background: went to ncsu in comp sci, dropped out to start a company, company went well, major major set back, currently working full time at SAS. still no degree

scenario: I'm a citizen of the US and barbados and am in the process of starting a company in barbados (lots of legal process and permits). this process has been very long and honestly doesn't have a clear time frame. I'm unhappy with my current job. I work on an internal product outside of the company's core competency so my group doesn't get budget, freedom, or resources to move at the pace I design or an happy with. I have a LOT of freedom however, that lets me easily manage my business in barbados while it's in this gestation period but my current salary is garbage (lowest 1% of the scale for my actual job).

option 1: I can find another job locally, making ~50-100% more money, though i probably lose the 25 hour work week and complete freedom of hours. gain challenges, hopefully, but will likely lose a lot of time that i currently spend on things outside of work.

option 2: I can leave my job and go back to school. The issues with this are I'm mainly interested in human computer interaction and have my sights set on stanford if and when I do go back. Paying for school isn't really an issue, but I would have people going out on a limb to let me in to the school and I'm not certain how long of a window I'd have to stay out there and finish and validate those who helped me. Though, once you're in, you're in, right? Once admitted you can generally come back whenever?

option 3: I have job offers in other parts of the US that pay much more but they are in areas where the cost of living is higher. This combined with the fact that I wouldn't have a place to live (my house is paid for here in raleigh) mostly washes out any benefits to a new non-local job except for the new mental challenge and likely increased freedom and clout.

option 4: what im currently doing. im doing most of the r&d (one of my favorite parts of my business) on my own time here, coasting at work, and enjoying time for hobbies; motorcycle racing, video games, getting back into martial arts. it's low stress but i really don't feel challenged and i feel the disease of complacency creeping in. also, i have a really hard time meeting people in my age group with a similar combination of interests, disposable income (most of the stuff I enjoy isn't cheap unfortunately), and lack of responsibility so I'm left to pursue a lot of my interests solo, and that's just not as much fun as it could be.

my ultimate goal is to run my business in barbados, expand to other islands, go public and just retain a seat on the board. after that i really just want to go back to school and do research and fund/design new projects as they present themselves.

this might all sound like a bunch of pie in the sky ideas but i can assure anyone reading this that i've put a LOT into my companies over many years and am very well connected in barbados so there's a strong likelihood of things working out there... once they ever get going (my international business license review has been going since september ). however, i do recognize contingencies and backup plans need to exist.

so what say ye, lounge? have I fucked up in typing this out?

2/5/2011 12:47:25 PM

1. You work at SAS.
2. You have a business in Barbados.

I should be asking you for advice.

if you're passionate about the business and that's your ultimate goal, option 4 sounds good

2/5/2011 12:57:12 PM

Hmm...

Can you work on your undergrad degree now while you have lots of time, as well as building your business? Then worry about grad school later when you feel ready to go? Grad school isn't going to take a walk anytime soon, but you may want to get it over with before marriage and kids.

Personally, lots of people want to be in your current position with a slack job and lots of time for fun stuff- would making lots of money and not having as much free time make up for that? Something you have to weigh I guess.

2/5/2011 1:49:31 PM

EuroTit has a point- pretty enviable dilemna to have, you are still doing pretty well for yourself.

I respect the desire to constantly be challenged though.

I tend to agree that option 4 is the best especailly if you challenge yourself with track days and turn one courses, getting back into martial arts, and also challenge yourself to continually research and plan for your barbados business so that when things can actually happen you are ready to pounce on the oppurtunity and execute well and better than any competitors.

I also have absolutely no personal bias towards option 4

option 3- Maybe if you looked for potential roomates with similar personal interests in the other cities you could be looking for cheaper living since you spilt the rent and a built in way to meet people with similar interests?

option 2- cant hurt to apply and look into this similtaneously with whatever option you are pursuing with work.

2/5/2011 2:00:09 PM

I'll throw my 2 cents for all 4 options (based on my experiences).

1) Money isn't everything. If you are working 25 hrs/wk, that 100% pay increase is likely going to consumer 50+ hrs/wk. Which isn't really netting you any more money per hour worked. If your eventual goal is the business in barbados, this is only going to set you back even further.

2) This is not a bad idea, but keep your eyes open (for instance, Carnegie Mellon, MIT and at least a half dozen other schools that I can't remember at the moment offer top notch HCI concentrations). If you go back to school ONLY do school. I learned this lesson the hard way, it took me almost 8 years to finish my MID because I thought I could handle both at the same time. And no, once you're admitted you cannot just come back whenever.

Most schools give you one semester before you have to reapply for admission. And it's a giant fucking pain in the ass (and expensive).

3) Don't move for money. It never works out well. And you aren't going to get any increased freedom or clout with a new company until you've established yourself there. And judging by your long term goals, you aren't likely to be around long enough to really do that.

4) IMHO this is your best option. The grass always seems greener on the other side. I have fallen into this trap many times and am just now really starting to learn to think outside of my current environment to see how fortunate I am. EuroTitToss really sums that up well.

It seems most inline with your long term goals, it pays the bills, and it lets you do what you are good at doing (even if you want to do more than you're able to). I can tell you that meeting people isn't going to be any easier or different anywhere else. It's a LOT easier to meet people casually in the south than most other areas of the country. You might just take a step back and think about how you can change your habits to meet new people.

2/5/2011 3:29:18 PM

what are your realistic odds of:

Quote :

"stanford"

(that shit's expensive)

and go with this:

Quote :

"I tend to agree that option 4 is the best especailly if you challenge yourself with track days and turn one courses, getting back into martial arts, and also challenge yourself to continually research and plan for your barbados business so that when things can actually happen you are ready to pounce on the oppurtunity and execute well and better than any competitors. "

2/6/2011 1:34:36 AM

I agree with the "grass is always greener" point of view. Keep coasting right now and wait until your business shit gets straight in Barbados. The problem we all have is sometimes we feel like we need to "do something" when the best solution can be to coast for a while.

This economy has shown us that in many cases, especially in tech industries, a degree isn't a guarantee of anything. If you really want the the lifestyle of being back in school then go for it, but as a way to enhance your career going back to school may just be wasted time that you could be spent actually in industry.

2/6/2011 12:22:55 PM

also if you are feeling socially isolated now, when you move it could easily get worse before it gets better.

2/6/2011 12:24:25 PM

The only thing I can advise doing in the next few years is to go finish your undergraduate degree while you have the time. I'm not sure if NC State has done this yet, but what if they have a rule where you need to finish a degree in 10 years. You don't want to be out all of your previous education.

2/6/2011 12:51:56 PM

the degree really has nothing to do with my career but my personal interests. I should follow up with ncsu and see what the statute of limitations on my degree is. might try to knock it out online or something. general eds and shitty basic csc classes were what drove me out of school

2/6/2011 11:13:21 PM

The clear answer here is to get another dsm so it breaks and keeps you entertained indefinitely

2/10/2011 11:23:30 AM

If you are lucky you might have me as a TA.

2/10/2011 11:28:53 AM

you TA'in comp sci?

2/10/2011 1:57:19 PM

Nope. I forget that other departments don't make their students take a lot of courses in other departments.

2/10/2011 2:29:13 PM

Thankfully.

option 4

2/10/2011 2:49:59 PM

You and I have talked a lot over the years about this kind of stuff. It's pretty funny how directly our lives parallel each other sometimes.

That being said here's my inputs on junk because - suprisingly enough - I am planning on making major changes this year, too.

Quote :

"option 1: I can find another job locally, making ~50-100% more money, though i probably lose the 25 hour work week and complete freedom of hours. gain challenges, hopefully, but will likely lose a lot of time that i currently spend on things outside of work."

I wouldn't bother with this. It seems like the lowest common denominator, and like you're just trying to get out of the situation you're in now. A blind leap, as it were. It could work out, but it could just as easily NOT work.

Quote :

"option 2: I can leave my job and go back to school. The issues with this are I'm mainly interested in human computer interaction and have my sights set on stanford if and when I do go back. Paying for school isn't really an issue, but I would have people going out on a limb to let me in to the school and I'm not certain how long of a window I'd have to stay out there and finish and validate those who helped me. Though, once you're in, you're in, right? Once admitted you can generally come back whenever?"

The thing about school is that you have to dedicate yourself to it if you go back, otherwise you will HATE your life. I've been close to going back a few times, but I just can't deal with that lifestyle anymore. It's a cop out, but for me it's like taking two steps backwards to go finish a degree in stuff that I've already been doing for 5 years.

For you, it may be a way you want to go, but I wouldn't put a huge amount of reverence in the name on the degree. I've worked with HCI grads from all over - VT, Carnegie Mellon, UT, UCF, State - and it doesn't matter where they went, the key is that they know their shit, and they are subject matter experts. The name of the institution you went to isn't nearly as important out in the field as the work you do.

Quote :

"option 3: I have job offers in other parts of the US that pay much more but they are in areas where the cost of living is higher. This combined with the fact that I wouldn't have a place to live (my house is paid for here in raleigh) mostly washes out any benefits to a new non-local job except for the new mental challenge and likely increased freedom and clout."

Don't move just for money. See #1. Blind leap, and you have even less of an idea if you'll be miserable or not. I'm trying to move this year, but only after I've done the requisite due diligence.

My checklist:
Will I love the area?
Will I love the job?
Will I love my teammates?
Will I be adequately compensated?

Quote :

"option 4: what im currently doing. im doing most of the r&d (one of my favorite parts of my business) on my own time here, coasting at work, and enjoying time for hobbies; motorcycle racing, video games, getting back into martial arts. it's low stress but i really don't feel challenged and i feel the disease of complacency creeping in. also, i have a really hard time meeting people in my age group with a similar combination of interests, disposable income (most of the stuff I enjoy isn't cheap unfortunately), and lack of responsibility so I'm left to pursue a lot of my interests solo, and that's just not as much fun as it could be. "

Complacency sucks. If you ever feel it creeping in, you need to start pushing yourself harder. Saying this about your current situation means that you need to evaluate - which you seem to have done here.

Low stress is always nice for people to talk about, but in application I always find myself needing SOME sort of stress to keep my life together. A lack of stress is not a good thing for me, be it professionally or personally. It doesn't have to be crazy - I don't want to feel like I'm balanced on a knife edge all the time - but I need something to push back on.



That being said - I think maybe you should either go back to school, or move IF the situation is right for you.

[Edited on February 10, 2011 at 9:11 PM. Reason : .]

2/10/2011 9:10:37 PM

you might want to check if grad schools will accept you without an undergraduate degree. If not, that would be the answer to option 2: go back to school to get undergrad degree.

2/14/2011 2:34:29 PM