My dogs are on an all raw diet and have been for years. I've got 2 dobermans and a miniature schnauzer.

Anybody else doing this?
If so, how has it worked for you?
What kind of dogs?
What are some problems you have had to overcome?
Problems you're still dealing with?
Where to buy meat on the cheap and in bulk?
Other questions?



[Edited on December 6, 2011 at 6:38 PM. Reason : dogs]

12/6/2011 6:36:41 PM

my sister does this shit with her dogs and cats.

she does it just to be an annoying hipster.

the animals are annoying as fuck although i dont attribute that to what they eat.

considering how much she spends on biodiesel and other idiotic shenanigans in the raleigh area i can only assume these animals eat better than me and it isnt very cost effective.

12/6/2011 6:45:01 PM

It is very cost effective if you do it right. It ends up being much cheaper and better for the dogs than buying decent/expensive dry food.

12/6/2011 6:48:22 PM

spill it then.

12/6/2011 6:49:01 PM

http://brentroad.com/message_topic.aspx?topic=386690

exact same thread title, no less

12/6/2011 7:16:55 PM

It is a LOT more work to feed raw and have it be cost effective. There is a lot of chopping and cutting and grossness but it's great for the dogs and I don't mind it so much. I sometimes order meat in bulk along with some other people and we use https://www.hare-today.com/. I also get a ton of free organs and meat from a guy near where I live that butchers deer during the season. We have a big freezer and during deer season I pack it and it lasts for several months. One of the trickiest things is to make sure the dogs are getting a good mix of things like meat, organ, and bone in their diet. For anyone who is willing to deal with the mess, I would recommend reading up on it online.

[Edited on December 6, 2011 at 7:23 PM. Reason : Didn't see the other thread and that shit is from 2006, sorry]

12/6/2011 7:22:32 PM

Fuuuuuuck that shit. I love my dog, but I'll be goddamed if I'm going to chop up some organs and bones for him.

12/6/2011 7:30:01 PM

hipster shit

12/6/2011 8:45:03 PM

Nah, I'm not a hipster at all.

12/6/2011 9:02:11 PM

I assume that people that do this are the same ones that force their kids to be vegan (or one of the other interesting food choices)

I'd like to see the percentages of women vs men that do something like this

12/6/2011 9:21:38 PM

i think buying premium, conventional dog food is a fair compromise

i'm not skimping out and getting the cheapest shit, but that raw diet sounds like more work than i'm willing to put in

12/6/2011 10:01:42 PM

^ You are right. Raw feeding isn't for everyone.

Quote :

"I assume that people that do this are the same ones that force their kids to be vegan (or one of the other interesting food choices)"

Maybe I'm stupid but I don't understand this assumption. I'm not at all trying to push this on anyone. I was really just curious if any others were doing it.

12/6/2011 10:33:38 PM

Quote :

"I assume that people that do this are the same ones that force their kids to be vegan (or one of the other interesting food choices)"

While there may be a correlation, there SHOULDN'T be.

One is a return to nature, the other is NOT.

12/7/2011 4:53:27 AM

I also feed my dog raw probably 90% of the month and feed kibble (Taste of the Wild) the remainder of the time. Dog loves it and she has had no issues...vet always comments on her health and specifically how clean her teeth are. Not difficult to do...requires some prep work to cut and package but can be much cheaper than kibble if purchased right.

Oh and Im not vegan or a hippie...I just like to feed to my dog the best food I can and still save money.

[Edited on December 7, 2011 at 8:05 AM. Reason : a]

12/7/2011 8:04:59 AM

My grandmother used to do this with her dogs. At first she said it was great, but after awhile she got tired of dealing with it. She had to have a freezer just for her dogs' food, constantly buying the meat which isn't all that easy with being out in the boondocks, etc. She also started worrying about stuff like salmonella from the raw meat. Of course, she also has something like eight dogs on her farm so I don't think she is a typical case.

I tried very briefly doing raw with my cats but they're retards. They won't even eat canned cat food or tuna fish, much less raw meat. If it's not kibble they want nothing to do with it which at least makes my life easier.

I've thought about doing it with our dog but I think it would be too cost prohibitive to do it the way I would want to.

12/7/2011 8:31:39 AM

Quote :

"vet always comments on her health and specifically how clean her teeth are."

Science diet his entire life and I get these comments as well. Not bad mouthing raw diets, but just saying it's not the only way to keep a dog healthy.

12/7/2011 8:39:13 AM

Yep, a lot of it goes beyond food like genetics. Also just providing your dog with lots of chews like dried duck feet and bully sticks helps keep the plaque away.

12/7/2011 8:41:03 AM

If you want to give your dog some extra protein toss a fried egg in with their meal every day. Considering an egg costs around 15 cents it's tough to beat that price.

I just give my dog premium dog food. A 40lb bag lasts 2 months easy.

12/7/2011 8:41:22 AM

When I first got my ferrets I had a lot of people tell me I needed to due the raw diet (which works out since the are straight carnivores, no veggies). It was such a pain in the ass and I couldn't find anyone who could tell me that it was better than giving them premium kibble.

If you are giving your dogs raw food, are you also making sure they eat a healthy amount of veggies and fiber?

12/7/2011 9:15:25 AM

^ Dogs are carnivores so I'm not sure why you would need to give them vegetables or fiber.

12/7/2011 9:41:42 AM

there are just as many out there who say dogs are carnivores as omnivores...but they're not true (obligate) carnivores like cats. the proof is in the physiology.

12/7/2011 9:48:23 AM

True, they're not obligates, but dogs don't need to eat non-meat items to survive. Unless you wanted to feed your dog carrots or something you don't need to feel like you're obligated to make your dog some sort of doggie beef stew

12/7/2011 9:49:46 AM

I don't think dogs are meant to eat vegetables...

edit: beaten.

[Edited on December 7, 2011 at 9:50 AM. Reason : d]

12/7/2011 9:50:30 AM

^Kibble already contains vitamins from veggies and fiber. Dog's need (albeit small) portions of fiber in their diet to maintain good digestion. This is why sometimes you see dogs eating grass, and the same occuring with cats. Maybe they don't need fiber to survive (I honestly don't know), but if the point of a raw diet is to keep the dog just as healthy, or healthier, than using kibble, I would think you would want to include the same fiber types.

This is from Purina's website:

Quote :

"...fiber provides an important source of energy for the cells lining the intestinal tract and promotes healthy cell function. Sources of dietary fiber in dog food include beet pulp, rice bran, soybean hulls, apple and tomato pomace, peanut hulls, citrus pulp, the bran of oats, rice, wheat and cellulose. "

Also, from the Journal of Animal Science:

Quote :

"In addition to containing desirable insoluble:soluble fiber ratios, these fibers contain several bioactive components that may enhance gastrointestinal health of the animal. Although it seems that fruitand vegetable fibers may be economical alternatives to beet pulp, in vivo studies must be conducted in order to more fully discern the nutritional value of these alternate fiber sources."

link: http://jas.fass.org/content/79/4/919.full.pdf

12/7/2011 9:50:57 AM

i would take whatever purina says with a grain of salt. they make shitty, shitty pet food.

cats eat grass to vomit. they don't need grass as food.

[Edited on December 7, 2011 at 9:52 AM. Reason : ]

12/7/2011 9:52:04 AM

^Didn't know that.

I figured I wouldn't take Purina's word as gospel (since they have a 'dog in the fight'), so that's why I posted the link to the Journal of Animal Science. They seem to agree that fiber is needed to maintain health digestion.

12/7/2011 9:54:05 AM

purina is apparently not shitty enough because my dogs are still alive and healthy.

average life span for a boxer is 9. mine is gonna be 10 soon.

can't wait for this shit to end.

12/7/2011 10:00:00 AM

Found this, too, from a dog breeder's site on Raw Diets. It actually contains a lot of good information (it seems like) if you're wanting to pursue the raw diet thing.

Quote :

"In the wild, a dog would receive very little plan matter in the diet, mostly in trace amounts through the process of eating the intestines and stomach of their prey - they shake out most of the contents but a small amount would end up being consumed. To effectively emulate this process for our domestic dogs, it is necessary to break down the fiber of the vegetable/fruit material . This can be easily done with a juicer (using the remaining pulp), a food processor, a blender or a grinder. "

Quote :

"Variety is the key to success. Alternate 3 - 4 vegetables. Buy in season produce and be sure to use your vegetable trimmings from your own meals. "

Link: http://www.liebmeister.com/raw_food.htm

There are also tips on how to give your dog supplements if you want to feed them a raw diet and how to travel with your animal on this particular diet. Good information if you're interested.

12/7/2011 10:01:02 AM

My dog likes to eat grass from time to time. But it's not to throw up or anything like that. I can attest to, through first hand experience, that he passes it through all the way. And from the looks of it his body breaks it down very little

12/7/2011 10:01:41 AM

Yeah my dog likes to eat leaves sometimes and either puke them back up or they come out her butt. It is tres gross either way.

Quote :

"mostly in trace amounts through the process of eating the intestines and stomach of their prey"

So you can either feed your dog whole mice from time to time to get the same effect or I guess boil some oatmeal to throw in with their food. I don't know if simply breaking the vegetables into smaller parts would really do anything. The big problem is the dogs don't produce amylase in their saliva to help break down plant material, it's only produced in their small intestines. I would think you would need to cook whatever vegetable you're giving the dog to aid in digestion.

12/7/2011 10:08:09 AM

my dog loves carrots

onions...not so much

12/7/2011 10:16:45 AM

Onions are toxic to dogs so that's probably why

12/7/2011 10:22:11 AM

Quote :

"I would think you would need to cook whatever vegetable you're giving the dog to aid in digestion."

Yeah, I would agree. From my last post...

Quote :

"This can be easily done with a juicer (using the remaining pulp), a food processor, a blender or a grinder."

and

Quote :

"Buy in season produce and be sure to use your vegetable trimmings from your own meals."

12/7/2011 10:22:25 AM

Quote :

"Onions are toxic to dogs so that's probably why "

Quote :

"Onions contain the toxic ingredient thiosulphate. Pets affected by onion toxicity will develop anemia. 1 Onion can cause this. Fortunately ALL dogs recover once they are stopped from ingesting onions."

Other things listed by this breeder:
Alcohol
Avocado
Chocolate
Coffee
Fatty Foods (like bacon/gravy)
Macadamia Nuts
Onions
Raisins/Grapes
Yeast Dough
Xylitol (artificial sweetener)
Apples, Apricots, Cherries, Peaches and Plums
Nutmeg
Tomato leaves & stems (green parts)

Some of these aren't completely toxic in small doses. The link [http://www.liebmeister.com/toxic_foods.htm] gives more detail on what each item potentially does to your dog.

12/7/2011 10:23:57 AM

^I mean, alcohol isn't good for any living creature.

Hmm, well good he doesn't eat them then, lol. But without thinking too hard about it I have no doubt he's had some table scraps before that contained onion, hehe.

[Edited on December 7, 2011 at 10:33 AM. Reason : k]

12/7/2011 10:26:58 AM

My dog got into a pack of artificial gum (xylitol) and lost function of his legs for a day. Thought he was going to die.

Now we don't keep that shit in the house anywhere.

12/7/2011 10:41:03 AM

Quote :

"Other things listed by this breeder: Alcohol Avocado Chocolate Coffee Fatty Foods (like bacon/gravy) Macadamia Nuts Onions Raisins/Grapes Yeast Dough Xylitol (artificial sweetener) Apples, Apricots, Cherries, Peaches and Plums Nutmeg Tomato leaves & stems (green parts) "

FUCK THAT SHIT

12/7/2011 11:12:16 AM

^LOL

i know a few dog owners that actually give their dogs bits of chocolate occasionally. supposedly chocolate is pretty low on the spectrum of stuff that's poisonous for dogs. that's milk chocolate, though - dark chocolate and especially baker's chocolate are far more poisonous. i don't give my dog chocolate at all.

12/7/2011 12:01:32 PM

Quote :

"From my last post..."

He doesn't mention cooking those things, only chopping them up into bits. And since it's a link about "raw food" I'm thinking he's probably not cooking the veggies.

12/7/2011 12:45:45 PM

I guess we just read it differently. You mention doing something to the veggies to aid in digestion and to me, this quote (from the post I referenced) answers/substantiates that claim.

Quote :

"This can be easily done with a juicer (using the remaining pulp), a food processor, a blender or a grinder"

12/7/2011 12:52:53 PM

i think kibble, meat, hell even scraps are fine for a dog as long as they get proper exercise and nutrition. My dad's parents would feed the dog rice and whatever scraps they could spare from the table (meat trimmings, bone, etc) and the dog lived forever. Genetics has a lot to do with it of course.

I feed a combo raw/kibble so I can tell the difference in some areas. For example, she drinks a lot less water when eating meat. I mean to the point where she doesnt even touch the water bowl some days. I take her out twice a day and she squats for literally a second to pee. She also poops a very small amount and only once a day or so whereas kibble she is pooping a large pile twice a day (with premium kibble Taste of the Wild). I also think she has a ton more energy but i dont know if thats a positive

[Edited on December 7, 2011 at 1:05 PM. Reason : a]

12/7/2011 1:03:29 PM

^^ Yeah that's what I'm saying I'm not sure that just making the vegetables smaller helps all that much with the lack of amylase. And I'm not willing to dig through my dog's poop to find out

12/7/2011 1:10:56 PM

Quote :

"feed a combo raw/kibble so I can tell the difference in some areas. For example, she drinks a lot less water when eating meat. I mean to the point where she doesnt even touch the water bowl some days. I take her out twice a day and she squats for literally a second to pee. She also poops a very small amount and only once a day or so whereas kibble she is pooping a large pile twice a day (with premium kibble Taste of the Wild)."

That's extremely concerning actually

12/7/2011 3:47:10 PM

^The site I kept looking at mentioned that sometimes if you feed your dog a raw diet, they will begin to mimic "wild" behavior patterns. In the wild sometimes dogs/wolves would go days without eating so apparently this is common for dogs on raw diets.

Maybe that is what wahoowa is seeing.

12/7/2011 8:26:44 PM

That sounds like bologna to me. Diet isn't going to cause your dog to start acting more wolf-like More likely eating raw meat is allowing their body to run at optimum thereby producing less waste and more energy. Just like how your body feels like crap and you take a huge dump after the State Fair. That's what happens to dogs on those cheap ass bags of kibble they hide in the very back of Petsmart.

12/8/2011 6:59:17 AM

Quote :

"That sounds like bologna to me. Diet isn't going to cause your dog to start acting more wolf-like "

Quote :

"Many raw feeders fast their dogs once a week, giving just water and possibly a recreational bone. This allows the digestive tract a rest, and helps clean out toxins and parasites from the system. Remember, a wild dog will not necessarily eat every day. In fact, many raw-fed dogs will fast themselves! "

Just saying... this is coming from an AKC breeder. Take it for what it's worth.

12/8/2011 8:46:46 AM

I'm not trying to be mean. I'm not trying to be hateful. But you are coming across as very ignorant.

I would report anyone who does this:

Quote :

"Many raw feeders fast their dogs once a week, giving just water and possibly a recreational bone. This allows the digestive tract a rest, and helps clean out toxins and parasites from the system. Remember, a wild dog will not necessarily eat every day. In fact, many raw-fed dogs will fast themselves! "

as straight up animal abuse.

Quote :

"Just like how your body feels like crap and you take a huge dump after the State Fair."

lol this too , AND the fact that kibble has fiber in it and meat well. . doesn't.

[Edited on December 8, 2011 at 10:13 AM. Reason : .]

12/8/2011 10:11:42 AM

^agreed. it's not like we started keeping dogs a couple hundred years ago. dogs have been domesticated for over 15,000 years. they're not wild. and this colon cleansing/not eating bullshit is just that. worms don't just float around in the intestine. they attach to the intestinal wall and/or migrate through to other tissues. they'll still feed off of the dog even if the dog isn't eating.

12/8/2011 10:17:54 AM

It's also suggesting that wild dogs simply choose to not eat for days at a time. In reality they're not eating unless they catch prey. I'm sure wild dogs would prefer to have daily access to food. I would still offer my dog food daily, even if they didn't eat every day.

12/8/2011 10:25:47 AM

^^&^^^oh come on, GTFO out with that crap. Not feeding a dog ONE day is not animal abuse. In fact my dog voluntarily doesn't eat his food every once in a while on a given day.

12/8/2011 11:18:26 AM