gonna win it with a much better second half. we took care of the ball pretty well too, only 6 turnovers. a lot can change a matter of seconds though. just like the foul call in the tournament game against uconn 2 years ago, the technical foul called on our trainer in the maryland game in the acc tournment this year, and many other calls that i've questioned throughout the years, all our hopes come crashing down with the blow of a whistle. the intentional foul on melvin and the foul on hodge to send him to the bench with 5 fouls were some of the worst calls that i've seen in a while. if they were gonna call that foul on hodge, then they should've called the same foul when atsur was knocked down taking the final shot of the game. it was just about the same situation with completely different results. it's been a long time since we've been to the sweet sixteen, and it's been just as long since we've had calls go our way. i don't like to blame a game on officiating because we dig our own holes sometimes with flat out poor play, but this was just ridiculous. i was looking forward to watching us play on my birthday and seeing scooter play one last game for us, but i guess that's how it goes. i'm disgusted."

9/27/2009 4:37:26 PM

So this guy says we are the "at best the 3rd best basketball team in NC" and then calls us out for trying something to get to #1.

Monday Morning QB Time!!

What a winning arguement!

[Edited on September 27, 2009 at 9:39 PM. Reason : .]

9/27/2009 9:37:26 PM

you're right, we tried to get #1 (Calipari)
and #2 (Barnes)
and #3
#4
#5
#6
#7
#8
...............

Lowe

9/27/2009 9:39:23 PM

He makes it seem like Herb wasnt given a chance to succeed.

How many years was Herb here before the 5 consecutive NCAA run? I bet Gary has not followed NC State Basketball for any period of time.

9/27/2009 9:46:13 PM

^^I would like to add:
Fire Lee Fowler.

9/27/2009 9:54:37 PM

lol this is exactly what i would've written

i was mad as fuck the day they fired Sendek

fucking retarded

^^like, 4 years.




yes, i realize he wasn't fired. but that's just semantics. he was run the fuck off.

[Edited on September 28, 2009 at 9:10 AM. Reason : asdfasfasa]

9/28/2009 9:01:58 AM

No one fired Sendek

9/28/2009 9:05:33 AM

Quote :

"lol this is exactly what i would've written i was mad as fuck the day they fired Sendek fucking retarded "

Look at how dumb you are.

You are almost as dumb as the writer, almost.

9/28/2009 9:08:39 AM

you were mad that day? really?

because I don't think that day ever existed.

Honestly, the only thing Herb's success and our struggles illustrate to me is.

Quote :

"Fire Lee Fowler."

[Edited on September 28, 2009 at 9:13 AM. Reason : d]

9/28/2009 9:10:51 AM

see update.

i'll always contend he was fired. i am fully aware he wasn't fired.

9/28/2009 9:10:55 AM

in tangential commentary, if Lowe takes 5 State teams in a row to the dance, I'll eat my own shit, with an audience.

9/28/2009 9:12:56 AM

Quote :

"How many years was Herb here before the 5 consecutive NCAA run? I bet Gary has not followed NC State Basketball for any period of time."

5. But the whole idea of moving on from Sendek that is he brought us from absolutely 100% horrific to very respectable and competitive in the best conference in the country. The idea was to upgrade quickly and get past that level by building off the momentum that we built up. Unfortunately, we have regressed ten-fold. Notice in the article it says that other schools did the same thing but it's a bit easier to stomach when, less than 2 years after the previous coach was fired/run out/whatever they either made Final 4's or have the best recruiting class in history. We have... 3 straight double digit finishes in the ACC and another one likely on the way.

I think even the most ardent Herb Sendek supporters acknowledged that he plateaued in the tournament. Could he have gotten us farther? Absolutely. There is always that chance in the NCAAs and anyone who says definitively that he couldn't doesn't understand the sport and isn't worth speaking about it with. But I also don't think his system here was conducive to beating the most athletic teams that you typically face in the second weekend.

I was in the camp that didn't think NC State was as attractive a job as most do. I have the ability, not growing up in NC, to be able to look at the situation objectively. I did think we would be able to get a up and comer (like Pearl the year before) and think that route would have been the better way. But we were so dead-set on the "big hire" that we completely blew it. I blame Lee Fowler, but also the internal pressure from the fans on being instantly relevant again with the big name.

[Edited on September 28, 2009 at 9:15 AM. Reason : x]

9/28/2009 9:14:14 AM

I, too, have long hoped that Lee Fowler will be vaporized into thin air.

9/28/2009 9:14:17 AM

fired

9/28/2009 9:14:22 AM

http://www.statefansnation.com/index.php/archives/2009/08/19/119-in-the-country-is-nc-state-basketball-going-to-be-this-bad/

i mean...

9/28/2009 9:17:04 AM

I guess all of our early tournament exits were just pure coincidence, nothing to do with an outdated offense that consisted of throwing up 3's every possession. The honeymoon will end at ASU and they will get tired of seeing the same crap on the court, game after game.

9/28/2009 9:18:16 AM