I never understood the obsession with having a Christian in the white house. Could someone please explain?

Thx

10/14/2015 12:18:21 PM

Christian nation, founded on Christian principles and the ten commandments...

10/14/2015 12:29:16 PM

because it's adam and eve, not adam and his copy of atlas shrugged

10/14/2015 12:31:05 PM

I would have problems with somebody who embraced all the doctrines associated with Evangelical Christianity. If they are not willing to reject theocracy and all the portions of it that are talked about in the Bible -- if they are not willing to reject that, and subject that to American values and the Constitution, then of course, I would.


I've worked with Christians. I've trained Christians. There are a lot of Christians who are very patriotic. Good Americans and they gladly admit, at least privately, that they don't accept theocracy or the doctrines and they understand that Christianity is a system of living and it includes the way that you relate to the government.

And you cannot, unless you specifically, deny that portion of Christianity be a Christian in good standing. Now if that is the case, if you are not willing to reject that, then how in the world can you possibly be the president of the United States?

Am I assuming that Christian Americans put their religion ahead of the country?

I'm assuming that if you accept all the tenets of Christianity that you would have a very difficult time abiding under the Constitution of the United States.

10/14/2015 12:42:49 PM

Because they take "One Nation, Under God" and "In God We Trust", to be "their" God and no other religion's.

10/14/2015 12:55:12 PM

^^there are no tenants of christianity that would prevent someone from abiding by the constitution

[Edited on October 14, 2015 at 12:56 PM. Reason : .]

10/14/2015 12:56:36 PM

^surely, you jest.

10/14/2015 1:03:10 PM

people want to relate to somebody who adheres to a familiar moral code. not to say other religions don't have similar moral codes, but less Americans are knowledgeable of them.

[Edited on October 14, 2015 at 1:04 PM. Reason : .]

10/14/2015 1:04:19 PM

it'll eventually fade out, citizens are becoming less religious in the country

10/14/2015 1:14:00 PM

No matter what you believe in, we all live by a set of standards. In a nation where the majority of people identify as Christian, we are more likely to agree with those who live by Christian standards.

</College 101>

10/14/2015 1:35:12 PM

...because the Christian presidents that we have had all have been infallible, upstanding, morally aligned individuals.

[Edited on October 14, 2015 at 1:49 PM. Reason : I am a Christian BTW. Just looking at this objectively]

10/14/2015 1:35:41 PM

Quote :

"^surely, you jest."

i'm pretty critical of christianity, but what tenant do you think is contrary to the constitution?

10/14/2015 1:46:34 PM

Quote :

"i'm pretty critical of christianity, but what tenant do you think is contrary to the constitution?"

Yeah I was trying to debate that but according to the Bible Christians must obey the law of the land and the government. However the Bible does say that if the law of the land conflicts with teachings in the Bible then you can disobey the law of the land but even in that instance they must accept the government's authority over them. So it's a little vague there. You can disobey the constitution if it conflicts with your beliefs but be prepared to suffer the consequences I guess.

I don't think any of that is mentioned in the tenets of Christianity though.

10/14/2015 1:59:50 PM

but what teachings of the bible would conflict with performing the duties of president, what do you think is in conflict?

10/14/2015 2:06:38 PM

I think some of you are reading this as "we shouldn't have a Christian in the white house" as opposed to "why can we ONLY have Christians in the white house?"

10/14/2015 2:26:24 PM

Quote :

"but what teachings of the bible would conflict with performing the duties of president, what do you think is in conflict?"

There's a difference between teachings of the bible and tenants of Christianity. Depending what book you pull from you could argue that half the stuff the president does conflicts with teachings of the bible.

^Yes exactly. Doesn't 70% of America still identify as Christian? You'd think this would be reason enough to identify as Christian as a president. That figure it rapidly declining though so it won't be that way for long.

10/14/2015 2:34:21 PM

Isn't declaring war, bombing people, etc. anti-Christian, according to the New Testament?

10/14/2015 2:39:09 PM

^^give an example

^only a very few sects of christians believe in absolute pacifism, it's not a tenant. but

[Edited on October 14, 2015 at 2:48 PM. Reason : and unless a candidate kept it a secret, being a pacifist still wouldn't be contrary to his duties]

10/14/2015 2:42:27 PM

I certainly understand a voter wanting someone in office who shares similar morals, ideals, values, etc....
I'm just not sure why ones religion is thought to be a good indicator of these characteristics.

10/14/2015 3:07:19 PM

Quote :

"...because the Christian presidents that we have had all have been infallible, upstanding, morally aligned individuals."

Who said they were any of these things? If they were actual believers in Christ (and not just identified as "Christian"), than they would be the first to tell you that they are none of the above, which is why they needed saving in the first place.

Reminder to all 7 people reading this thread, TWW knows nothing about Christianity, so it would be best to just ignore all posters.

10/14/2015 3:13:27 PM

Quote :

"^^give an example"

Not saying tenants just general teachings of the bible. Like ^^^^'s example based upon interpretation there's ton's of teachings in the bible that the president goes against. Of course not all Christians believe in them.

Quote :

"[Edited on October 14, 2015 at 2:48 PM. Reason : and unless a candidate kept it a secret, being a pacifist still wouldn't be contrary to his duties]"

Isn't bombing people contrary to being a pacifist? According to the bible if the law of the land conflicts with your belief in biblical teachings then you can disobey the law of the land. If a president refused to do certain duties because it goes against their beliefs as a pacifist then isn't that a conflict right there?

[Edited on October 14, 2015 at 3:14 PM. Reason : extra ^]

10/14/2015 3:13:34 PM

if a president was elected because of his beliefs as a pacifist, then he would be executing his duties as president in the way that the people wanted him to. As commander in chief, it is his duty to decide when to use force. but there are only a few sects of christians that are even true pacifists, it's not a universal part of christianity or the bible.


the belief above about being a "christian in good standing" is also wrong, because that's really not how it works

10/14/2015 3:19:57 PM

Isn't "that shall not murder" and "turn the other cheek" and "love your enemies" all throughout the New Testament? Of course, I realize that many Christians don't adhere to these passages, and there are other passages that directly contradict these.

10/14/2015 3:32:47 PM

1) the bible is not the only authority for christians, it is just one of them, 2) most christians believe in a reading of scripture that supports self-defense including war. true pacifists are only a few sects of christians, it's not a tenant of the faith.

it's still not clear to me what tenants of christiainity are contrary to the constitution or would prevent a president from executing their duties and oath of office

[Edited on October 14, 2015 at 3:39 PM. Reason : .]

10/14/2015 3:38:01 PM

Perhaps it's because of my upbringing in the bible belt and much of my family and their friends are southern baptist, but according to most of them (and most of the stuff I read from Christians on Golo), the Bible is THE authority on Christianity (or so they claim, even though they don't adhere to much of it).

10/14/2015 3:40:56 PM

the bit about being a "christian in good standing" meant good standing as an American.

Quote :

"but what teachings of the bible would conflict with performing the duties of president, what do you think is in conflict?"

oh you know, support of slavery, incest, killing homosexuals and people who shave their beards, eat shellfish, etc.

But if you want to look at modern day evangelical christians, opposition to gay marriage, attempts to deny reproductive rights to women on the basis of religion, and well Huckabee pretty much sums it up pretty well:

“…I believe it’s a lot easier to change the Constitution than it would be to change the word of the living God. And that’s what we need to do is amend the Constitution so it’s in God’s standards rather than trying to change God’s standards so it lines up with some contemporary view…”



Oh and for what it's worth, my previous post was a copy/paste of Ben Carson's comments on a Muslim presidential candidate. i just replaced the word Muslim with Christian.

[Edited on October 14, 2015 at 3:43 PM. Reason : .]

10/14/2015 3:42:35 PM

Quote :

"Perhaps it's because of my upbringing in the bible belt and much of my family and their friends are southern baptist, but according to most of them (and most of the stuff I read from Christians on Golo), the Bible is THE authority on Christianity (or so they claim, even though they don't adhere to much of it)."

southern baptists still believe that god is the ultimate authority and that the holy spirit is his manifestation in them

10/14/2015 3:54:14 PM

Yes but isn't the bible the word of god? Commutative property?

10/14/2015 3:55:59 PM

^^^ your claim was tenants, none of those are tenants of christianity

and even still someone would be able to believe that slavery is allowed by god but be unconstitutional, they can believe that god does not endorse a marriage between a man and a woman but believe that the state outside of the church can do what they want etc..


[Edited on October 14, 2015 at 3:57 PM. Reason : .]

10/14/2015 3:57:13 PM

Quote :

"Yes but isn't the bible the word of god? Commutative property?"

not all protestant denominations believe in the doctrine of sola scriptura, and even of those that do not all believe in it to the same extent. even the belief that scripture interprets scripture, or that the bible is it's own authority, still accepts that it has to be read by man by all but the most extreme evangelicals or baptists

[Edited on October 14, 2015 at 4:15 PM. Reason : .]

10/14/2015 4:14:02 PM

^^it's not like christianity is one unified group that all believe the same thing.

The bible is the one common denominator, however.

And if the actions of extremist muslims can be projected on to all muslims, then it would be pretty fucking consistent to apply the same logic to christians.

[Edited on October 14, 2015 at 4:16 PM. Reason : again, Ben Carson's claims, not mine. ]

10/14/2015 4:15:47 PM

but we, us having this conversation, are not the people who use that logic against muslims so why would you use it against christians in this conversation?

don't hide behind carson if you are unable to make your own point

10/14/2015 4:20:26 PM

the people obsessed with having a christian in the white house are the exact people who use that logic against muslims.

10/14/2015 4:36:16 PM

Tribalism. Same reason lots of women are clamoring for a woman in the whitehouse.

10/14/2015 4:46:02 PM

I think the more interesting discussion is why those same Christians think having a non-Christian in the Whitehouse is a bad idea and what it would do to ruin America.

10/14/2015 4:58:54 PM

Quote :

"the bible is not the only authority for christians, it is just one of them"

?_?

10/14/2015 6:54:01 PM

unrelated, but i found an old video from 10+ years ago of bobbydigital smoking a bowl at a party the other day, thought it was pretty funny

10/14/2015 7:17:22 PM

Quote :

"I think the more interesting discussion is why those same Christians think having a non-Christian in the Whitehouse is a bad idea and what it would do to ruin America."

I really do try to make threads that get people talking/involved. Having said that, I am a huge fan of the thread going in whichever direction it may go.

10/14/2015 8:18:01 PM

Quote :

"1) the bible is not the only authority for christians, it is just one of them"

[NO]

Quote :

"southern baptists still believe that god is the ultimate authority and that the holy spirit is his manifestation in them "

yes, but they also believe that the Bible is infallible and written by God through the hand of man. That's why they believe wacky shit like Young Earth Creationism.



and I'm about to lose my mind if I see one more person confuse tenant with tenet.

10/14/2015 8:39:10 PM

[YES]

christ, you morons should really learn more about the most popular religion in your own country. not all christians believe that the bible is the only authority, not even all protestants. and like i said before, even those who believe it is the sole authority still have varying degrees to which that applies.


Here, try this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prima_scriptura
vs
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sola_scriptura

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Five_solae

do some reading morans


[Edited on October 14, 2015 at 10:16 PM. Reason : moran]

10/14/2015 10:03:46 PM

JESUS CHRIST dtownral THE WORD IS TENET NOT TENANT.

LORD HAVE MERCY ON YOU, YOU MORAN.

10/14/2015 10:19:24 PM

when you work on contracts you are going to write tenant every time, 100% of the time, I guarantee it

10/14/2015 10:22:54 PM

Quote :

"I think the more interesting discussion is why those same Christians think having a non-Christian in the Whitehouse is a bad idea and what it would do to ruin America."

yea that is what EMCE was essentially asking, but he gave his endorsement for the thread direction so i'll


[Edited on October 14, 2015 at 11:50 PM. Reason : a]

10/14/2015 11:50:20 PM

Quote :

"JESUS CHRIST dtownral THE WORD IS TENET NOT TENANT"

I'll take the blame for continuing the incorrect spelling. Also I prefer Tennant. David Tennant is the man.

10/15/2015 1:27:51 AM

lol, dtownral always resorting to name-calling.

i think i've got a decent handle on religion in the south, I grew-up in it for 18+ years. And yes, the bible was THE authority (or so they said, even if they interpret it however they see fit).

(what other authority is there?)

10/15/2015 8:22:17 AM

what other authorities are there? maybe click one of the links above and learn about how they work?

10/15/2015 8:41:45 AM

Quote :

"Sola scriptura (Latin ablative, "by Scripture alone") is the Christian doctrine that the Bible is the supreme authority in all matters of doctrine and practice. Sola scriptura does not deny that other authorities govern Christian life and devotion, but sees them all as subordinate to and corrected by the written word of God."

10/15/2015 8:45:16 AM

was that so hard? no read the rest of the wikipedia entry, it's not very long. After you finish that, read the other link.

then read this- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sacred_tradition


[Edited on October 15, 2015 at 8:50 AM. Reason : no=now]

10/15/2015 8:47:12 AM

Quote :

"I never understood the obsession with having a Christian in the white house. Could someone please explain?"

It's just a damn fad that was intensified during Obama Admin. coupled with shits like 9/11, al Qaeda, Islamic Extremist, Good vs. Evil, Birthers, "Is Obama a Muslim" bullshits. Portraying yourself as being a "Christian" (candidates) you play into the mind of mainstream America as being the "Good" defending against what is all "Evil" i.e. Islam. Our obsession with leaders having to be a Christian is no different as Saudi Arabia obsession of Sharia Law. Anyways...all those candidates tooting their "Christian" values are a bunch of horseshit. Just stick to politics.

[Edited on October 15, 2015 at 2:30 PM. Reason : .]

10/15/2015 2:28:40 PM

seriously? when JFK was running people were equally scared having a catholic running for office... but he was elected him and a lot supported him (even more after he was killed) so being a non-christian didn't really play into his presidency.

10/15/2015 6:17:19 PM