http://www.wral.com/news/state/story/8699824/

Thats really what this announcement is, is that state universities and colleges are now private.

So as one of the GOLO comments on this story says, whos picking up UNC first for sponsorship?

This is just begging for a lawsuit, as its in state law (and maybe constitution) that the state is required to support these schools. I know its tough times but wheres taxes and why are we spending on some of the crap we are?

NOTE: I put this here instead of TSB, as I believe this will seriously affect students, therefore is more general news, vs political.

11/30/2010 2:39:51 PM

this is a scare tactic to lubricate the public against upcoming tax increases that will 'save' public universities.

11/30/2010 2:43:30 PM

Didn't Bowles say a couple weeks ago if the state government kept cutting university funding they were going to have to shut down one of UNC's campuses

11/30/2010 2:58:07 PM

nobody would really miss unc Pembroke anyway

11/30/2010 3:00:18 PM

Serious question here: Why does it seem that we have a budget shortfall every year? How are our needs so far beyond our ability to finance?

11/30/2010 3:05:13 PM

gotta get that lotto money! what a joke, lets steal some money from somewhere else now

11/30/2010 3:10:17 PM

Quote :

"nobody would really miss unc Pembroke anyway"

11/30/2010 3:28:27 PM

Quote :

"Didn't Bowles say a couple weeks ago if the state government kept cutting university funding they were going to have to shut down one of UNC's campuses "

I doubt theyd close one of the "UNC" campuses but I could see them closing something like FSU or Elizabeth City State.

11/30/2010 3:29:45 PM

bev purdue has had nothing but one big middle finger for the public university system since she gained the office, so i'm not surprised

that said, i have to grudgingly admit that if any large sector of the NC government has the best ability to raise private funds, it's the university system...despite NC's mediocre primary education, our university system as a whole is very good and very diverse...we likely have more schools than we "need," and so closing one of the "meh" schools isn't a horrible option (for the system as a whole, i mean...it would really really REALLY suck to be a student, staff, or faculty of whatever school closed)...the big ones are safe, of course

[Edited on November 30, 2010 at 3:52 PM. Reason : .]

11/30/2010 3:49:47 PM

^^

Quote :

"CHAPEL HILL -- UNC system President Erskine Bowles painted a bleak picture Thursday of the UNC system if the more severe of two budget-cutting scenarios is necessary. As many as 1,700 jobs could be lost, he said. Bowles even suggested that if North Carolina's economic health doesn't improve, the UNC system may eventually have to close a campus - which he called a smarter strategic and fiscal move than simply chipping away at every university in the system. "

Read more: http://www.newsobserver.com/2010/11/05/782252/unc-worst-cuts-plan-is-grim.html#ixzz16nn2WBkV

I like to pretend it would be UNC-CH they'd close down

11/30/2010 3:53:37 PM

Well. After having to take a pay cut in the aftermath of the 2009 budget hammer, I'm legitimately concerned about getting laid off if this one goes through. Oh joy.

11/30/2010 4:03:53 PM

UNC-CH would be the last to go, sadly

11/30/2010 4:27:59 PM

Bev Purdue is spending all the money building big 8 lane roads to nowhere and freeways to the dairy farms in her home area of New Bern

11/30/2010 9:49:03 PM

^^ Dude not to wave the UNC towel, but I prefer well trained doctors from there than STDU. NCSU and UNC are the keeps of the NC higher educational system.

Between the two you got everything you need for a society

Engineers
Scientists
Doctors
Dentists
Nurses
Lawyers
Vets
Agriculture Experts

11/30/2010 9:58:56 PM

Quote :

"Serious question here: Why does it seem that we have a budget shortfall every year? How are our needs so far beyond our ability to finance?"

Because politicians have no fucking concept of a rainy day fund. They spend every fucking dime they get their grubby hands on and justify issuing bonds (ie, borrowing money) to spend above and beyond what the revenue is. And the future revenue streams are modeled (likely by some paid for consultant) and we all know that models of economics fucking suck in one way or the other.

11/30/2010 10:02:37 PM

I can't help but think that if this were a reality, medical and defense industries would most likely be the ones to fund the universities. Having said that, I am very scared at the type of research/results that would undoubtedly be mandated by the private sector and produced by universities.
Yeah, we do a lot of research in the private sector, but it is very heavily influenced by cost, schedules, and budgets. It's sad, really, because universities offer what is often the very last form of pure scientific research.... that is, research concerned with getting the true answer instead of the "right" answer.

11/30/2010 10:16:04 PM

11/30/2010 10:49:52 PM

Quote :

"...universities offer what is often the very last form of pure scientific research.... that is, research concerned with getting the true answer instead of the "right" answer."

lol, you obviously haven't tried to participate in university research lately.

11/30/2010 11:04:40 PM

Quote :

"this is a scare tactic to lubricate the public against upcoming tax increases that will 'save' public universities"

I agree that this is absolutely a political move to call the public to arms in defense of the university system. I disagree about the tax increase though. The GOP controls the general assembly as a result of the election at nearly veto proof levels, I some how doubt they plan on a tax increase. Given that level of control, public opinion is one of the few remaining tools in the toolbox in defense of the public universities. So I imagine it is seen by some as politicking over a budget at its worst, and by others as raising awareness for important investments in the future.

As I mentioned over in the soap box just after the election:

Quote :

"I saw an old budgeting professor yesterday who I haven't seen in about a year, and he was talking about the election results. He's a pretty conservative guy, but he still seemed a little bummed about the results b/c he felt the GOP wont give the university system special consideration when doing the cuts, they'll be as vulnerable as everyone else."

11/30/2010 11:57:40 PM

If they shut down Elizabeth City State, my poor little town might go broke

12/1/2010 1:01:03 AM

Quote :

"universities offer what is often the very last form of pure scientific research.... that is, research concerned with getting the true answer instead of the "right" answer."

i'm gonna have to agree with lewoods on this one...you quite obviously don't have an advanced degree in the life sciences (and by this i mean just about everything that isn't humanities or engineering) if you think that universities engage in "pure" scientific research with the goal of the "true" answer

this is a generalization, of course...but those will experience will be happy to tell you that it's oftentimes more about justifying your grant than getting real results...if you get valid, non-skewed results and some useful data out of the deal, it's a bonus

[Edited on December 1, 2010 at 8:40 AM. Reason : .]

12/1/2010 8:36:26 AM

gotta get dem papers

12/1/2010 10:02:14 AM

why would she do that to her face?

12/1/2010 10:06:03 AM

^Why so serious?

I'm less worried about the universities and more worried about the job cuts in public schools next year. It just feels like every year we're looking at the same stuff: There's a budget shortage; we'll have to eliminate jobs to free up funds.

12/1/2010 10:11:32 AM

Quote :

"bev purdue has had nothing but one big middle finger for the public university system since she gained the office, so i'm not surprised"

That's kind of funny, since my (admittedly bad) memory has a "grass roots" teachers movement as being one of the principle factors as to how she got elected.

And yeah, they always go after education. That's the easiest/laziest way to solve budget problems. Just divert a billion dollars from education, then appeal to people to pass a billion dollar referendum. Don't cut where legitimate cuts should be made, just lash out at education and put the taxpayers in the situation where they have to decide between two bad choices.

[Edited on December 1, 2010 at 10:38 AM. Reason : -]

12/1/2010 10:36:35 AM

Quote :

"That's kind of funny, since my (admittedly bad) memory has a "grass roots" teachers movement as being one of the principle factors as to how she got elected."

you're not wrong...admittedly, i voted for her BECAUSE of my belief that she would support education when the rubber hit the road

also, how is education in danger with all of these millions of dollars we're supposedly raising with the lottery? horse shit, all of it.

all that said, i'd still rather see the university system take the hit than primary education

[Edited on December 1, 2010 at 1:00 PM. Reason : .]

12/1/2010 1:00:05 PM

I really wish we could get up the political will to start calling our politicians bluffs on this sort of thing. Everyone seems to recognize that these are scare tactics, but in the end, it always seems like the politicians win.

12/1/2010 5:28:00 PM

Quote :

"BobbyDigital: this is a scare tactic to lubricate the public against upcoming tax increases that will 'save' public universities."

Probably, but it's also sending a message to the University system to start jacking tuition rates even more.

I'd expect another $1000/yr increase per in-state undergrads this coming year, comparable for out-of-staters too

12/1/2010 6:05:07 PM

Meh, depends on the program, degree, field of study, and institution I guess. I seem to recall doing a lot of research in undergrad for the NIH... and even more so in grad school for the NIH and DOT. All research with the goal of doing solid and pure research, with sound methodologies in order to get a true answer.
And even today (though I'm in the private sector), we work closely with the universities giving them research to go out and do. Reason being, we have serious questions that we need answered, but haven't the time to go and do the research ourselves. Yes, we're looking for the true answer here.

But anyway, the point I was getting at was that if the private sector was actually paying for this research to happen, then they would most likely have a much heavier influence on the results as well.

12/1/2010 6:29:57 PM

Quote :

"nobody would really miss unc Pembroke anyway"

12/1/2010 9:59:27 PM

I don't think anyone will miss WCU either. So there you have it --

Close UNC-P and WCU, crisis averted.

12/1/2010 10:35:14 PM

unc-p would be a good option to close, but so would elizabeth city state.

12/1/2010 11:49:38 PM

Doubt they'd close ECSU, there's not much education-wise in that part of the state and the legislators down east would flip. First likely candidate that was being discussed before the budget crisis was shutting down NCAT or merging it into UNCG (so you'd have a UNCG East Campus and UNCG West Campus). Merging FSU and UNCP would probably be #2.

But realistically there are too many influential alumni from all 17 UNC institutions for any of them to ever shut down -- we'll see tuition and fees triple or quadruple first, and end up like Virginia

12/2/2010 12:00:20 AM

When are we going to find an NC politician who values education?

12/2/2010 12:38:51 AM

Quote :

"Close UNC-P and WCU, crisis averted."

We need WCU for a those guaranteed football wins.

12/2/2010 2:15:51 AM

^^I think it comes down to, if you want it done right, do it yourself (or at least actively support someone you believe in). PTAs, School Boards, and County Commissions are good places to get involved locally.

2 NC State students ran for City Council recently, and an NC State student just won the Wake County Soil & Water Supervisor position. Of course volunteering for campaigns is a lot easier and one can support larger scale offices.

A key thing to watch is who the GOP puts in control of the education related committees in the General Assembly when they officially take over in January.

12/2/2010 3:40:14 AM

I didnt see this posted above, but didnt look too closely...

The flagship universities are primarily supported by grants and private gifts already. More than 50% of UNC Chapel Hills total operating costs are funded by outside sources. I think the state only contributes about 25-30% (I cant give you a source, but I hear this from management).

UVA is funded even less by the state of Virginia, and has threatened to pull themselves away from state funding completely because the state gets to direct them without footing most of the bill.

So, I think Bev's statement was ignorant.

[Edited on December 2, 2010 at 10:48 AM. Reason : .]

12/2/2010 10:46:40 AM

Quote :

"UVA is funded even less by the state of Virginia, and has threatened to pull themselves away from state funding completely because the state gets to direct them without footing most of the bill. "

Virginia is also in much worse shape economically than NC. The state government is completely broke.

12/2/2010 11:05:31 AM

Quote :

"I don't think anyone will miss WCU either. So there you have it --"

WCU has the only B.S. in emergency medical sciences program in the state.

12/3/2010 1:07:26 AM

^Take faculty in this program and move them to any other college of your choice. Crisis averted.

12/3/2010 3:44:27 PM

^5th oldest school in the UNC system wont be going anywhere

12/3/2010 3:47:26 PM

Yeah I can't see them shutting down WCU. It's pretty much the only higher education available in that part of the state.

12/3/2010 3:56:30 PM

Quote :

"CarZin: The flagship universities are primarily supported by grants and private gifts already. More than 50% of UNC Chapel Hills total operating costs are funded by outside sources. I think the state only contributes about 25-30% (I cant give you a source, but I hear this from management)"

Depends on whether or not you count UNC Hospitals as part of the UNCCH budget. The state does, but the bulk of UNC Hospitals operations aren't educational in nature.

Looking just at the academic spending, the state provides about 46%ish of the operating budgets for UNCCH and NCSU both. That's why cuts in appropriations lead to such devastating tuition increases (which only make up about 15% of operations) -- for every $1 in state appropriations cut, you're basically having to raise tuition by $3.

The Guv's statement was still dumb as hell though, I agree with you on that one

---

Quote :

"CarZin: UVA is funded even less by the state of Virginia, and has threatened to pull themselves away from state funding completely because the state gets to direct them without footing most of the bill."

The second half of this isn't quite right. UVA, Virginia Tech, and William & Mary pushed a restructuring of Virginia's higher ed system through the state legislature back in 2005. They now get almost no funding from the state, and in exchange have near-absolute autonomy over everything (including tuition/fee rates). That was/is the end result of them "pulling away" -- they're now basically public in name only, and don't get directed by the state at all.

It's why UVA is so f*cking expensive (a tuition-hiking trend that started long before the '05 withdrawal). And why people like me fled Virginia to go to UNC-system institutions  

12/4/2010 2:03:26 AM

WCU is a cool little college town. FSU, ECSU, and UNCP are all pathetic excuses for a college.

12/4/2010 2:26:00 AM

^

12/5/2010 5:45:50 AM

ECSU?

12/5/2010 9:21:58 AM

^Elizabeth City State University

12/5/2010 10:07:50 AM

ahh, totally forgot about that one.

12/5/2010 2:24:40 PM

I think most people do.

12/6/2010 9:16:38 AM

good point.

12/6/2010 9:46:28 AM