4

5/29/2007 7:09:57 AM

Being fat is like being poor. If you're not lazy (exercise, work) and have willpower (eat sensibly, spend sensibly) most people can avoid it, or reverse it. It's easier for some than for others, but almost anyone can do it if.

5/29/2007 9:04:59 AM

:drops head with hand on forehead:

i see you did not comprehend that article very well, or you just did not read it at all.

5/29/2007 9:16:46 AM

Quote :

"no, i'm not saying HE's full of shit. I'm saying that I think it would be possible if you ran a lot, but were 50 lbs overweight due to eating too much. but definitely not for your average 50 # overweight couch potato. such a pathetic beast would never make 8-10 miles at even a 9:30 pace."

He didn't just say 9:30 pace people, he said between 8:30-9:30. Two things strike me as being pretty incredulous.

1. That he could run 8:30 (ok, we'll call it 9) miles for an 1:15 while carrying 50 extra pounds on his body.
2. He could do enough running to get up to running for an hour+ and not lose some of that 50 pounds of extra weight.

It doesn't surprise me that a guy that doesn't seem to ever be wrong about anything, and knows it all, would stretch the truth in this instance just to make a point.

5/29/2007 10:12:46 AM

I just want to point out that drunknloaded owned the shit out of BridgetSPK in this thread.

I have no further comments.

5/29/2007 10:22:44 AM

[no fatties]

5/29/2007 11:10:57 AM

Quote :

"Doomed is a skinny fucker getting kidney punched, falling off a boulder, or trying to survive outside in winter."

what?

5/29/2007 11:18:07 AM

Quote :

"Being fat is like being poor. If you're not lazy (exercise, work) and have willpower (eat sensibly, spend sensibly) most people can avoid it, or reverse it. It's easier for some than for others, but almost anyone can do it if."

That's another topic completely. However, equating poverty with laziness is an age old myth

5/29/2007 12:09:59 PM

i think noen was referring to the BMI weight, which is horrible for a athlete

5/29/2007 12:16:31 PM

so fat people have to actually make an effort to lose weight and keep it off?

who would've thunk it?

5/29/2007 12:28:00 PM

^^^ the article says equating obesity with laziness is an age old myth

5/29/2007 1:29:05 PM

No, just that equating laziness with obesity is a myth.

You can be lazy and not be obese. But even if you are naturally obese, but not lazy, then you will make yourself rediculously unhealthy in order to look as society wishes.

5/29/2007 2:15:43 PM

the article mentioned that the fat cells grew and got used to being big, but it made no mention of hyperplasia of fat cells once the body reaches a certain size and how it is damn near impossible to kill those new fat cells off with diet and exercise.

5/29/2007 3:38:15 PM

First off, running in and of itself is not bad for your knees. Improper form, etc will cause knee problems, but it is no worse for your knees than walking. I read a study (which I've tried to find but can't right now) that actually said competitive runners had stronger knees than non-runners because their body has adapted, in a healthy way, to the shock of running.

Also don't knock a 9:30 pace. I'm genetically prone to being overweight (almost everyone in my family is) and currently I'm at 188 (5', 11") and still have some weight to lose. Running, or trotting if you'd rather call it that, is something I'm fairly decent at and helps get my metabolism up. I'm finally starting to break the 9:00 mark again after about 6 weeks of training but running at a 9:30 pace isn't so easy for the general population. I'd even wager that 50% or more of the general population can't even run a 5k at that pace, much less 8+ miles. For you guys who are training for the Olympics or are in the military, it's slow, but really, it's not all that slow for most people.

5/29/2007 5:21:32 PM

I haven't been able to find many threads on running/training. I'm curious to know how you train to get faster. It's probably a lot more common sense than I'm thinking of right now.

5/29/2007 6:03:05 PM

a 27minute(9minute miles) 5k is alright... if your a chick

a 24minute(8minute miles) 5k is alright... for a dude

a 21 minute(7minute miles) 5k is moving along for a chick, good for a dude...

a 18 minute(6 minute miles) 5k is hauling ass

beyond that your not doing it recreationally by ANY means...

There are chicks that are fast as hell... but I run in the 21minute range and typically only loose to a handful of chick... I'm just saying what I've seen personally, and I KNOW there are exceptions to all of this...

I'm just pointing out that 9minute miles are mediocre...

but I do HIGHLY agree that >60% of the population couldn't run 3miles period. so doing it continuously at whatever pace is still something to smile about...

just keep pushing but make sure to stretch and do it in good form or you will in fact screw up your knees...

[Edited on May 29, 2007 at 7:27 PM. Reason : winners of 5k's occasionally break 15minute points... just a side note]

5/29/2007 7:25:41 PM

Quote :

"Sputter: I just want to point out that drunknloaded owned the shit out of BridgetSPK in this thread. I have no further comments."

No, he didn't.

And since you have no further comments, I guess you can't argue about it.

He's a dumbass who does not understand and is making no attempt to understand. He has repeatedly bragged about how lazy/stoned he is all the time and how he can't believe he's not fatter--though he denies it. I'm not gonna listen to someone like that talk about lifestyle changes and accuse fat folks of not trying hard enough.

It's like nobody read the article--they all just came out of the woodwork to be like, "LOL, fat people are lazy, and I condemn them..." And then when challenged on it, they ammend their statements to be less offensive. So I guess they're pussies, too.

[Edited on May 29, 2007 at 8:24 PM. Reason : sss]

5/29/2007 8:18:56 PM

well on page 4... most people that didn't start from the beginning aren't going to take the time to read the artical and the entire thread...

they are going to see the topic and chime in with their predispositions...

and then we have the occasional trolling people too but who takes what they have to say as serious conversation anyways?

5/29/2007 8:22:33 PM

I understand what good 5k times are. I took run conditioning back in the day. My point was, you guys are comparing most people to Olympic runners or soldiers who are obviously going to be better trained. I still have a hard time believing that someone 50 lbs overweight was running 8+ miles at a 9:30 pace, much less 8:30. I'm not claiming to be at the peak of fitness, but I'm 18 lbs from my ideal weight and I'm running anywhere between a 5k and 5 miles at a 9:00 pace (4 times / week). If someone is at the point where they can run 8-10 miles at 8:30-9:30, I have a really hard time believing they are 50 lbs overweight.

Also I think this study left out one significant factor - that exercise and increased muscle mass boosts metabolism. They just made the people diet, which in and of itself will slow down metabolism. If diet is combined with exercise, even moderate cardio, the weight is easier to lose and keep off (assuming the person stays somewhat active).

I was about 205 a couple years ago and lost 25 lbs over 6 months with diet and weight lifting, no cardio really. I've gained about 8 lbs back but starting to lose that again (and hopefully more). If it weren't for exercise I'd have to count every single calorie on my plate at every meal and snack.

5/29/2007 8:41:34 PM

^^I'm not really talking about anything serious here.

Just saying:

Some dumbass coming out and saying, "If fat people exercised and ate better, they'd lose weight..." does not "own the fuck out of" me.

I mean, you guys have no idea. You like to assume that obese people are just lazy and don't try hard enough. Luckily, the scientific community doesn't look at it that way so we are actually making in advances in our understanding of the issue.

There are so many factors that haven't even been discussed. Like, did y'all know that there are hormones that the brain releases to the body to signal that it's full when eating? And what do you know--those hormones aren't similarly present in lots of obese people! It's findings like that that will help us combat the obesity problem. Also, I think we need to develop labor unions/parties/whatever to put pressure on corporations to create healthy jobs. And tons of other shit.

I'm saying that if we pretend like obesity is all about laziness/willpower and we choose to condemn/loathe fat folks and make "NO SYMPATHY!" claims, we won't change the problem. We don't live in a fascist state where the police can come around a restaraunt and say, "Ma'am, we understand you've had a lot to eat and that you don't think you're full..." so we're gonna have to cut you off now...

But if folks wanna sit around and pretend that it's all about laziness, it's their perogative to be ignorant. And they can say "Oh, I understand genetics, but genetics only means it'll be harder, and if they can't overcome it, it's cause they're lazy..." but that's willfully ignorant.

There's something inside us that makes us want to loathe/condemn our neighbors. Compassion isn't a bad thing, folks.

^They've actually recently started considering the idea that increased muscle mass burns more calories in some folks, but that in other folks, it doesn't so much.

[Edited on May 29, 2007 at 8:58 PM. Reason : sss]

5/29/2007 8:45:21 PM

Quote :

"He's a dumbass who does not understand and is making no attempt to understand. He has repeatedly bragged about how lazy/stoned he is all the time and how he can't believe he's not fatter--though he denies it. "

ARE YOU FUCKING INSANE?!?!??!?!?

HOW DO I NOT UNDERSTAND BEING HEALTHY? I AM HEALTHY SO HOW DO I NOT UNDERSTAND HOW TO BE HEALTHY?

JESUS CHRIST YOU ARE A DUMB FAT BITCH

anyways, i was going to ask the following before i read that stupid cunts post...so if fat peoples cells have some kinda memory that makes them more prone to becoming fat again, do skinny and or healthy people have some kinda memory in their cells that allows them to stay skinnier easier?

5/29/2007 8:46:25 PM

^You've talked about how much weed you smoke and how terribly you eat and how lazy you are and how you should be fatter than you are.

You may have turned it around recently, but you cannot deny that you said all that other shit in the past.

My mind's a steel trap...

YOU UGLY, SOFT DUMBASS!



[Edited on May 29, 2007 at 8:49 PM. Reason : CAPS!!!!]

5/29/2007 8:48:58 PM

omg you so lose this thread

get your fat ass off tww asap and get it in a gym, or stop eatting as much, or start eatting a well balanced diet, or a combination of all 3

and also, walk to and from the gym...thats extra exercise and you obviously need it

5/29/2007 8:51:14 PM

Quote :

"I'm curious to know how you train to get faster. It's probably a lot more common sense than I'm thinking of right now."

interval work

not to discount the importance of endurance training if you want to be, well, an endurance runner.

Quote :

" You like to assume that obese people are just lazy and don't try hard enough."

The vast majority DON'T try hard enough. I didn't say they didn't try (though some don't). I didn't say they didn't try hard. I'm saying that some people have to hit it the problem with a really big hammer. I'm sorry for that, but I didn't make the rules. If you're fat, the odds are great that it's because you're attacking the problem with an inadequate hammer. Get a bigger one. Whatever it takes is all that it takes to succeed, as the saying goes.

5/29/2007 8:55:01 PM

^But you have no sympathy/compassion for them that they require a bigger hammer?

You have no interest in understanding the problem at a slightly more advanced level than "Get a bigger hammer?"

There is something to be said for conventional wisdom similar to your hammer talk. When my father was growing up, his grandmother used to say, "If you don't lay off them taters n biscuits, you gon get fat..." and never said a word about ham and eggs... So years and years ago, a woman who had probably never read a book besides the Bible knew that simple carbohydrates contributed to weight gain...

There's no point to that. I just wanted to share it.

5/29/2007 9:07:49 PM

why have compassion for someone when they don't put in the required effort to be healthy?

5/29/2007 9:15:55 PM

Why not? We generally have compassion for people who are put in unfair positions.

5/29/2007 9:23:39 PM

so basically you are saying people should show compassion for those that do not put in the required effort to be fit?

5/29/2007 9:29:50 PM

FUCK FAT PEOPLE

5/29/2007 9:39:28 PM

^^We should show compassion for people who get dealt a crap hand.

But people have different ideas about compassion. Some folks are unable to show compassion for anybody but their family and friends.

And I'll continue to drive home the importance of understanding the issue beyond "Get a bigger hammer."

^Aren't you that douchebag who complained about people tagging photos that you don't "look good" in?

FUCK VAIN PEOPLE!

5/29/2007 9:48:12 PM

I dont have compassion for people that could be healthy but blame it on a "crap hand"

Quote :

"And I do know how to lose weight. I'm the best at losing weight. I'm also the best at gaining it. And it's my personal business. I expect you not to involve yourself in it."

This is laughable

5/29/2007 9:51:40 PM

Quote :

"Aren't you that douchebag who complained about people tagging photos that you don't "look good" in? FUCK VAIN PEOPLE! "

haha wow, YOU GOT ME

that thread was a parody...nice try though

5/29/2007 10:39:50 PM

Quote :

"But you have no sympathy/compassion for them that they require a bigger hammer?"

no, i really do. it's when they don't get the bigger hammer that i don't feel sympathy.

Quote :

"You have no interest in understanding the problem at a slightly more advanced level than "Get a bigger hammer?""

Yes and no. I suppose I have an interest in understanding, but it's ultimately a bottom line business.

Quote :

"There is something to be said for conventional wisdom similar to your hammer talk. When my father was growing up, his grandmother used to say, "If you don't lay off them taters n biscuits, you gon get fat..." and never said a word about ham and eggs... So years and years ago, a woman who had probably never read a book besides the Bible knew that simple carbohydrates contributed to weight gain... There's no point to that. I just wanted to share it."

haha

5/29/2007 10:41:07 PM

mmmmm taters!

5/29/2007 11:00:15 PM

Being fat is a lifestyle choice the great majority of the time. It is a decision to eat more that your BMR when you don't exercise.

Why the hell should we show compassion for those who get dealt a shitty hand and has "fat" genetics. I mean if a person who has a family history of lung cancer decides to smoke a pack a day, do you feel sorry for them? I mean if a person legitimately has a metabolism problem, eats their BMR and exercises 3 times a week and still gains and can't lose weight...that person deserves our pity. If a person just has shitty genetics and decides to eat McDs 4 times a week and not exercise at all...please, tell me how that person deserves my sympathy.

5/29/2007 11:29:01 PM

I know a lot of people who aren't "smart" that bust their ass in school and get good jobs.

I know a lot of people who aren't "attractive" and bust their ass working out/socializing and get hot girls.


Why is it any different that people that don't naturally have "good" bodies shouldn't bust their ass to have socially acceptable builds?

5/29/2007 11:39:37 PM

Quote :

"He didn't just say 9:30 pace people, he said between 8:30-9:30. Two things strike me as being pretty incredulous. 1. That he could run 8:30 (ok, we'll call it 9) miles for an 1:15 while carrying 50 extra pounds on his body. 2. He could do enough running to get up to running for an hour+ and not lose some of that 50 pounds of extra weight. It doesn't surprise me that a guy that doesn't seem to ever be wrong about anything, and knows it all, would stretch the truth in this instance just to make a point."

Hence why I gave a range, because I SLOW DOWN during my long runs.

I ran the Country Music Marathon last year. When I started out (with the help of LuisClues to help me train) I weighed in at 235 lbs or so. My own ideal weight (based simply on when I was in MY best shape) is about 190. Putting me 45 pounds overweight.

I trained 6 days a week for 16 weeks, and the day I ran the race I weighed in at 210, STILL 20 pounds heavy.


I can take a year off and get up and run 10 miles NO PROBLEM. No I'm not a fucking lazy shit, but yes I am still "overweight".

Quote :

"[Edited on May 28, 2007 at 3:02 PM. Reason : i don't ever remember Noen being fat. maybe it was after i left town?]"

Josh, when you lived next to me, I was a solid 30 pounds overweight. Crazy how you could barely tell huh?

And Blind Hate, I'll be glad to go running with you anytime to show you that a fatass can knock out ten miles at a 9:30 pace or less. Because there is a HUGE gap between FITNESS and WEIGHT. Which is my entire point for this fucking thread. That BMI is a worthless measure of health and fitness.

5/29/2007 11:43:02 PM

Quote :

"bbehe: Why the hell should we show compassion for those who get dealt a shitty hand and has "fat" genetics. I mean if a person who has a family history of lung cancer decides to smoke a pack a day, do you feel sorry for them? I mean if a person legitimately has a metabolism problem, eats their BMR and exercises 3 times a week and still gains and can't lose weight...that person deserves our pity. If a person just has shitty genetics and decides to eat McDs 4 times a week and not exercise at all...please, tell me how that person deserves my sympathy."

But there are plenty of people who do exercise and don't eat McDonald's at all...

And your need to paint the issue in such black-and-white terms is suspect.

Quote :

"rallydurham: I know a lot of people who aren't "smart" that bust their ass in school and get good jobs. I know a lot of people who aren't "attractive" and bust their ass working out/socializing and get hot girls. Why is it any different that people that don't naturally have "good" bodies shouldn't bust their ass to have socially acceptable builds?"

I tend to have sympathy/compassion for people who aren't smart and people who aren't attractive.

And I don't really give a shit what the guy-who-hates-on-poor-people thinks.

[Edited on May 29, 2007 at 11:48 PM. Reason : sss]

5/29/2007 11:47:45 PM

Quote :

"But there are plenty of people who do exercise and don't eat McDonald's at all... And your need to paint the issue in such black-and-white terms is suspect."

and there are people who smoke 2 packs a day and still don't get lung cancer, whats your point? I find smoking disgusting either way.

5/30/2007 12:08:49 AM

Quote :

"I tend to have sympathy/compassion for people who aren't smart and people who aren't attractive. "

I don't. Why have sympathy/compassion for the way people are?

I have sympathy and compassion for people who work hard, do the right things to overcome their hardships, and still get shit on. For the guy who isn't smart, but REALLY works hard in spite of that and has trouble. For the guy who is overweight but REALLY works out and eats right to be as healthy as possible, but still has a little to lose. For the guy who is ugly but doesn't let it get him down and is confident and personable, but still gets shot down.

5/30/2007 12:20:18 AM

^I have sympathy and compassion for those people, too. I have it for almost everybody for all sorts of reasons, and that may be the issue here.

Y'all are just less likely to be that way than I am.

I mean, one of my friend's mother has a horrible, awful, terrible voice. When she speaks, you want to strangle her. And I feel bad for her. Sure, she's overcome it, but I do feel copmassion for her.

I don't lay awake all night worrying about her--I reserve that for older prison inmates who are suffering from cancer and organ failure. But I still feel sympathy/empathy for her.

[Edited on May 30, 2007 at 1:06 AM. Reason : sss]

5/30/2007 1:05:14 AM

Absolutely, no sympathy for anybody!

You say you have Down Syndrome? Tough luck kid, get a bigger hammer. If Forest Gump can do it you can too.

5/30/2007 10:33:01 AM

Down Syndrome != lifestyle choice

5/30/2007 11:31:03 AM

yeah you pretty much have to HAVE the syndrome to make that comparison

5/30/2007 11:32:55 AM

Quote :

"Being fat is a lifestyle choice the great majority of the time. "

In the same way that being poor is a lifestyle choice the great majority of the time.

5/30/2007 11:54:43 AM

The only sympathy I have for overweight people are the kids. It should be considered child abuse to start your kid down a long road leading to several health issues, and bad habits that are often times hard to break all before they have the self awareness to choose to be healthy or not.

Otherwise you know what you're putting into your mouth, you know what the lack of movement is doing to your waistline. It is your choice to make things better or stay down the disgusting path. If you choose to be fat i don't want to hear you bitching about issues related to it or reasons/excuses. If you smoke I don't want to hear you bitch about cancer or why you can't quit. If you want it, get it, otherwise shut the fuck up.

5/30/2007 12:01:28 PM

I wonder how much people's perception of obesity will change when genetic doping becomes an affordable reality for the masses. Will people finally admit how much genetics plays in the composition of the body, or will they condemn the treatment as morally wrong so they won't have to admit to themselves how wrong their original assumptions were?

5/30/2007 12:18:34 PM

More hot chicks? Men will love it.

5/30/2007 12:21:18 PM

what about the women that weren't all that physically attractive before but were able to stand out due to being thin? Will they feel jilted that they just lost their genetic edge over the competition?

5/30/2007 12:26:02 PM

No, they'll just get fake tits.

Women are constantly raising the stakes and 1-upping each other when it comes to getting guys attention.

Men benefit from all the jockeying.

5/30/2007 12:27:09 PM