and of course that statement isnt applicable to the former soviet union at all.

9/10/2013 12:23:35 PM

My fellow Americans, I'm pleased to tell you today that I've signed legislation that will outlaw Russia forever. We begin bombing in five minutes.

9/10/2013 12:34:16 PM

so, post ww2 russia/soviet union > US ?

amirite

lets hear exactly why

please, no drum circles

9/10/2013 12:42:25 PM

in regards to US-Soviet/Russian relations post WW2, USSR/Russia took the bigger steps to reach peace. It wasn't until the very end of Reagan's presidency that he stopped saber rattling and we saw progress; in contrast Gorbachev brought his country a long way despite national fear that the US was going to attack them at any moment.

9/10/2013 12:48:41 PM

Lol, because Gorbachev represents such a long chapter in the post WW2 Soviet story.

Please tell us more.

9/10/2013 1:34:06 PM

my comment:

Quote :

"^^ you need to learn your cold war history, the US was the bad guy"

9/10/2013 1:37:30 PM

I would be okay with changing that statement to "a bad guy."

Not "the."

Soviet Union "a worse guy."

Fixed. Agree?

[Edited on September 10, 2013 at 1:43 PM. Reason : -]

9/10/2013 1:43:15 PM

that's the opposite of my point, we were the worse guy in regards to the cold war

9/10/2013 2:07:05 PM

Lol, okay.

9/10/2013 2:17:30 PM

Quote :

""Iran needs an option to give up its nuclear program with sanctions lifted." Weren't they already given that option? Why should they give up their program?"

Perhaps to get the sanctions lifted?

9/10/2013 2:33:54 PM

Or we could just lift the sanctions, since they are based on no actual evidence of a nuclear weapons program, and hurt civilians more than politicians.

[Edited on September 10, 2013 at 2:39 PM. Reason : .]

9/10/2013 2:39:13 PM

Somehow Putin ends up looking like the good guy here. Not bad.

9/10/2013 3:36:23 PM

Russia has always been the good guy. Didnt you know?

9/10/2013 4:04:25 PM

Quote :

"Or we could just lift the sanctions, since they are based on no actual evidence of a nuclear weapons program, and hurt civilians more than politicians."

We don't have evidence of them building the bombs themselves, but I thought we had pretty good intel that they are definitely working on large scale production of HEU. If they're willing to limit it all to LEU they'd let international inspectors in tomorrow.

9/10/2013 4:07:23 PM

The Iranian argument is that the they have the right to use nuclear energy and have nuclear weapons. When you get nukes, you get a seat at the big boys table. Until then, you run the risk of getting shit on by world super powers.

Yes, the U.S. and Israel don't want Iran to have nukes because that means they'd have to show them some respect.

9/10/2013 4:16:12 PM

If that were the case, Iran would co-operate 110% with the IAEA and embarrass the living hell of the US.

But instead of doing that, they're bunkering enrichment plants. That doesn't make any sense. They're working to gain weapons capability. I don't think they'll make a weapon, or at least not right away, but they want the capability.

9/10/2013 4:25:50 PM

Quote :

"We don't have evidence of them building the bombs themselves, but I thought we had pretty good intel that they are definitely working on large scale production of HEU. If they're willing to limit it all to LEU they'd let international inspectors in tomorrow."

There are uses for HEU other than nuclear weapons.

http://www.nti.org/analysis/articles/civilian-uses-heu/

But either way, I agree with this:

Quote :

"the U.S. and Israel don't want Iran to have nukes nuclear capability because that means they'd have to show them some respect."

9/10/2013 5:07:54 PM

aaaand this is why our government won't let us use HEU for research reactors anymore.

Some of the old ones still operate, but not many. All conceptual stuff basically self-limits to 20%, because people know just how impossible HEU is politically.

9/10/2013 5:39:25 PM

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-24045680

Syria conflict: Both sides 'committing war crimes'

Quote :

"Massacres are "perpetrated with impunity" in Syria, the report says The latest report on Syria for the United Nations Human Rights Council says all sides are committing war crimes and crimes against humanity. "Government forces have committed gross violations of human rights and the war crimes of torture, hostage-taking, murder, execution without due process, rape, attacking protected objects and pillage," the report says. Hospitals have also been bombed, crops burnt, and water denied to desperate communities. "Anti-government armed groups have committed war crimes, including murder, execution without due process, torture, hostage-taking and attacking protected objects. They have besieged and indiscriminately shelled civilian neighbourhoods," the report adds. In one incident in June, a 15-year-old boy was executed by jihadist rebels, who accused him of blasphemy, in the northern city of Aleppo. Rebel and Kurdish militia fighters have also been using child soldiers. The report says that since the uprising against President Bashar al-Assad began in March 2011 there had been a total of at least eight massacres perpetrated by government forces and supporters, and one by rebel fighters. Nine further mass killings are being investigated."

Quote :

"And, in a message to US and Russian diplomats preparing to meet in Geneva, the investigators insist: "There is no military solution to this conflict. Those who supply arms create but an illusion of victory.""

[Edited on September 11, 2013 at 7:54 AM. Reason : ]

9/11/2013 7:43:31 AM

9/11/2013 10:28:10 AM

Why facepalm? More like I'm-ok-with-this.jpg

9/11/2013 11:38:28 AM

I'll wait to see how this all unfolds, but it looks like old Barry is going to jimmy carter himself to another Nobel Peace Prize. Hell, those ass-licking chocolate loving Swiss might as well preemptively give him a third one for the hat trick.

Real talk though, if this guy dodges war among what has to be a great amount of influence from specially interest lobbyist, he will forever have an endearing legacy.

9/11/2013 1:03:46 PM

Swiss?

9/11/2013 1:19:53 PM

^^Lol, just wow.

If that's what you take away from all this I feel genuinely sorry for you and all those equally as naive.

I also hope your PhD is in kindergarten etiquette or something where you can cause no real damage. If the dilution of education/advanced degrees was ever made more apparent by a single post that was it.

Stay in Germany, scumbag.

[Edited on September 11, 2013 at 1:23 PM. Reason : -]

9/11/2013 1:23:15 PM

Swiss?

9/11/2013 1:24:46 PM

Pay him no mind.

Just another professional student/fucking idiot.

9/11/2013 1:32:52 PM

^so you don't think this was all part of Obama's master plan?

[Edited on September 11, 2013 at 1:33 PM. Reason : ]

9/11/2013 1:33:24 PM

No.

9/11/2013 1:49:16 PM

^^
Do you? To me it seems like they're itching to drop some bombs, but now they'd look stupid for bypassing a potential diplomatic solution.

And of course "there would be no diplomatic solution without the threat of attack". Gotta co-opt the credit.

[Edited on September 11, 2013 at 1:51 PM. Reason : .]

9/11/2013 1:51:12 PM

As with most things, I don't know. I mean, it would make sense that we would make threats in hopes that it would encourage a diplomatic solution. Or maybe we really wanted to bomb them.

9/11/2013 1:52:38 PM

The "master plan" talk had been circulating online for the entire crisis until Russian intervention.

The crickets since then should be very telling.

9/11/2013 1:54:47 PM

The Polish Foreign Minister is taking credit now for this peace plan

(i don't think this plan has a chance in hell of working, but who knows)

[Edited on September 11, 2013 at 1:58 PM. Reason : or foreign minister (lowercase)? I'm not sure if foreign minister gets capitalized as a title. ]

9/11/2013 1:57:47 PM

Quote :

"The crickets since then should be very telling."

The mind control crickets from the Illuminati that have been infecting Obama's brain?

9/11/2013 2:44:35 PM

Is any intelligence that proves Assad used Sarin instead of the rebels publicly available? Obama seems confident, I'd like to know what he's basing it on?

9/11/2013 3:54:13 PM

^http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2013/08/30/government-assessment-syrian-government-s-use-chemical-weapons-august-21

9/11/2013 4:11:31 PM

I do wonder what communications, if any, our administration had with Assad before announcing the intent to bomb.

Kerry threw out the "give up his weapons" thing off the cuff, that either had to have come up before, or he just spontaneously stumbled on one of the more obvious diplomatic pathways.

9/11/2013 4:24:33 PM

Quote :

"Real talk though, if this guy dodges war among what has to be a great amount of influence from specially interest lobbyist, he will forever have an endearing legacy."

Tell that to Muammar

9/11/2013 5:20:40 PM

Aha, here is Obama's concern about Syria

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ZCz0Yu0vlzM

And did you guys see the Assad interview from a couple of days ago?

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=H_hhpGSZi84

9/11/2013 6:53:41 PM

[new]?

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/12/opinion/putin-plea-for-caution-from-russia-on-syria.html?src=twr&_r=2&

Quote :

"No one doubts that poison gas was used in Syria. But there is every reason to believe it was used not by the Syrian Army, but by opposition forces, to provoke intervention by their powerful foreign patrons, who would be siding with the fundamentalists. Reports that militants are preparing another attack — this time against Israel — cannot be ignored. "

- Vladimir V. Putin

9/11/2013 8:58:06 PM

^that's a perfect example of why citizens should never take "official sources" at their word. It's incredibly easy for American's to look at that quote, and say, "bahh, it's Putin, he's Russian, so he's obviously lying." But those same people often reflexively accept the word of officials if they're from the US government.

Obviously, one government is lying to their country. The source of the gas couldn't simultaneously be from the Assad regime and from the rebel forces at the same time. And when the consequences of those lies can lead to a fucking war, it's important that citizens practice some responsibility and demand proof from their leaders. John Kerry's continued statement of "the evidence speaks for itself" should never fucking fly.

9/11/2013 9:44:17 PM

^^^^^ yeah I have a fairly hard time believing that was legitimately tripping and falling into that plan.

What I don't quite get is why they would have arrived at that solution, then try to play it off like an accidental 11th-hour pure dumb luck solution.

9/11/2013 10:04:36 PM

Well, here's the real problem with our state dept's case:
even the people who have seen the classified information don't buy it.

http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2013/09/classified-intelligence-doesnt-prove-anything.html

I don't really doubt that Putin would gladly lie through his teeth. But...
his statements didn't declare that he had secret information.
That editorial just argues that the public information should lead us to believe that.
Maybe it does, maybe it doesn't, either way it doesn't allow for dishonesty on his part.
More accurately, it's just a rhetorical stretch.

Obama, on the other hand, has secret information and assures us it's convincing.
Considering recent history, the fact that they think they can get away with that argument...
is embarrassing.

9/11/2013 10:09:50 PM

What I like is the little jab that Putin puts into his remarks....like, "y'all motherfuckas about to help out Al-Qeda....Oh, and they're gonna gas your besties in Tel-Aviv."

9/11/2013 10:22:32 PM

lol Swiss.

Just saying that there is ample precedent to argue that any of Obama's predecessors would have already done the Syria strikes. And I am happy with what he plans to do and how he is doing it.

What was with yowilly's outburst? It seems a little too sensitive for internet talk.

9/12/2013 3:16:39 AM

You realize the Nobel Prize originates from Norway...right?

9/12/2013 9:06:40 AM

yeah, as noted in my previous statement.

9/12/2013 9:22:19 AM

does anyone think this plan to have the international community take over the chemical weapons has any chance at working?

9/12/2013 9:30:57 AM

Define working. At this point I'm not even sure Assad perpetrated the attack himself so at least giving them up will absolve him of the blame if it happens that the FSA did it and/or does it again.

9/12/2013 10:04:34 AM

in terms of avoiding military action. Yes.

9/12/2013 10:09:30 AM

It would require knowing how many weapons there are and knowing where they are located to be able to confirm that they are all secured, and I don't think that is realistic. I think weapons inspectors will gather the weapons that Syria admits too (after prolonged bullshitting) and then the international community will disagree if all of the weapons are secured, particularly at the urging of the US and Israel that not all weapons are secure. This will lead to military action that will be much larger than limited strikes and will involve boots on the ground.

(and if the reports that Assad did not order the attacks are true, then I don't know if Syria would even be able to admit to the weapons)

[Edited on September 12, 2013 at 10:13 AM. Reason : .]

9/12/2013 10:12:12 AM