http://www.theverge.com/2012/11/13/3640178/war-for-tv-inside-the-fight-for-the-living-room

I posted this link in the Google TV thread but really thought it deserved its own thread because the implications far outreach just Google TV.

I am excited about the future of television moving past the current set top box paradigm. I want content that I am interested in and want to do away with the 200 other bullshit channels that I could give a damn about. I want to cut the cord but for whatever reason (scared, live tv, etc.) have not yet. So TWW, what is the best solution for the industry?

11/14/2012 3:30:58 PM

I'm also very interested in this topic (cut the cord on my cable this week). I got fed up with paying for bullshit and having to call back every few months to fight back rate hikes when I had several examples of people getting more and paying less than me.

I've been pleased with having the network stations through an antenna combined with Amazon instant video through my Xbox, haven't missed cable yet. The fact that I can watch sporting events on ESPN through roadrunner, I saw no reason to keep cable. The couple of shows I watch on cable I'll just keep with on hulu or something or forget about, everything else was crap to begin with.

[Edited on November 14, 2012 at 3:38 PM. Reason : foo]

11/14/2012 3:35:43 PM

all you have to do to keep a cable bill low is say "I'm switching to X" They'll offer you some deal, you say "Nah i'm not really interested in staying at that price" Then they offer you the real price.

I'm Krallum and I approved this message.

11/14/2012 3:37:33 PM

^^What are your plans for live sports?

or are you not a sports fan?

[Edited on November 14, 2012 at 3:38 PM. Reason : adsf]

11/14/2012 3:37:44 PM

I don't think there's any content I'm interested in on TV

11/14/2012 3:38:27 PM

Fucking ESPN/ESPNU. If it weren't for those channels I would've cut the cord a long time ago.

11/14/2012 3:39:19 PM

Plenty of sporting events, especially football through the antenna on CBS/ABC/FOX/NBC. WatchESPN through roadrunner for the rest of it. Anything that falls on Fox Sports or something that I want to watch? Fuck it, I'll go to the bar.

11/14/2012 3:39:57 PM

I'm glad to see Premier league is going to be on ESPN but i still wouldn't even watch that if i had cable.

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11/14/2012 3:41:54 PM

im starting to get annoyed with cable service myself

but at this point i have faith in the technology

11/14/2012 3:43:08 PM

Cable would be cheaper than going to a bar every time you want to watch a game. Unless you are one of those dudes that just sits there and drinks water the whole time.......and if you are one of those dude, just know that they spit in your water.

11/14/2012 3:43:10 PM

^^based on the fact that the quality of programming diminishes at a constant rate?

^except that they don't?

I'm Krallum and I approved this message.

[Edited on November 14, 2012 at 3:44 PM. Reason : ]

11/14/2012 3:44:05 PM

You ever been a waiter at a sports bar, or known anyone that was? The chumps that just show up for free football are undoubtedly drinking some type of bodily fluid in their water.

11/14/2012 3:46:47 PM

If you sit at the bar you can literally see the spigot where the water comes out

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11/14/2012 3:50:11 PM

no you cant

11/14/2012 3:50:29 PM

lol what bar refills water for people at the bar out of pitchers?

I'm Krallum and I approved this message.

11/14/2012 3:51:15 PM

But maybe you are right. What waitress/bartender wouldn't love taking care of you for 3 hours knowing she will at most make $1 on the deal.

[Edited on November 14, 2012 at 3:53 PM. Reason : a]

11/14/2012 3:53:02 PM

11/14/2012 3:54:30 PM

Name me a sports bar, where I sit at the bar and I can't see the spigot where the coke/water/sprite/whatever thing is.

I'm Krallum and I approved this message.

11/14/2012 3:54:56 PM

Plenty. You should get out more.

Anyway, back to the topic. I have a friend that has been without cable for nearly a year. He doesn't miss it at all, but he is more into movies (has Netflix) and not sports so much. He is, however, a huge UNC basketball fan....so we will see how much he enjoys it in the coming weeks.

11/14/2012 3:57:59 PM

K so you can't. Got it. I can name tons of bars that DONT do that.

I'm Krallum and I approved this message.

11/14/2012 3:58:30 PM

I figure I'll go to the bar once a month max because of some game I really want to see and can't at home. I'll chalk those up as a good time out on the town and won't really think twice about it. If it gets to the point where there's games several times a week that I don't want to miss then I'll probably just get cable back again, but we'll cross that bridge when we come to it.

11/14/2012 4:00:35 PM

^^So you frequently go to bars, order water, and watch TV?

Makes sense

^ I just prefer to watch games at home, but that's just me. I like going out to a bar occasionally as a change of pace, but if it is a game I REALLY want to watch I prefer to be home. And for the record, there are still plenty of streaming sites online where you can find just about any game. The video quality might suck, but it's free.

[Edited on November 14, 2012 at 4:02 PM. Reason : a]

11/14/2012 4:00:53 PM

OOoooooh i got skeweld


I almost always get water before I leave a bar.

I'm Krallum and I approved this message.

11/14/2012 4:02:47 PM

I didn't say they will spit in your water, I said they will spit in it if YOU ONLY have water.

11/14/2012 4:04:00 PM

I've really thought of doing this, but I'm pretty invested in several network cable and premium network shows that just aren't available short of paying per epidsode. I could likely find most of them streaming on some website, but the quality is spotty and who knows what you'd be putting onto your computer spyware/virus wise.

Also the complex I'm in has basic built into my rent anyway...so it's kind of a moot issue right now anyway.

11/14/2012 4:07:14 PM

i ditched cable after hockey ended with the intention of picking it back up when the new season started. lol. saved me quite a bit atleast.

its lame that 90% of the cable bill goes to channels i dont watch and thats really whats gonna kill cable for most people. The only channel I want is NESN (local sports) during hockey and then stuff like science and discovery and food network are nice to haves. I dont care about anything else.

I think this is the case for most people these days where they want one or a few specific channels and none of the rest and would glady pay more than the cable cos get for those channels now, if they could recieve only those channels. ex: if nesn is $2/mo of the twc bill now and i paid $4/mo just for nesn then twc is making more money for providing nesn, and im paying way less than i would for the cable package that includes nesn.

now for the most part, cable cos would be on board with a la carte pricing, but the content owners haaaate it. The biggest cable cost is the disney empire (disney, espn, abc family) which is delivered as a block to all cable subscribers. disney knows it has valuable content so it will never sell those channels individually nor will it permit them to be sold on a separate tier. They know that if 60% of cable subscribers want atleast one of their channels, the cable cos dont have the power to negotiate separating those channels from the standard package. If the cable cos dropped disney, then the cable cos risk losing 60& of their subscribers. This means everyone has to pay disney, instead of the 60% that want it. For low demand channels it becomes much easier for the cable cos to push back on pricing and inclusion in the standard package. This is why stuff like the NFL network isnt included. It would mean a rate hike for all customers, when only a few customers want it. TWC (rightly) pushed back on them and said either make it cheaper, or we'll offer it separate. But thats hard to do with established channels.

Services like itunes or amazon that let you buy or rent individual episodes will always be popular with the content owners because they control how much you pay for individual episodes, when they're released, and the formats you can watch them in. Some consumers like these and they will take some money away from cable, but not much. These type of options quickly become more expensive than cable if you are watching alot of stuff on cable.

Because of this, imo, the future will continue to be subscription. People fuckin love tv. They want to watch lots of it and individual episode purchases will be too expensive to continue at current rates. So how do subscription services evolve to serve content on the platforms that users want? How can the a la carte problem be solved?

1) Subscription services through cable providers evolve onto the web. Comcast has started this with their xfinity stuff (rebranded hulu). This is a good near term solution for cable cos as it means they keep their audiences by allowing them greater access and flexibility to their content, without offending the content owners. But this probably wont last in the long term if people cant get everything they want in the web version of the service.

2) Subscription services through 3rd party software providers. This is your netflix and your amazons. Microsoft wants to get in here too. Microsoft even went so far as to build a subscription system that allowed users to watch live tv just like cable on any device and then ALSO access a wide backcatalog of episodes. This is the best solution by far for users since it lets them watch everything live AND access anything they want from the past, all for one fee. Of course the content owners didnt want it at a price point consumers would accept so it was killed. Amazon and netflix are scrambling to get as much content they can into their subscription services, but its basically limited by what the content owners are willing to "throw away".

3) super easy piracy. Get everything you want whenever you want. Get new episodes as soon as they've aired. This sort of exists right now for episodic content. These shows get posted on torrent sites and usenet immediately after they've aired (or sometimes before they air in your timezone) without ads and in formats that work on all your devices. Many sites provide rss feeds for their trackers or usenet posts so your client can automatically download your favorite shows as soon as they're posted. For moderately technically savvy people this is pretty easy to setup with little effort. For grandma or your average internet denizen, maybe not. This could be fixed by writing software clients that make it simple to pick the shows you like and then automate the tasks of finding, downloading, and organizing the episodes. It really wouldnt be that hard to do. The idea would be that if you can make pirating content so braindead easy then you gut all the shitty limited options that content providers are willing to support. They would have to come up with something equally as convenient and as easy as the piracy. This doesnt really deal with live content though. Pirate streams of sports content and stuff exist, but they're much easier to find and kill and usually come from questionable sources jam packed full of the latest browser exploits.

So thats my 2 cents. The power is entirely in the hands of the content owners. All we can really do is try to convince them to give it to us the way we want it, with varying levels of success. IMO, the best way is to simply deny them the money. If you arent using it then get rid of your cable subscription. Dont buy individual episodes on itunes. I cant stand hulu personally, but if you like it then great. Thats a better way to get stuff than older methods. Just dont pay full price for stuff you dont want.

11/14/2012 4:19:24 PM

I would totally ditch my direcTV if I could subscribe to some sort of sports package online, similar to the way that Netflix and Hulu+ does with movies and TV shows. I would gladly pay $14.99 a month for NFL and college sports. Shit, they can even still advertise on there.

11/14/2012 4:29:36 PM

^this. just give me local channels, espn, CBScs, etc. and I'll be good.

11/14/2012 4:30:45 PM

^ this exactly for me. I think if ESPN had a subscription service not attached to cable, I wouldn't have cable.

11/14/2012 4:30:51 PM

Although I will admit that DVR is pretty dope. Then again, I was doing that same shit with a VCR back in the day, so no big loss.

11/14/2012 4:51:24 PM

Quote :

"The fact that I can watch sporting events on ESPN through roadrunner, I saw no reason to keep cable."

How exactly do you have access to watchESPN with only an internet subscription? I only have TWC internet but always get a message that says "You do not subscribe to an appropriate cable package. Please contact your cable provider."

[Edited on November 14, 2012 at 6:20 PM. Reason : a]

11/14/2012 6:20:26 PM

yeah i was gonna say the same thing. With only internet through TWC, I don't have access to WatchESPN (but I do have access to ESPN3, which is bullshit now anyways)

11/14/2012 6:24:01 PM

I haven't had cable TV in about 3 years. The only thing I really miss have been random documentaries on science, travel, history and discovery channels.

If I need to watch sports, I go to a friends house to watch it. And yes, I have gone to a sports bar to watch hockey and only drink water, but I'm usually with drunk friends and I'm the DD. The local bar tends to give me free coke since they like me and plus I tip them pretty good when I eat dinner there; know them by first name basis.

11/14/2012 6:37:36 PM

My guess is he used a friends login for the one time you have to login to use it. That's how I did it. Hypothetically of course.

11/14/2012 8:04:29 PM

i, too, do have TWC for internet only and can't get ESPN3.

11/14/2012 8:07:36 PM

Verizon NFL mobile, $5/month for total access. Root your phone and put it on the TV. ACC network all access for similar price, get NCSU games. If we get in the tournament, buy the CBS Sports mobile thing for like $4 for total access. Done.

11/14/2012 8:52:51 PM

Quote :

"^this. just give me local channels, espn, CBScs, etc. and I'll be good."

I am kind of sad there's no good option for local content it seems. I got the converter box when the government was buying them for us, but it just doesn't feel the same for some reason.

Then again, whenever I want local news I can get it online, so there's not too much wrong with the way things are.

11/14/2012 9:11:15 PM

I would like a package through the cable companies where I could pay per channel.

I realize they won't do this because it results in me giving them less money.

11/14/2012 11:10:34 PM

After talking with multiple people that have the same time warner service as me but are paying anywhere from 30-50 dollars cheaper than me a month I called time warner to bitch and threaten to cancel to get a better deal. They kept stringing me along saying I had the best deal they could do. So I ended up going through with scheduling a disconnect. I know one individual who recently did the same and they started calling him the next day offering all of his current services for $75 a month not to disconnect. If it doesn't work for me the same way I'll probably try to just do Internet and see if I can make it without cable tv.

[Edited on November 15, 2012 at 11:14 AM. Reason : Day]

11/15/2012 11:12:55 AM

Good luck. Be strong

11/15/2012 2:29:58 PM

haven't had cable for a year. with a Roku, antenna, and torrents, I don't really miss it. the sports thing sucks though. websites like First Row just don't really cut it.

11/15/2012 2:31:46 PM

WHo needs DVR with WIndows 7 and/or a HD Homerun?

11/15/2012 2:37:52 PM

yeah if you are gonna stick with cable, then windows media center w/ a cable card tuner is the best dvr.

[Edited on November 15, 2012 at 2:41 PM. Reason : a]

11/15/2012 2:41:36 PM

I cut the cord a long time ago. I have Apple TV, Netflix, Hulu+ and get local channels OTA. I watch all the NC State football games streaming ESPN3 and airplay it through Apple TV. Most of the shows we like to watch are available on Netflix or Hulu+. Rent newly released movies on Apple TV. Watch Sunday football on local channels OTA. I wish there was a way to subscribe to all the ESPN channels with out a cable TV subscription. I really missed Sports Center sometimes but not worth the extra $100/month IMO.

11/15/2012 2:56:30 PM

There is a european website that streams sports. NFL, NCAA f/b ball and NHL too

11/15/2012 3:27:17 PM

http://www.thefirstrow.eu/

11/15/2012 3:28:23 PM

First row is legit.

[Edited on November 16, 2012 at 1:22 AM. Reason : .]

11/16/2012 1:21:35 AM

first row sports is mofuggin clutch

11/16/2012 1:31:45 AM

Do NCSU games come on firstrow?

11/16/2012 1:08:51 PM

set em up

11/17/2012 8:34:54 PM