So does Tyrion's ability to touch the dragons indicate that he has Targaryean (sp?) blood in him or am I reading too much into the scene? This was the first time we got close to one, right? So they werent familiar with him?

5/2/2016 3:02:49 PM

^I didn't think of that but it is possible. I was just thinking that they were smart enough to tell that he was there to help them.

5/2/2016 3:17:42 PM

I was considering that earlier today. Like what if Tyrion's mom had an affair (or was raped) by a Targaryen? That'd take care of all 3 dragons in one way or another.

5/2/2016 3:21:47 PM

Something happened between the mad kind and Tywins wife. Definite possibility

5/2/2016 3:28:07 PM

Based solely on reading theories online I'm under the impression being impervious to their fire (or any fire?) is what makes the Targarilkas special...not simply touching or talking to a dragon

5/2/2016 4:52:41 PM

Well they definitely aren't impervious to molten gold

5/2/2016 5:47:18 PM

he led up to the dragon scene by talking about how dragons are smart and know friend from foe, bringing up that they were never hostile to whats-her-face(dany's sidekick lady)

anything is possible but I just took it that the dragons were able to sense who was ok

5/2/2016 7:22:17 PM

He's definitely targaryeon though

5/2/2016 9:55:52 PM

Tyrion being a Targaryen is a leading fan theory.



along with



[Edited on May 2, 2016 at 10:14 PM. Reason : .]

5/2/2016 10:07:48 PM

So, I just rewatched the episode tonight and in the next episode preview thing I just realized we get a tower of Joy scene. Ser Arthur Dayne squaring off against young Ned, Howland Reed, and crew. Probably a decent shot we get a big reveal.

5/3/2016 6:58:59 AM

Trion enters dungeon, dragon opens mouth starts to generate fire, stops suddenly and his nostrils flare. He was smelling tyrion. You could argue he smells or senses his lineage.

5/3/2016 7:37:55 AM

^^next episode AND book talk in the same post, nice

5/3/2016 7:51:18 AM

^^^
^

Im hoping the tower scene reveals R+L=J to Bran and as he is discussing it with the Bloodraven we seen John revealing himself alive to the wildlings.

The only problem is, I'm not sure I've seen a scene in game of thrones where there is exposition or dialogue from one area of the world superimposed over another.

I would be satisfied with sequential revelations.

5/3/2016 9:23:21 AM

Quote :

"he led up to the dragon scene by talking about how dragons are smart and know friend from foe, bringing up that they were never hostile to whats-her-face(dany's sidekick lady)"

This makes sense because what's her face took care of the dragons, fed them, etc. So the dragons would know her as a friend. But it doesnt make sense for Tyrion because he had never even seen them. Unless you are suggesting dragons can detect his emotions/aura.

Quote :

"Trion enters dungeon, dragon opens mouth starts to generate fire, stops suddenly and his nostrils flare. He was smelling tyrion. You could argue he smells or senses his lineage."

This is what I noticed too. The dragon seemed to smell him and then calm down. Maybe I am reading too much into the scene though.

[Edited on May 3, 2016 at 10:20 AM. Reason : a]

5/3/2016 10:05:32 AM

From episdoe 1, we learn that Melisandre is much older than she seems. I wonder if she has played any important roles in any of the wars of the past?

5/3/2016 10:19:19 AM

The argument the show is making is that dragons are intelligent enough (possibly more intelligent than men even) to know when someone is helping them, and Tyrion goes down there based on this hope.

If the only reason they didn't kill Tyrion is because they know of his lineage, why would he have gone down there? We have no reason to think Tyrion knows this and it would be suicide.

Lastly, I assure you that if the Game of Thrones writers were to be revealing such a major plot point as Tyrion being half Targaryan it would be more obvious than this, especially not with the very clear explanation 5 seconds before that the dragons are smart and would know he was helping them (regardless of his lineage).

5/3/2016 12:46:11 PM

Quote :

"Unless you are suggesting dragons can detect his emotions/aura. "

That wouldn't be entirely ridiculous. Dogs can sense when a person is angry or sad.

5/3/2016 1:01:16 PM

^^
^

Makes sense. Figured I was reading too much into it.

5/3/2016 2:42:17 PM

Only part of that episode I didn't get was who the 2 people were that the guy brought Ramsay.

I think I remember seeing the girl somewhere... and who is rincon stark?

5/8/2016 9:59:24 PM

Rickon is the youngest Stark kid - Rob, Sansa, Arya and Brans brother.

They mentioned his name in the scene before it with Arya.

The girl was the wildling that was traveling with Bran, Rickon and Hodor when they left Winterfell a couple seasons ago

5/8/2016 10:13:20 PM

Back when Theon took Winterfell, Osha was the wildling girl that helped everyone escape. They split up when Bran/Hodor/the Reeds went to look for the three eyed crow.

Rickon looks so different!


RIP Shaggydog. Only Ghost, Nymeria, and Summer left .

5/9/2016 9:35:52 AM

It really irks me that things keep falling into place for Ramsay. I dislike that character almost as much as Joffrey.

5/9/2016 9:50:33 AM

^I guess that the issue is that with Joffrey dead, the screenwriters want a main villain for everyone to hate. There are a handful of villains, but most watchers of the show don't hate them. King of the White Walkers, the Sons of the Harpies, Cersei, Ellaria, etc. are all villains of varying degrees but they are not psychopaths. All of the villainous stuff they have done has had some kind of motivation. Ramsay is just completely chaotic.

In another world I wonder how Joffrey and Ramsay would have interacted.

[Edited on May 9, 2016 at 10:46 AM. Reason : ]

5/9/2016 10:46:31 AM

^^^

Nymeria is Arya's wolf (or Sansa...which one did Joffrey have killed?)...and Summer is Bran's? I forget.

5/9/2016 11:06:17 AM

the last wolves alive are Jon's, Arya's, and Bran's wolves

5/9/2016 11:39:23 AM

That was a great sword fight

5/10/2016 12:16:26 AM

^ yes!

5/10/2016 8:27:58 AM

I'm confused as to why the show producers (mentioned in the post-episode discussion) and some fans think that the flashback to the fight at the tower harmed Ned's honor/reputation/whatever. I mean, they've always mentioned that it was 6 v 3. Why would the fact that Dayne was stabbed in the back mean anything? If there were only two survivors, it makes sense that the final two probably killed Dayne together. Just don't see why it makes Ned look bad. Everyone knew Dayne was the better fighter.

[Edited on May 10, 2016 at 3:37 PM. Reason : .]

5/10/2016 3:36:41 PM

Agreed. It makes no difference that a young Ned could be beaten.

But what is DOES do is start to weave into the narrative that history is told by people and people make things up for whatever reasons. In the books everything you are told is subject to distortion because its people recounting history. Everything is through a lens.

SO it starts prepping the audience for important details about the past that conflict with what the audience thought they knew. With the rules in place that history isn't exactly known, the show can reconstruct history and blow peoples minds and add that pep, that sauce, that POW that makes this entire series so interesting.

Remember, if you only know the show, you only know a fraction of the interesting things that are going on. Time to lead them to the deep end.

5/10/2016 4:02:05 PM

Ned in the books and the show is depicted as a good fighter but no great prodigy like Dayne, Selmy, Jamie or Loras (actually in the books iirc Loras was a prodigy lancer and his brother was the prodigy swordsman but they rolled them into one person in the show)

That fight between Jamie and Ned in Season 1 was much closer than it should have been.

They handled it well in season 3 when Robb admitted to Jamie he would lose to him in a sword fight, but he defeated him in a battle.

[Edited on May 10, 2016 at 4:31 PM. Reason : ]

5/10/2016 4:29:58 PM

People watching the show don't even remember whether or not Ned or Dayne were the greater fighters. So I still don't see it as a big deal. I just feel like they're trying to make something out of nothing.

And am I in the minority in thinking that it wasn't Rickon Stark that the Umbers (or whichever family) produced to Ramsay??

Could be the rest of the north plotting against him. I haven't seen that mentioned much elsewhere.

[Edited on May 10, 2016 at 4:54 PM. Reason : .]

5/10/2016 4:48:54 PM

There needs to be houses that rally to Sansa or Snow to even the scales. Doesn't have enough with just Wildlings.

5/10/2016 5:00:40 PM

Quote :

"And am I in the minority in thinking that it wasn't Rickon Stark that the Umbers (or whichever family) produced to Ramsay??"

What do you mean? It was the same actor....

5/10/2016 5:50:27 PM

And when they sent Rickon away they sent that wildling girl with him IIRC

5/10/2016 7:17:51 PM

Quote :

"SO it starts prepping the audience for important details about the past that conflict with what the audience thought they knew. With the rules in place that history isn't exactly known, the show can reconstruct history and blow peoples minds and add that pep, that sauce, that POW that makes this entire series so interesting."

this is what i got as well. All these stories that have been told and told and told and suddenly ...booyow...

5/10/2016 7:40:33 PM

When Bran and Rickon split up back in S3, Rickon and Osha were headed to the Umbers for help, so it's highly unlikely to be a lie by the Umbers. Also, it is the same actor.

5/10/2016 7:41:04 PM

People probably knew that Ned went to go fight Dayne and other members of the Kingsguard. Ned and Reed came back. People probably just assumed Ned beat Dayne, and Ned just didn't talk about it. I doubt with his honor that he fabricated the story that we hear.

5/10/2016 9:24:32 PM

Quote :

" Doesn't have enough with just Wildlings."

I dunno man, there were a shit ton of wildlings. Plus, he's likely to rally the Manderly's, the Reeds, the Glovers and maybe get a big assist from Little Finger and the folks in the Vale as well as maybe from the Riverlands after Ramsay Bolton killed his mother in law.

We haven't really seen anything from Little Finger or or the Riverlands. I could see Edmure and Brynden Tully reclaiming the riverlands, Little Finger bringing the Vale (for his own reasons of course), and then meeting up with Jon.

I think Ramsay is about to be in a bad, bad way. His grip on the North is extremely tenuous at best. Right now he has the Karstarks and the Umbers, but I don't think that's enough.

5/10/2016 10:52:53 PM

Theory out there that umber might be using Rickon as a pawn. Someone is going to betray him but who? Would be really interesting to see maneuvering from the northern households. Make them more dynamic.

5/11/2016 7:18:07 AM

If that was Rickon's wolf than it is not a trap for Ramsey. It has been mentioned that the lives if the wolves are supposed to correlate with the Stark kid's freedom.

Lady gets killed, sansa off to kings landing
Rob's wolf dies and he dies
Rickon's wolf is killed, gets captured

5/11/2016 7:53:32 AM

The Osha thing could easily be faked (although I guess it wouldn't matter to Ramsey as he didn't know which wildling was with Rickon). I didn't know it was the same actor...so that settles that.

I guess I also mixed it up with the book where Rickon is in Skagos.

[Edited on May 11, 2016 at 8:31 AM. Reason : .]

5/11/2016 8:29:28 AM

Would the umbers be clever enough to use rickon? So they find him. Realise what they have, and hate the Boltons. They are not trusted and can use rickon to gain their trust. But to do that they have to capture him. Shaggy dog doesn't let that slide obviously, so that's how you prove it's him by killing the dire wolf. Rickon believes he is being betrayed, and it all seems legit from Ramsey's perspective. Umber have the freedom and access to maneuver.

Also, could be another dire wolfs head. I mean the Umber's are farther north and would run into them occasionally. They have had PLENTY of time to plan it out.

I mean someone is going to betray Ramsey. John/Sansa will gather smaller houses to their cause, and the Manderley's or Umber's or both will betray Ramsey. Probably, one of them will have some forces in Winterfell and help overtake the garrison so there isnt another siege.

[Edited on May 11, 2016 at 8:46 AM. Reason : cockals]

5/11/2016 8:39:40 AM

But it's a stupid move. Roose's baby was what, less than 24 hours old before Ramsay killed him. You think the Umbers are going to have time to do anything after turning him over? If Ramsay knows what is good for him, he'll be taking Rickon out the second the Umbers leave.

5/11/2016 8:47:47 AM

Wouldn't Ramsay try to use Rickon before killing him? Like to try and get Sansa to come back or something along those lines? I know he wouldn't let him live too long, but I think he'd try to squeeze some leverage out of him first.

5/11/2016 9:02:21 AM

Quote :

"after Ramsay Bolton killed his mother in law. "

Completely forgot that Fat Walda was a Frey. Since Ramsay literally fed her and her child to the dogs (although I guess nobody outside of Winterfell knows this), the Freys will be against him in the future too. Although thinking about anyone from the North or the Riverlands allying against the Freys after the Red Wedding seems... weird.

5/11/2016 9:08:58 AM

^^yeah they made it very clear to us on multiple occasions that the Bolton's "need a Stark" if they want the North. I'd imagine he'd want to force Rickon to bend the knee as de facto head of House Stark, reaping the same net effect as his marriage to Sansa.

[Edited on May 11, 2016 at 9:29 AM. Reason : .]

5/11/2016 9:28:55 AM

^^depends whether they believe the poison story. That doesn't seem to be a very well kept secret though.

5/11/2016 10:01:17 AM

i dont know if it's as much a bad secret as much as just a very thin story that no one believes

5/11/2016 10:57:02 AM

I think there's a pretty decent chance that Smalljon Umber is only in Winterfell to take out Ramsay. Rickon was sent to the Umbers because they are the most loyal and oldest Stark banner men. The Great Jon was one of Robb's top men, he got axed at the Red Wedding IIRC, so there can't be much pro Bolton sympathy there from that house. It's pretty suspect that the new Lord Umber would so suddenly and theatrically come over to a bastard Bolton while also making a big point not to bend the knee.

This whole thing has Umbers helping to lead a northern revolt and install Rickon or Sansa at Winterfell air to it . I could see his own men killing Ramsay. Remember that "mad dog" line from Roose right before he got stabbed.

[Edited on May 11, 2016 at 5:26 PM. Reason : Dffgg]

5/11/2016 5:25:46 PM

^ the Greatjon wasn't at the Red Wedding. Smalljon said his father died, and if he hadn't died on his own, he would have killed the Greatjon himself.

I'm still hoping he's lying.

5/11/2016 6:06:44 PM