I mean at this point we know she is gonna win, we are gonna try to survive 4 years, and then hope that America can look back and be like WTF were we thinking with those two 4 years ago and try to fix this whole thing.

Instead we will end up with Clinton versus Cruz or some equally stupid choice and start this whole thing over again haha.

9/15/2016 11:55:25 AM

https://twitter.com/phil_lewis_/status/776427945401389056



[Edited on September 15, 2016 at 12:15 PM. Reason : ]

9/15/2016 11:55:53 AM

Clinton just tells so many half-truths and purposefully deceptive statements that many people just cannot trust her. She also uses some of the dirtiest campaigning tactics without directly stooping to Trump's level. This is not the same as lying, but when you say you do not trust someone, others tend to make that assumption.

Person A) "I don't trust Hillary."
Person B) "Why? What about her statements make you think she is lying?"

9/15/2016 12:13:55 PM

^ Clinton tells less half-truths and lies than Trump does, you realize this?

Hillary is an opportunistic liar: she lies to cover her butt or to avoid trouble, we've seen countless examples in the media about the emails.

Trump is a pathological liar: he lies as a shortcut to get his way without having to gain trust or respect or to avoid talking about something or just because. Like when he said he had a secret team of people with secret evidence on Obama's birth place, or that he didn't pretend to be his own obeseqious spokesperson, or he met Putin, or he didn't know David Duke, or he has a secret plan to defeat ISIS, or he would release his tax records, or he saw muslims celebrating after 9/11, or he would build a wall etc, etc.

I think the reason the perception is different is that when Hillary gets caught lying, she acts remorseful and embarrassed (a normal reaction IOW). When Trump get's caught lying, he charges through, pretends nothing ever happened. He avoids the subject entirely (look at his Colbert Show interview or when he met the Mexican president).

Obviously most people with 2 brain cells to rub together sees through this, but a solid ~50% of the country can't see through this-- how can this be changed?

[Edited on September 15, 2016 at 12:19 PM. Reason : ]

9/15/2016 12:16:52 PM

http://philadelphia.cbslocal.com/2016/09/14/donald-trump-jr-media-is-clintons-number-one-surrogate/

fun Holocaust reference

9/15/2016 12:20:04 PM

I agree with moron on this one. While I don't personally trust Clinton, of the two choices she is the most predictable and you at least know what you are getting, whereas we know that Trump is a loose cannon and is fine with saying completely false things just to say them or so it appears. Do I think our country will be better off with Hillary.. not really. Do I think we will be better off with Hillary as opposed to Trump.. definitely.

9/15/2016 12:27:07 PM

that's the problem. comparing hillary with trump as the standard is inherently flawed. "cleaner than trump" should not be a qualification for anything and it's amazing how they have convinced so many Americans to use him as the ethical standards bearer of our country. that's why we are the laughingstock of the developed world.

9/15/2016 4:25:24 PM

^^^ came to post that. what in the fuck.

Quote :

"Trump Jr., who is one of his father’s advisers and most visible surrogates, was riffing about Hillary Clinton’s supposedly cozy relationship with the media when he invoked the Nazi imagery. “Without the media, this wouldn’t even be a contest, but the media has built her up. They’ve let her slide on every in-discrepancy, on every lie, on every DNC game trying to get Bernie Sanders out of this thing,” he said. “I mean, if Republicans were doing that they’d be warming up the gas chamber right now.”"

9/15/2016 7:18:43 PM

he doesn't realize that gas chambers don't need to be warmed up. you're about to kill the people why do you care if they think its chilly in the chamber? What an idiot.

9/15/2016 7:28:53 PM

everything you ever needed to know about trump
https://www.reddit.com/r/EnoughTrumpSpam/comments/4uabwt/final_response_megathread/

9/16/2016 12:02:45 AM

https://twitter.com/VaughnHillyard/status/776635369177710592

Pence, asked why Trump won't release previously-audited tax returns-->

9/16/2016 3:17:08 AM

Gonna be lots of LOLs when Trump denounces birtherism at a debate and the media goes nuts over the new Trump like he wasn't playing them all along.

It's sickening that you can already see he is going to get CREDIT for this even though he was the biggest culprit for over half of the GOP (the deplorable half) believing Obama was born elsewhere.

At this point, I honestly think he could win. I just hope he doesn't cause too much damage along the way.

[Edited on September 16, 2016 at 7:48 AM. Reason : Or when he does it today]

9/16/2016 7:45:12 AM

Quote :

"^ Clinton tells less half-truths and lies than Trump does, you realize this?"

Holy leaping Jesus. Get your head out of your ass. Saying one candidate appears untruthful infers absolutely nothing about the truthfulness of the other candidate. "[Y]ou realize this?" FWIW, Hillary was seen as a deceptive, cronyism-fueled politician well before Trump was running for president (2008).

Quote :

"Obviously most people with 2 brain cells to rub together sees through this, but a solid ~50% of the country can't see through this-- how can this be changed?"

Now that's a generous interpretation of the current race, isn't it? I know people who plan to vote for Trump. They do not believe anything he says. They still plan to vote for him because of one of the following reasons:
-They HATE Hillary.
-They are Republican and believe that the party will reign him in or immediately impeach him.
-He's just "goofy and harmless".
-An outsider shaking up Washington in any capacity is better than voting for a puppet candidate forcibly propped up by the establishment.

9/16/2016 9:58:20 AM

There is no difference between saying "I'm voting for Trump because he wants to deport Mexicans and ban Muslims" or "I'm voting for Trump even though he wants to deport Mexicans and ban Muslims." Either way, you're ok with an entire class of Americans being discriminated against because you think it benefits you. It's a distinction without a difference and these people should be ashamed of themselves.

[Edited on September 16, 2016 at 11:11 AM. Reason : .]

9/16/2016 11:10:52 AM

Lol, Trump conned the media into giving full coverage for his hotel opening.

He shits all over them and they just gobble it up.

9/16/2016 11:16:15 AM

^^ sort of, except that deporting people here illegally is not new, Obama has done more of it than any other US President, and the idea of carefully selecting who is allowed to immigrate is SOP in virtually every country on earth.

Having policies that appeal to racists is not the same as having racist policies. Secure borders and selective immigration isn't racist, it's the norm everywhere.

9/16/2016 11:33:57 AM

There is just a very strong anti-immigration wave now hitting both the U.S. and Europe. Let's not forget that Farage proclaimed that Brexit was a victory "for the real people".

Politicians like Farage and Trump are wise to the fact that a growing number of westerners want to put up borders and deport people, and they embrace it.

9/16/2016 11:37:53 AM

Honestly, it's debatable as to whether it's even an incorrect view. I'm largely pro immigration, immigrants are usually very productive and hard working people. Contrary to what Trump said immigrants actually commit less crime, they're more entrepreneurial, have stabile family structures, etc. Legal immigrants are a book to our society and culture. Illegal immigrants generally are as well although they tend to be slightly less beneficial as a whole.

Europe is a different situation, they have a more of a welfare state and they aren't getting immigrants, a lot of who they are getting are refugees. Europe is also less inclusive than the US in many ways. For all its progressive utopian image it's actually quite parochial in terms of culture, even in the most advanced parts of Western Europe.

As we move further towards having a robust welfare state, raise the minimum wage, etc. large scale immigration may become untenable here as well.

[Edited on September 16, 2016 at 11:51 AM. Reason : Dndnjndn]

9/16/2016 11:49:57 AM

Quote :

"sort of, except that deporting people here illegally is not new, Obama has done more of it than any other US President, and the idea of carefully selecting who is allowed to immigrate is SOP in virtually every country on earth. Having policies that appeal to racists is not the same as having racist policies. Secure borders and selective immigration isn't racist, it's the norm everywhere."

It's absolutely not the norm anywhere on earth to select who you allow to immigrate based on their religious beliefs, that's just straight up Breitbart bullshit. And while secure borders and deporting illegals isn't racist in and of itself, the way Trump has suggested he'd do it and promoted it absolutely is.

The bottom line is that Trump has made absolutely no secret that he's a xenophobic demagogue and anyone who votes for him belongs in the same "basket".

[Edited on September 16, 2016 at 11:55 AM. Reason : .]

9/16/2016 11:54:39 AM

By religion, no except in a few legit theocratic counties (good luck immigrating to SA as a jew for example) . By country of origin though is quite common and strict scrutiny of immigrants is the norm everywhere. The Muslim ban is undoubtedly xenophobic as hell and unworkable. It's designed to capture a certain type of voter, no question.

9/16/2016 12:00:18 PM

Most countries are racist though, we shouldn't follow in their footsteps.

For border control, there should be considerations in policy for countries we share a huge land border with, and we should be selective based on skills and family ties, but a growing, diverse population of people who would uproot their entire lives to come here can only help the country economically and socially going into the next century.

9/16/2016 12:19:17 PM

this is why I hate democrats. they get on a high horse and act like x result is bad because y rhetoric is used to encourage it but then they turn around and support z rhetoric without mentioning or acknowledging that it also leads to x result.

this can be applied to immigration, foreign policy, climate change, mass incarceration, corporate fraud and pretty much every major topic affecting the 99%

9/16/2016 12:22:42 PM

^^ 100%. I'd love to go to a points based immigration system. We need more skilled work visas and it shouldn't take a decade for someone with an h1b to become a citizen. Frankly I'd like to make it very easy to immigrate and become a citizen except from a handful of places (none of which are mexico).

This isn't a cop out, but we're in a bit of a unique situation. We are a rich, developed country sharing a border with a considerably less developed country. Maybe I'm just blanking here, but I can't think of an analogous situation. As long as we're operating under our current system that's always going to lead to massive problems.

9/16/2016 12:32:27 PM

We need more H1B visas because we have too many jobs and need to lower wages for corporations

9/16/2016 12:59:43 PM

Always fun to see the far right and far left overlap on insane immigration concerns.

9/16/2016 1:18:55 PM

Quote :

"Europe is a different situation, they have a more of a welfare state and they aren't getting immigrants, a lot of who they are getting are refugees. Europe is also less inclusive than the US in many ways. For all its progressive utopian image it's actually quite parochial in terms of culture, even in the most advanced parts of Western Europe. "

Completely incorrect. The British succession talk started way before the modern Refugee crisis and was in response to a major wave of immigration from southern and eastern European states that were newly admitted into the union. The British health care system is the golden boy of that European family, and the argument was being made that migrants were coming to the country solely for an operation or medical attention. This was a major factor towards voting for a British departure from the EU.

9/17/2016 12:42:21 PM

Well, since I never mentioned Brexit in that post and was talking about the immigration situation in Europe I'm not sure how any of that is incorrect or what your comment is meant to address.

9/17/2016 1:02:14 PM

you be backsteppin' bro

9/17/2016 1:29:56 PM

Quote :

"Europe is a different situation, they have a more of a welfare state and they aren't getting immigrants, a lot of who they are getting are refugees."

Europe is getting waves of economic migrants claiming to be refugees.

9/17/2016 1:35:21 PM

https://twitter.com/rorycooper/status/777200093225160706

9/17/2016 3:51:49 PM

[^^^how am I backstepping. Read any of my posts in the Brexit vote thread and you can see that I posted about brits being concerned about lack of sovereignty and about "Polish plumbers."

^^yes, they are getting a lot of economic migrants from North Africa posing as refugees, that's true. Totally a legitimate concern and part of why so many people are hostile towards letting in legit refugees.

[Edited on September 17, 2016 at 3:53 PM. Reason : Carat ]

9/17/2016 3:52:32 PM

^^ Wow, crazy.

I honestly think that Clinton should at some point in her debate, pick up her phone and go to his twitter account and read this shit out loud.

9/17/2016 4:28:02 PM

Tonight on The History Channel: Great Moments in Presidential Debate History!

9/17/2016 5:13:54 PM

Currently threatening litigation against the NY Times.

This long national joke needs to end.

** but seriously, is it not massively disturbing that his response to investigative journalism is to silence them via litigation? Why would this not be taken further when he is president? How would people react if Clinton threatened litigation next time an email or Clinton Foundation story hit?

[Edited on September 17, 2016 at 7:52 PM. Reason : X]

9/17/2016 7:48:06 PM

^ Basically, Hillary has a ton of ammunition to attack him as a person not fit for service, but the problem is that he fully commits to deflecting that criticism by just blatantly lying. Previous candidates such as Romney would just back step their way out of the room, but Trump deflects everything by saying that he never did it, and he supporters don't think twice about believing him.

This is why I like the idea of just reading crazy shit live that is on his feed. I would also love for Hillary to attack this notion that business experience = political experience. Running a business is only a small part of being president, and the two aren't that closely related to use as CV fluff for POTUS.

9/18/2016 8:44:16 AM

Quote :

"This is why I like the idea of just reading crazy shit live that is on his feed. I would also love for Hillary to attack this notion that business experience = political experience. Running a business is only a small part of being president, and the two aren't that closely related to use as CV fluff for POTUS."

Eh, that problem goes well beyond Donald Trump. Despite having a worse record on job creation, GDP, and the deficit for over half a century, somehow Republicans have duped voters into believing they are better for the economy. Basically they see rich Republicans palling around with rich businessmen, and believe if they vote Republican, they'll become rich too. It's a tone deaf wall of stupid that's proven nearly impossible for Democrats to penetrate.

[Edited on September 18, 2016 at 10:20 AM. Reason : .]

9/18/2016 10:19:57 AM

^^
The people that would support him or do support him have already accepted the fact that he's a crazy racist, they still think he's their crazy racist. If Hillary wants to erode his support, she needs to focus on how he hurts white people and she helps white people.

This is fertile ground, trump u is big, the contractors he's screwed over, his connection to the mafia, his lack of charity, skirting taxes. Coupling this was painting him a divisive could be effective.

9/18/2016 12:27:45 PM

still love to see that shit though.

9/18/2016 12:49:33 PM

another banner day for Trump and his surrogates

9/18/2016 3:34:38 PM

Alright peoples I've been on vacation since Wednesday, and haven't checked the news since.

What good Trump stories have I missed?

9/18/2016 6:11:58 PM

Trump has threatened to sue the NY Times for reporting on his taxes, and basically wants to destroy the first amendment if he becomes president.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/sep/18/donald-trump-threatens-to-sue-new-york-times-over-irresponsible-intent

Pence says his role model for Vice President is Dick Cheney

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/mike-pence-role-model-vice-president-dick-cheney/story?id=42170897

9/18/2016 6:58:22 PM

It blows my mind that they legitimately try and claim he finished it in 2011 and dropped it.

I mean there is fucking video. His God damn tweets are still up. They have so little respect for the American citizen that they aren't even trying at this point..

9/18/2016 7:15:58 PM

and are still blaming Hilary for it

9/18/2016 8:09:25 PM

Quote :

"Hi larry"

9/18/2016 8:18:22 PM

Quote :

"https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/sep/18/donald-trump-threatens-to-sue-new-york-times-over-irresponsible-intent "

Wow, his entire business MO has been begging or forcing government to give him handouts to build apartments and hotels for rich people.

9/18/2016 9:53:01 PM

Trumps comments on websites and magazines that have bomb making tutorials are pretty scary. I don't like that they exist either but it seems like traveling down a very authoritative path mentioning that right now no one shuts them down because they are afraid of violating free speech.

He didn't say he would explocitly but he's not far from it..

9/19/2016 12:03:02 PM

But what if I need to blow up a beaver dam?

9/19/2016 12:20:07 PM

^^ do you have a link?

I'm waiting for trump to call for book burnings of the and material.

9/19/2016 12:50:32 PM

SopanDeb on twitter (CBS News beat reporter for Trump) transcribed all of Trumps appearances. Got it from there.

9/19/2016 2:12:42 PM

http://www.npr.org/2016/09/19/494633030/trump-calls-it-sad-that-n-y-bombing-suspect-gets-medical-care-lawyer?utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=politics&utm_medium=social&utm_term=nprnews

Legitimately wondering if he has ever glanced at the Constitution. Maybe one of his butlers shows him 2A and nothing else?

9/19/2016 8:05:51 PM