Taurus .38spl Ultra Lite. Light wear on the cylinder from being carried. Shot very little, great shape. No box or papers.

$250

9/10/2009 10:10:26 PM

PDHSC told me today that a 20 guage with bird shot is plenty for home defense.
I am a shotgun noob, but that is rediculous. Any knowledgable resource says bird shot is for birds, and buck or slugs for larger.

9/10/2009 11:37:50 PM

bird shot would probably turn a sober intruder around, but it'll only piss off a high crackhead

9/10/2009 11:40:56 PM

PDHSC really doesn't know what they are talking about sometimes.

Ya gotta take personal opinion with a grain of salt no matter where you go.

9/11/2009 12:54:55 AM

I keep birdshot in my 12ga. It will be plenty enough to blow a hole in whatever I shoot at. I shot a piece of plywood at about 7 yards with it and it folded the plywood in half.

I dont use buckshot or slugs anymore because of wall penetration. I live with people and I am afraid if I did have to shoot it would go right through the wall and hit someone unintentional.

9/11/2009 7:19:16 AM

an intruder is much more likely to survive a round of bird shot

and dead men tell no tales

9/11/2009 7:39:24 AM

^No shit, but there is not rule saying that you only shoot the guy once. Let me know if he survives the second and third round. At close range, bird shot will fuck you up.

9/11/2009 9:20:15 AM

Birdshot is garbage for personal defense, period. I don't care what the range is. Yes, it can produce horrific and gruesome flesh wounds at close range, but each pellet contains so little energy that birdshot simply does not offer sufficient penetration depth. It will just tear shit up badly on the surface, which may stop people if they will comply due to pain. But honestly, when you shoot, you've got to be legally able to kill them and thus you want the ammunition to stop them immediately. Also, if you have birdshot loads in your gun and you're fighting for your life, you should be aiming exclusively at the neck and face, which means you've now got a much smaller target than you had before if you wish to effectively wound them (ie - incapacitate or at least blind).

My understanding is that #1 buckshot offers the most wound area (Like if you sum the cross sectional area of each pellet in the shell you'll get a higher number with a #1 buckshot load than you do with 0, 00 or 000 and I'm almost positive it exceeds #4 buck as well) and still offers very solid penetration. All things considered, this is the best load you could be using in your home defense shotgun IMO. Unfortunately, very few #1 buckshot loads even exist because people want to see "00 or 000" on the box. It surprises me how small of a market there seems to be for it considering how good it is as defense ammunition.

9/11/2009 9:39:48 AM

I have a Remington 870 12ga with a rifled barrel and buck shot for home defense. I wouldnt trust anything less than buck shot for home defense mainly because of what NeuseRvrRat said. Its hard to take down somebody who is high as hell and wont feel much pain. I have heard stories from people I know that thought a 25acp would be good for home defense and said it took several shots to stop the intruder. I dont want to take that chance, I wanted a one shot stop. Bird shot will cause flesh wounds, buck shot is a lot more effective. And the reason I use a rifled barrel is because the rifling will cause the buck shot to spread quicker in a doughnut shaped pattern, thus improving your chance of making contact with some pellets on the first shot even if you have horrible aim. The rifling slings the buck shot out gives me a little more confidence that it will do some serious damage all over the body instead of just one area. The link below shows tests of what buck shot does out of a rifled barrel.

http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot43.htm

9/11/2009 11:23:33 AM

Let me shoot any of you guys with birdshot, see dont you stop intruding that second. I will stick with what I have in my 500, if that does not work, I have my SR9 and my 38 to back me up. All else fails, the AK will come out.

9/11/2009 1:38:04 PM

^ yes a normal person would stop, but to somebody who is coked out they wont stop, it will just slow them down a second.

9/11/2009 1:41:52 PM

^^yeh man, ^ is right. get a guy on PCP and see what birdshot does to him

9/11/2009 1:43:12 PM

Then I refer you to the AK.

9/11/2009 1:49:13 PM

^I thought you were worried about over penetration?

You want to stop the thread immediately, not after multiple attempts, and then you get sued for their pain and suffering, because they are a good kid.........

9/11/2009 2:09:24 PM

^^If you really value your life and not some "I'm so macho, I have a shotgun" mentality, you will use the correct ammunition. It is a weapon and it is for the most extreme circumstances, not merely scaring people away. Birdshot is for small critters, buckshot is for big ones. Pretty sure small critters aren't the ones that will kill you. #1 or larger shot is the only thing that can *reliably* and adequately penetrate to kill a human being.

9/11/2009 2:35:17 PM

Anyone have a 12guage for sale?

9/11/2009 2:55:24 PM

This is the for sale thread, so I dunno why we're talking about home defense loads.

Anyway, birdshot is a horrible idea. You won't stop a human unless they're a foot from your barrel.
It simply doesn't have enough penetration, even for a shot to the head. I've seen pics on the net of a guy shot by bird shot at home defense distance and he lived just fine. The pattern was only about 6" accross (which would be about 25 ft away).

00 reduced recoil is my load. #1 buck would be my choice for the above reasons if only they had reduced recoil loads.
If you're worried about over penetration then you'd have to drop down to #4 buck. It won't penetrate 2 layers of drywall. It will work for most humans (would be marginal for shooting fatties in the body).

^I may have a Remington 870 Express with KG GunKote matte black finish for sale in a little while.
I haven't decided if I want to keep it.
I will post after I decide.

[Edited on September 11, 2009 at 3:06 PM. Reason : ]

9/11/2009 3:04:37 PM

^Just let me know if and when.

9/11/2009 3:38:13 PM

870 mag express is my WalMart gun of choice as a home defense gun, though I upgraded to the long mag tube on mine.

10 rounds and empty chamber of 9 pellet reduced recoil loads, or as it is now, 8 rounds of 3in mag 15 pellet loads. Last range practice I went through 16 of the mag loads, 20 regular buck ,and 100 bird shot practicing with that gun, it hits where I look out to 20 yards even form the hip, which is good enough for me.

9/11/2009 4:38:54 PM

Which walmart still sells shotguns?

9/11/2009 8:52:56 PM

many, just call and ask

9/11/2009 9:18:14 PM

Quote :

"If you're worried about over penetration then you'd have to drop down to #4 buck. It won't penetrate 2 layers of drywall. It will work for most humans (would be marginal for shooting fatties in the body). "

I shot a smallish buck once with #4 buck (12 gauge, 3" magnum load). It pretty much dropped the deer in his tracks (he rolled and flailed down a hill into a creek, but he went down when I pulled the trigger and never got back up). I don't remember there being any exit wounds--I found most of the pellets embedded in the hide on the far side of the deer (as opposed to a deer I shot at double the range with 000, where every pellet went straight through).

I would trust #4 buck as a defense load, but it wouldn't be my first choice unless I was extremely concerned with wall penetration.. I'd go with either #1 or #0. 00 and 000 are unnecessary, offer fewer pellets, and have more overpenetration issues.

My take on wall penetration is to first and foremost, take into consideration what's behind your target. That might mean not shooting, at least until you can get a safer angle to shoot. Second, mitigate things by not using ammunition that penetrates more than necessary--but NOT at the expense of it being ineffective (i.e., if 0 buck is enough penetration for any reasonable scenario, don't use 000). Finally, if I'm in the situation where I'm about to shoot someone, things are already way less than ideal, and I'm willing to accept a certain amount of overpenetration risk.

Does that mean I'd roll the dice on blasting someone with a 12-gauge while he stands right in front of the door to my little girl's room? No. Would I smoke someone trying to come through my front door, even though an errant bullet or pellet could be that one-in-a-million shot that injures or kills a neighbor who might be inside across the street, 50-100 yards away? Yeah, I'd take that risk, since I would be in severe, imminent danger, and there is only an exceptionally tiny chance that anything would happen to my neighbors (and a smaller likelihood still that it would be anything severe, as opposed to getting sprayed by broken glass or hit in the arm by a pellet with marginal at most energy remaining).

[Edited on September 12, 2009 at 12:10 AM. Reason : but one thing is clear: using birdshot as a defense load is retarded.]

9/12/2009 12:09:49 AM

Quote :

"many, just call and ask"

dude, come on, was that in any way helpful?

9/12/2009 1:41:33 PM

Quote :

"Also, if you have birdshot loads in your gun and you're fighting for your life, you should be aiming exclusively at the neck and face, which means you've now got a much smaller target than you had before if you wish to effectively wound them (ie - incapacitate or at least blind). "

or you just shoot them center mass. there is no situation you'll encounter in a home defense scenario where you will be shooting a shotgun from far enough away that birdshot won't incapacitate them just as well as any other shot. The pellets will still be clumped together and have the same inertia that buckshot would. The only difference is that the birdshot will be harder for a doctor to remove and will most likely cause greater tissue damage and infection.

9/12/2009 2:17:33 PM

anyone have any good dove ammo for sale?

what's the best recommended if using Remington 1100, 12 gauge, 2 3/4"?

[Edited on September 12, 2009 at 4:11 PM. Reason : ,]

9/12/2009 4:11:33 PM

i thought birdshot was used fairly often in the home because of wall penetration concerns

9/12/2009 4:34:04 PM

Quote :

""I saw a gunshot victim, about 5' 10" and 200 lbs, taken to the operating room with a shotgun wound to the chest. He was shot at a range of six feet at a distance of just over the pectoralis muscle. He was sitting on his front porch and walked to the ambulance. We explored the chest after x-rays were taken. The ER doc had said 'buckshot' wound, but this was obviously not accurate. It was # 6 shot. There was a crater in the skin over an inch in diameter. When the shot hit the level of the ribs, it spread out about five inches. There was ONE pellet that had passed between the ribs and entered the pericardium, but not damaged the heart at all. As you say, 'use birdshot for little birds.'""

from page 3 at http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot3.htm

9/12/2009 4:59:16 PM

Quote :

"or you just shoot them center mass. there is no situation you'll encounter in a home defense scenario where you will be shooting a shotgun from far enough away that birdshot won't incapacitate them just as well as any other shot."

I mean, I can't argue that birdshot should work in certain cases (And I'd say mostly due to pain or fear based compliance), but I can think of plenty in which it definitely will not. A blanket statement like "there is no situation you'll encounter in a home defense scenario where you will be shooting a shotgun from far enough away that birdshot won't incapacitate them just as well as any other shot" is simply false. There are a LOT of variables in that. If we're using #8, then I can't think of many situations where it will do too much. If we're using Also, have you fired birdshot out of the common home defense type shotguns that come with an 18.5" or 20" barrel and no choke? It does not remain a "cohesive mass" for any length of time at all. After just 5 or 10 feet it is going to be spread out enough that the pellets will behave as individual masses from everything I have personally witnessed.

I go on the thought that if I shoot it is shooting to kill. I'm not going to use ammunition that is marginal if I don't have any reason to do so. If they have a firearm, wounding and pain compliance are no longer really a great option if you value your life. You have to incapacitate them as quickly as possible in order to survive. I don't trust birdshot to do that and I don't know why anyone else would honestly (Even BBB pellets only weigh about 10gr each and are .190" in diameter......).

Of course, gelatin isn't everything, but this does demonstrate that they don't behave as a cohesive unit even when impacting a target at very close range. The pellets immediately disperse and lose energy individually from what I see. It's NOT that I'm saying birdshot is going to bounce off of you or something, I'm just saying that you'll limit the capabilities of your weapon more than I find acceptable. There are also loads designed specifically for self defense and/or "tactical use" in buckshot calibers and I tend to believe that those are going to perform better in a real life self defense situation when compared to birdshot loads that were designed for hunting small game or target/skeet shooting.

http://www.shotgunworld.com/bbs/viewtopic.php?t=109958


I will also say that I've never been that impressed with box-o-truth. It seems rather hit or miss with them. Like I recall seeing them completely misunderstand a manufacturer's (Extreme Shock IIRC) claims and as a result misinterpret the test results as a product failure when, in fact, the bullet performed exactly as the manufacturer had intended.

9/12/2009 5:10:00 PM

Hah, I cut part of what I'd written out of it in that edit son.

Anyway, back to classified ads.

9/12/2009 5:42:57 PM

Quote :

"have you fired birdshot out of the common home defense type shotguns that come with an 18.5" or 20" barrel and no choke?"

I've never owned a gun with no choke, and I've never seen ballistics done on a gun with no choke shooting birdshot. I think I'm going to make some balistic gelatin for when I go to the range in a couple of weeks to test this theory about birdshot through a gun with a choke.

Quote :

"It was # 6 shot. There was a crater in the skin over an inch in diameter. When the shot hit the level of the ribs, it spread out about five inches. There was ONE pellet that had passed between the ribs and entered the pericardium, but not damaged the heart at all."

think about how that would have played out with a shot to the gut, groin, or thigh.

[Edited on September 13, 2009 at 10:04 AM. Reason : and don't argue about how invincible they'd be if they're on PCP. PCP is overstated in the news.]

9/13/2009 9:59:27 AM

when I worked at brinks the anti-personnel shotgun setup they used was the 18" remington 870 with 00 buck

not that this is necessarily authoritative, but I'm sure they considered their options pretty extensively before deciding on 00

9/13/2009 10:07:15 AM

Well, self-defense and tactical ammunition tend to utilize low flash powder and can have other features (Like reduced recoil) that will make the round more ideal for those kinds of situations.

I've never found any birdshot loads like that first of all, so for that reason and a number of others I will only use buckshot or slug loads for home defense with my Mossberg 590. I really prefer to use ammunition that is designed for the application in which I'm using it. Unfortunately, I generally end up with pellets that I feel are a bit large (Usually that size is 00BK). I'd really like to see Federal come out with a reduced recoil tactical buckshot load that uses #1 buckshot or at least "0BK" with their flitecontrol wad.

Their tactical buckshot loads perform extremely well out of 18.5" and 20" barrels with no choke and this is what I prefer. I order their Reduced Recoil 9 pellet 00BK load whenever possible. Btw, it's worth noting that reduced recoil buckshot loads actually tend penetrate further than full power loads because the pellets usually undergo less deformation upon impact with the target. These loads wont help you if you're trying to reduce the over-penetration risk compared to a full power load. Going from plated to unplated shot will help with this significantly though.

Unplated buckshot is probably better for home defense because the pellets often deform so much that they turn into little pancakes. As a result, they dump their energy more quickly (More like a hollow point), penetrate less and hit a bit harder than plated shot from everything I've seen. I believe you will lose some accuracy with unplated shot, although it should be just fine at home defense ranges. A good, very inexpensive unplated buckshot load to use for home defense is Winchester's XB1200VP. I've found quite a bit of it floating around in Walmarts recently and the performance is impressive. It has a wider pattern than Federal's Tactical loads and more recoil than the Reduced Recoil Federal Tactical loads though obviously. I haven't fired the Winchesters at night to see how bright the flash is either unfortunately. But anyway, I'd definitely trust the XB1200VP to cause some major problems for anyone hit by it.

The only slug load I'll use for home defense really is Federal's Hydra-Shok slug (And I prefer the Reduced Recoil version of this load as well). These have incredible performance, expand like crazy and don't over-penetrate like the other slugs I've tried.

The Precision Buckshot load that Federal offers is incredible as well btw, but I don't need it for home defense. The wad stays with and holds all of the pellets together as it travels downrange, making it consistently perform more like a single cohesive mass until it hits the target (Or a hard barrier like glass or wood), then it spreads out more. It's a load that I can imagine being very useful in more of a firefight type situation and I find the engineering of the wad to be very cool, but I think other loads make more sense for a home defense shotgun.


Below are some interesting images from Federal of these different wads in action btw. Some of the photos are quite large, so I've linked them in an effort to not ruin the page.

This is a conventional, unplated buckshot load leaving the gun:

http://glarp.atk.com/2008/2008_Images/Federal_LE/pages/ConventionalBuckshot.htm


This is their tactical buckshot load using the Flitecontrol wad (Again, it works VERY well):

http://glarp.atk.com/2008/2008_Images/Federal_LE/pages/TacticalBuckshot_wFlitecontrolWad.htm


Here's their precision buckshot load, which is pretty neat I think:

http://glarp.atk.com/2008/2008_Images/Federal_LE/pages/TacticalPrecisionBuckshotWadRendering.htm

http://glarp.atk.com/2008/2008_Images/Federal_LE/pages/TacticalPrecisionBuckshotRendering.htm

http://glarp.atk.com/2009/2009_Images/LE/Federal_LE/pages/LEFP_TacticalPrecisionBuckshot_HighSpeed_1.htm

http://glarp.atk.com/2009/2009_Images/LE/Federal_LE/pages/LEFP_TacticalPrecisionBuckshot_HighSpeed_2.htm

9/13/2009 10:44:11 AM

Federals Tactical buckshot w/ FC is awesome but their slug is even better; It can be accurate up to a 100yds.

9/13/2009 6:43:43 PM

Shotgun slugs are gay. As far as I'm concerned, they are mostly useful in areas that don't allow rifle hunting.

9/14/2009 1:20:21 AM

While I tend to agree that regular old slugs are not the best thing you could use in a home defense shotgun, the Federal Hydra-Shok is absolutely insane and does not suffer from major over-penetration issues like other rounds (It penetrates less than some larger plated buckshot loads, only around 14-15" in ballistics gelatin). Check this out (Read the notes too):

http://www.brassfetcher.com/12gaugeFedTacSlug.html

I have a shotgun designed to work well with slugs (Ghost ring sights and a 20" barrel) and I trust my aim with them quite a bit, they always go where I want out to ridiculous ranges (WAY beyond self defense range). I like the fact that I don't have to worry as much about stray projectiles if the target is a bit further away too. These slugs penetrate and expand like a massive handgun JHP, it's interesting. They dump a shitload of energy into the target in a VERY short time too. I've not really seen any other shotgun round cause the explosive mayhem that these will in test media.

9/14/2009 11:22:20 AM

#6 bird shot may not be the most stellar stopper, but for someone who lives in a thin-walled apartment where overpenetration is a serious concern it certainlyis the most responsible choice. I would say a shotgun holding 5-8 rounds of that wouldn't be too bad of a thing to have in such a situation. I would be at least as comfortable as I would be with a 9mm pistol.
#2 turkey loads will perforate 1/2 inch plywood or picket board at 20 feet so don't underestimate some of these heavy bird loads.

9/14/2009 11:33:32 AM

can someone tell me what remington express buckshot is (00bk)? that was the only buckshot they had at walmart

9/14/2009 9:07:32 PM

just a pretty basic buckshot load

i'm sure some snobs will say it sucks

9/14/2009 9:35:34 PM

^^ fine for the price, but im not that picky.

9/14/2009 10:07:54 PM

Would you guys take your birdshot arguments elsewhere and just sell me some gunzz at heavily discounted prices? I keep seeing this thread at the top and getting my hopes up only to find more birdshot discussion.

[Edited on September 14, 2009 at 10:59 PM. Reason : l]

9/14/2009 10:54:03 PM

I have an MD Arms 20 round drum for sale, NIB for $285.00 If you don't see a reply on this board, please call 9197874965

[Edited on September 16, 2009 at 1:12 PM. Reason : can't get the right VooDoo to bring up the photo!]

9/16/2009 1:09:32 PM

FS: Like New Fobus holster. The holster says made for Glock 26 (G26 model), but it fits mostly all Glocks just fine. At least I know it works on the Glock 19.

9/17/2009 10:11:45 AM

Alright sons, I'll sell you two guns today and for good deals, particularly the first one! I guess I should go ahead and state now that you need to be able to legally purchase these handguns in order for me to entertain the possibility of selling them to you. So, either a CC Permit or Pistol Purchase Permit (And I.D.) would obviously be required.


First off is my S&W Model 642 with clipdraw device. I have the original frame screw as well and the clip draw device has not damaged the finish underneath it in any way, so you can remove it if desired and return to the stock configuration. The Model 642 is a 5-shot, .38 Special +P "Airweight" revolver. It's very light, somewhere around 13oz I belive. This sale would also include two HKS speedloaders and a tad bit of self defense .38 Special +P JHP ammunition (Just a little bit, like 10rds of 135gr +P Short Barrel Speer Gold Dots and maybe 20-30rds of WWB 110gr +P SJHP). This was my first revolver and brand new, right out of the box it would only fire 3 out of 5 rounds, assuming it was given 5 consecutive trigger pulls. I sent it off to S&W, who replaced a number of parts (I have receipts) under warranty and while it has functioned normally since I got it back from S&W, it feels kind of odd to me. As a result, I really think it would benefit from someone knowledgeable giving it some care. I am not knowledgeable enough in revolvers and I don't have enough interest in them to work on it, so I'd rather pass it on to someone that does. I bought it new and it has only fired somewhere on the order of 40 rounds total, I also have all receipts and the original box (It's the blue hard plastic box being used in the photos). If you'd like to have a look at this revolver, you can send me a PM.


I'm also interested in possibly selling my 6-shot Taurus .44 Magnum. Because of the porting it's a surprisingly comfortable and easy gun to use, even with light magnum loads. It would be even easier to use with .44 Special loads obviously and those loads are still going to be respectable for social work. Anyway, feel free to contact me on this one with any interest/offers as well, I bought it new and I have the receipts and the original box (Which doesn't mean much with Taurus, as it's made of freakin' cardboard). It's seriously only had around 35 rounds put through it and they were just some light magnum loads that used a 200gr bullet.


Here are photos of both revolvers and the HKS Speedloaders for the Model 642 loaded with some 135gr +P Short Barrel Speer Gold Dots. I hope it's not hard to figure out which one is which btw.




And here's a photo from the other side, which shows the clip draw device. Sorry it's covered in fingerprints.

9/21/2009 6:49:24 PM

what 'doesn't feel right' about the airweight?

9/21/2009 8:41:04 PM

^^ prices on the guns?

9/21/2009 9:04:47 PM

^ It's a feeler type sale on the S&W, so in that case you'll have to make an offer (See the last paragraph for the Taurus). I don't feel that it would be fair to put a price on that S&W at this time. What I'd really prefer is that anyone looking at buying the S&W check it out first and then make an educated offer. You can certainly make an offer before that as well if you'd like though. Again, you'd be getting the S&W642 with S&W carrying case and all original paperwork, the clip-draw device (And the original frame screw to return it to stock), two HKS speedloaders and two half-used boxes of .38 special +P self defense type ammunition.


^^ Basically, if you just want a gun that you can buy and stick in your pocket immediately, look elsewhere. I'm certainly not trying to screw anyone over with it, I think that if you're willing to give it some attention it would feel just fine. At the same time, I don't want you to pull it out when you get mugged on the way home from buying it, thinking it's ready to go, and have it not work!

I'm trying to do the right thing and mention beforehand that I believe it needs attention to be functioning at 100%. When I say it doesn't feel right, I mean that the action does not feel as good as I'd like it to. The timing of the action may be slightly off somehow, I'm not sure really. I know that it does fire each round now, but I do not like the feel of it and I would not use it for self defense unless I had no other choice (I know it will fire the rounds in the cylinder, but I still don't trust that it will fire them every single time you pull the trigger). The yoke, firing pin and sear were replaced by S&W in late May of 2009 and since then it has fired every time I pull the trigger (But this has been all of like 10 times mind you), however, the action just feels weird to me. It's also worth noting that no part in the gun has even endured 50rds of ammunition, so it's not like these were replaced due to wear. Anyway, I "feel" this "unusualness" through my trigger finger as I pull the trigger back to fire the weapon, since it's DAO and the trigger is what operates the action. I think it may need some kind of adjustment (Or work or some kind) and it obviously needs to be done by someone competent with revolvers. If you're willing to mess with it a bit and you want to get a good deal on an otherwise solid deep concealment system, then check this little guy out.

I'm the first owner and I have all of the receipts from when I bought it and sent it to S&W. Btw, they're very easy to deal with. They paid for the shipping (Overnight air, of course) and sent me a shipping label. I sent them the gun and got it back within about a week, I was very impressed with their overall customer service. I can't be sure, but I see no reason why they wouldn't continue to work with the next owner if warranty work is required. I have the records of the maintenance done earlier this year and I'd include that in the sale obviously. Since I'm pretty much done with revolvers for now due to personal preference, I'm ready to hand them off. It's not that I've tried over and over to fix it or anything. I just simply don't plan on using it even if I did fix it and I have other guns that I use instead. I see no reason why it can't be fixed for little to no cost. If you don't mind the effort and want to save money, I guess you could probably send it to S&W as many times as you needed until they either fixed any problems you found or gave you another.


The Taurus is a gun I bought for fun really. It's not something I have to sell, but again, I'm just not really into revolvers that much and if someone else wants it I'd love to see it go to someone that would put it to good use since it's barely even been used. For this guy I was thinking like $400. This version is actually somewhat hard to find from what I've seen in the past. It may be available right now though, I haven't looked. What was mostly available when I was looking at it were the 5-shot Tracker models. This one is a 6-shot and, personally, I think this revolver looks better than the Tracker as well. This revolver has an integrated compensator at the end of the barrel (The barrel itself is not ported) that greatly improves the ease and comfort of operation. This is not a painful or frightening gun to shoot at all IMO. It also comes equipped with adjustable sights and they're very easy to work with (Just need a screw driver). In this case you'd be getting the Taurus 44 Magnum, the low quality box it came in and all the original paperwork.

9/22/2009 1:24:01 PM

How long is the barrel on the .44 mag?

9/22/2009 3:33:37 PM

The outer dimensions measure ~4" in overall length and this model is sold as a 4" revolver from what I can tell. A more accurate description would be that it has around 3" to 3.5" of barrel plus around .5" to 1" of compensator (The barrel actually ends before the muzzle, with the compensator being what's between the "end of the barrel" and the muzzle). I don't feel like measuring it at this moment, but they add up to right around 4".

9/22/2009 6:07:05 PM

shame about the airweight- I'm looking at getting a small revolver (I have contacted Brandon1 about his, but he has yet to contact me back about it)

I would consider yours, but I don't feel like paying S&W prices for something that might need some working in the near future (cause I'm looking for whatever I get to be my 75% of the time carry piece)

9/24/2009 5:19:43 PM

Oh sorry, the pistol has sold.

9/24/2009 6:32:13 PM