Yeah, Kushner sucks but my friends that work in international relations in the government think that's nothing. I dislike this administration but I think it's more of a nothing burger then a smoking gun.

5/30/2017 8:23:49 AM

then why aren't they disclosing these meetings?

5/30/2017 8:41:11 AM

There's also a significant difference between setting up a back-channel go-between (a person that both parties trust, a burner phone, email addresses, etc) and asking the Russians if you can borrow their hyper-secure, non-disclosed phone line IMO.

The latter is clearly an attempt to stay off the intelligence communities' radar.

5/30/2017 9:12:27 AM

Sort of like deleting 30k subpoenaed emails, except not nearly as bad... especially considering the unprecedented case of the deep state and media working to undermine the current administration at every turn.

5/30/2017 10:20:10 AM

Quote :

" Here is how it works: Rather than defend President Trump’s specific actions, his conservative champions change the subject to (1) the biased “fake news” media, (2) over-the-top liberals, (3) hypocrites on the left, (4) anyone else victimizing Mr. Trump or his supporters and (5) whataboutism, as in “What about Obama?” “What about Clinton?”""

5/30/2017 10:29:34 AM

I already mentioned the politicized deepstate working with the leftist media justifies trying to bypass illegal leaks.

The fact that Clinton did far worse and you hacks covered for her is just icing on the hypocrisy cake.

5/30/2017 10:41:32 AM

lol, whataboutism.

5/30/2017 10:49:36 AM

Quote :

" Here is how it works: Rather than defend President Trump’s specific actions, his conservative champions change the subject to (1) the biased “fake news” media, (2) over-the-top liberals, (3) hypocrites on the left, (4) anyone else victimizing Mr. Trump or his supporters and (5) whataboutism, as in “What about Obama?” “What about Clinton?”""

That's BINGO if I include my free space.

5/30/2017 10:53:51 AM

Pointing out how you are all partisan hacks is what I do in TSB.

5/30/2017 10:59:19 AM

Every last one of you, you are all his enemies!

Quote :

""i'd encourage everyone to just ignore JCE2011 in this thread, it should be obvious to you that he is trolling and has no interest in a good intentioned debate or discussion"""

[Edited on May 30, 2017 at 11:03 AM. Reason : oops]

5/30/2017 11:02:45 AM

1. Spam and ignore the only person in the forum that disagrees with you
2. Claim that THEY have no desire to debate/discuss

Signs you may be posting in an echo-chamber...

"But we just want to have constructive dialogue" - leftists hacks 2017

lol

5/30/2017 12:16:54 PM

BINGO!

5/30/2017 12:24:05 PM

5/30/2017 2:08:12 PM

Quote :

"lol, whataboutism."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism

Quote :

"Whataboutism is a propaganda technique first used by the Soviet Union (and later, Russia), in its dealings with the Western world.[1] When Cold War criticisms were levelled at the Soviet Union, the response would be "What about..." followed by the naming of an event in the Western world.[2][3] It represents a case of tu quoque (appeal to hypocrisy),[4] a logical fallacy that attempts to discredit the opponent's position by asserting the opponent's failure to act consistently in accordance with that position, without directly refuting or disproving the opponent's initial argument. The term describing the technique was coined in 2008 by Edward Lucas in an article for The Economist. Lucas said that this tactic is observed in the politics of modern Russia, along with this being evidence of a resurgence of Cold War and Soviet-era mentality within Russia's leadership.[2]"

[Edited on May 30, 2017 at 2:33 PM. Reason : a]

5/30/2017 2:33:14 PM

Sort of like how this entire thread, and Russia narrative in general, is a giant "WHAT ABOUT" for the dem's election loss.

5/31/2017 11:46:42 AM

Incorrect.

5/31/2017 12:06:46 PM

^^ then you don't understand what ^^^ means

5/31/2017 12:13:44 PM

So I guess Comey is actually gonna testify that Trump did try to get him to stop the investigation into the whole Russia thing. Should be interesting...

5/31/2017 1:46:34 PM

"What about Russia!" has been 24/7 whataboutism propaganda from the left and their media machine since BEFORE Trump even won

5/31/2017 4:09:49 PM

"What about Hillary's emails?"

5/31/2017 4:58:43 PM

Subpoenas going out to the FBI, CiA and NSA today, specifically about unmasking. It's about time someone started investigating the only crimes we know actually happened at this point.

5/31/2017 7:38:07 PM

how does his messy pie taste?

5/31/2017 7:40:02 PM

What crimes happened? I'm confused?

[Edited on May 31, 2017 at 9:48 PM. Reason : Unmasking isn't a crime as far as I know]

5/31/2017 9:47:51 PM

"what about Benghazi?"

5/31/2017 11:19:25 PM

Quote :

"It's about time someone started investigating the only crimes we know actually happened at this point."

Unmasking isn't a crime. And unmasking was always going to be covered in this investigation.

6/1/2017 12:25:39 AM

Nunes actually subpoenaed about the unmasking unilaterally from what I've read.

Given Trump's tweet this AM it's looking like more water carrying from him.

That said, I have no issue with it. Almost assuredly, nothing inappropriate was done.

6/1/2017 7:14:45 AM

How can you subpoena for an investigation that you've recused yourself from?

6/1/2017 7:23:31 AM

Who is he accountable to? Paul Ryan? Lol. And technically it was a temporary, voluntary recusal. In other words until his Orange Jesus needed him again.

Anyway, I think the argument would be that he the unmasking it at most tangential to the Russia investigation.

6/1/2017 9:35:59 AM

Quote :

"How can you subpoena for an investigation that you've recused yourself from?"

He is still part of the intel committee itself, I believe, which would allow him to do that. I'm fine with them looking into whether anything inappropriate happened. But in my opinion, he's simply doing it at the direction of Trump in order to try and obtain more things to delay and distract from the real investigations. I find it highly unlikely (though not impossible) that any one of the 19 or so people who can actually request unmasking did anything illegal or immoral.

[Edited on June 1, 2017 at 11:18 AM. Reason : a]

6/1/2017 11:17:03 AM

Putin more or less admitted Russia(ns) did the hacking this morning. Of course said it wasn't the state but rather "patriotic individuals or groups" in Russia. This still won't be enough for many on the left and right to accept it but it's as close to a real admission as he will ever go.

[Edited on June 1, 2017 at 12:20 PM. Reason : X]

6/1/2017 12:20:03 PM

Unmasking for the purpose of leaking classified information to the press isn't illegal?

6/1/2017 12:33:45 PM

who did that?

6/1/2017 12:48:34 PM

^^https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2017/04/04/what-unmasking-how-intelligence-agencies-treat-us-citizens/100026368/

Quote :

"But the intelligence community's policies on minimization are not absolute, and there are several exceptions. The National Security Agency, for example, will contain the names of U.S. persons in intelligence reports when: ? The information is available publicly, meaning "information that a member of the public could obtain on request, by research in public sources, or by casual observation." ? "The identity of the United States person is necessary to understand foreign intelligence information or assess its importance, e.g., the identity of a senior official in the executive branch." ? The intelligence indicates that the U.S. person may be "an agent of a foreign power.""

Quote :

""So when that occurred, what I would do, or what any official would do, is to ask their briefer whether the intelligence community would go through its process — and there's a long-standing, established process — to decide whether that information as to who the identity of the U.S. person was could be provided to me. So they'd take that question back, they'd put it through a process, and the intelligence community made the determination as to whether or not the identity of that American individual could be provided to me.""

Quote :

"Unmasking is not a crime"

[Edited on June 1, 2017 at 1:01 PM. Reason : a]

6/1/2017 12:58:08 PM

Are the leaks classified or are they fake? Get your story straight Trumpets.

6/1/2017 1:44:29 PM

Quote :

"Are the leaks classified or are they fake? Get your story straight Trumpets."

Probably a mix of both, but the problem is that they are all 100% partisan.

I'm not a fan of a partisan deepstate and partisan media working together to undermine a democratically elected POTUS... but hey this is SPORTS right sports fans? GO TEAM HILLDAWG, FUCK THE TRUMPETS! GO TEAM!

6/1/2017 2:00:10 PM

^^^ not only is their no evidence to show that it would be an insanely high bar to clear for criminality

6/1/2017 2:00:27 PM

^ sums up this topic perfectly!

6/1/2017 7:41:03 PM

I think it's been pretty widely disseminated on here that the bar to prove collusion is pretty damn high and not at all likely to be met.

Which makes Trump's insistence on bordering on obstruction of justice even more baffling.

6/1/2017 9:52:44 PM

^far too early to tell that. these investigations take quite a long time. which is why the left needs to stop calling for impeachment right now and the right needs to stop saying the thing should be shut down because there is no evidence. gotta let these things work through the system.

as for the press, they're doing their jobs by reporting news which allows us to keep pressure up on our representatives to keep these investigations from being shut down.

6/2/2017 12:24:54 PM

Has anyone read the Intercept story that just dropped

Obviously highly doubtful it happened but even if there was a legit attempt... wow.

6/5/2017 5:24:49 PM

Quote :

"Has anyone read the Intercept story that just dropped"

I don't read fake news

6/5/2017 5:53:47 PM

^^ Thanks for mentioning it.

I've always felt that electronic voting software and hardware present greater risks than rewards.

https://theintercept.com/2017/06/05/top-secret-nsa-report-details-russian-hacking-effort-days-before-2016-election/

Quote :

"'If someone has access to a state voter database, they can take malicious action by modifying or removing information... This could affect whether someone has the ability to cast a regular ballot, or be required to cast a 'provisional' ballot — which would mean it has to be checked for their eligibility before it is included in the vote, and it may mean the voter has to jump through certain hoops such as proving their information to the election official before their eligibility is affirmed.'"

6/5/2017 6:11:15 PM

https://twitter.com/markberman/status/871841372239802368

Wait, what? This reads like the Intercept turned this person in?!? That can't be right given Greenwald's entire worldview.

6/5/2017 6:22:52 PM

Nah, I think Greenwald contacted the NSA to corroborate the information and then they did their own investigation to find the leaker, who was apparently dumb enough to print the document from her work computer.

6/5/2017 6:39:33 PM

it seems like there were some bills recently to standardize voting across the nation, things like requiring a paper trail, etc. but they never seem to go anywhere. Even after Bush/Gore, how? Seems like there are some pretty basic steps that could move us in the right direction.

If there are two things I hope become of all this it's serious discussions about vote integrity and campaign finance reform.

6/5/2017 7:33:57 PM

I don't agree with him always but I do respect Greenwald for being ideologically and journalistically consistent... but I have to admit the irony of Assange going after him right now is kind of making me chuckle.

6/6/2017 8:21:40 AM

Quote :

"Leftists Pre-Election: The election can't be rigged!"

Quote :

"Leftists Post-Election: Russa rigged the election, by exposing how the left rigged the election."

6/6/2017 12:56:46 PM

Quote :

"I don't read fake news"

Guess there's no reason to charge the contractor who leaked it, then. Since it's fake, no classified info to prosecute over.

Quote :

"This reads like the Intercept turned this person in?"

Most likely inadvertent. See: http://blog.erratasec.com/2017/06/how-intercept-outed-reality-winner.html?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=New%20Campaign&utm_term=%2ASituation%20Report#.WTbrR2jyuHt

Quote :

"Nah, I think Greenwald contacted the NSA to corroborate the information and then they did their own investigation to find the leaker, who was apparently dumb enough to print the document from her work computer."

Yep

6/6/2017 1:50:31 PM

i'll be so happy when i don't have to hear the word "meddling" on NPR anymore

Quote :

"Wait, what? This reads like the Intercept turned this person in?!? That can't be right given Greenwald's entire worldview."

There are lots of writers at the Intercept. I've read plenty of stories Greenwald definitely wouldn't have writen.

[Edited on June 7, 2017 at 11:51 AM. Reason : .]

6/7/2017 11:50:07 AM

My bad. I swear I saw his name on the byline but I was wrong.

Changing pace, here is Comey's opening statement tmw for anyone who likes that kind of stuff:
https://www.intelligence.senate.gov/sites/default/files/documents/os-jcomey-060817.pdf

Read that the Trump teams plan is to really go after him and his character. I just don't see how assailing a career guy of impeccable character is going to work.

** two big takeaways. 1) Trump personally, at that time, was not subject to the Russia collusion investigation; 2) he's a creep that is dangerously close to obstruction of justice.

[Edited on June 7, 2017 at 2:00 PM. Reason : X]

6/7/2017 1:50:47 PM