When you break an egg, you're breaking an unfertilized, no life, egg.

The fucking child's starts beating after 6 weeks. Don't tell me it's not alive. If that's what you tell yourself to make yourself feel better, then use that excuse. But it's a really shitty one.

8/4/2005 12:26:26 PM

Quote :

"So women who give birth to crack addicted babies and babies with fetal-alcohol syndrome should be let off scott free and receive no punishment for harming another human being? "

So basically you want government regulation of what pregnant women put into their bodies?

I mean, this is all a moot point if you don't think abortion should be outlawed.

8/4/2005 12:31:08 PM

A side observation and a side question

Observation: Saddam Hussien was an abortion survivor. Kind of makes you think about not providing effective abortions.

Question: For those who believe that life begins at conception what do you make of the fact that new cloning techniques allow us to generate a second indivdual without conception. For example Snuppy the dog was created sans-conception. Is he alive?

8/4/2005 12:31:29 PM

Quote :

"So basically you want government regulation of what pregnant women put into their bodies?"

We already do. It is a crime to do crack... it's still a crime to do crack while pregnant.

You make it seem like people should be allowed to do whatever the fuck they want when they're pregnant.

Do drugs? No. While you're pregnant? Sure, go for it.

8/4/2005 12:35:54 PM

My bad I didn't mean to come off like that. I thought it was understood that drugs would be illegal anyways. But the alcohol point you make is still valid.

8/4/2005 12:37:31 PM

Quote :

"When you break an egg, you're breaking an unfertilized, no life, egg."

I was talking about chicken eggs, wihich are fertilized.

Quote :

"The fucking child's starts beating after 6 weeks. Don't tell me it's not alive."

I never said it wasn't alive. My kidney is alive. I just don't think that the child is any different from a period or semen until it leaves the body.

Quote :

"You make it seem like people should be allowed to do whatever the fuck they want when they're pregnant. Do drugs? No. While you're pregnant? Sure, go for it."

Don't be silly

[Edited on August 4, 2005 at 12:38 PM. Reason : ]

8/4/2005 12:37:40 PM

Quote :

"Saddam Hussien was an abortion survivor. Kind of makes you think about not providing effective abortions."

what
the
fuck?

8/4/2005 12:55:28 PM

Quote :

"Observation: Saddam Hussien was an abortion survivor. Kind of makes you think about not providing effective abortions."

8/4/2005 2:06:34 PM

ABORTIONS FOR ALL.

8/4/2005 2:35:02 PM

Either way, the entire topic of abortion is gayer than C3PO.

8/4/2005 2:50:18 PM

what the fuck is this sadaam hussein shit?
i've never studied dude's life or anything
but what???

8/4/2005 3:35:01 PM

It was evidently a lame attempt to justify abortion by saying, "you see, if we had the practice down, then saddam would've never gained power."

That's a horrible debate tactic under any standard.

8/4/2005 3:37:07 PM

Quote :

"Either way, the entire topic of abortion is gayer than C3PO."

Actually, wouldn't 100% homosexuality be a good solution to the abortion problem?

8/4/2005 3:40:38 PM

100% homsexuality and droids

8/4/2005 3:44:40 PM

well droids are always good

8/4/2005 3:46:03 PM

If droids performed abortions we could execute them for murder. Problem solved.

8/4/2005 3:47:30 PM

heh
like that trick the pro-lifeys use
where its like

woman a is in an abusive relationship has no money and will likely die in childbirth leaving her child in the care of her abuser

woman b already has 9 kids and has no way to provide support for a tenth, and lives in a rebellious state that may fall to government strife in the childs lifetime

and

woman c is an unwed mother who is socially ostracized by this pregnancy, and the baby is not the son of the man she is engaged to

would you suggest abortion to any of these women

and then their like
YOU JUST KILLED BETHOVEN, BEN FRANKLIN, AND JESUS!!!
AREN'T YOU GLAD YOU DIDN'T LIVE IN THE 1600S, THE 1700S, AND THE 0'S

8/4/2005 3:47:50 PM

abortion is never going to be outlawed. its a money-making business and people will fight hard to keep it legal.

8/4/2005 5:18:36 PM

^o christ.


maybe you pro-lifers should remember that hitler's mom seriously considered abortion

[Edited on August 4, 2005 at 5:23 PM. Reason : 0]

8/4/2005 5:23:11 PM

haha, see now hitler is one bastard that needed to be aborted.

8/4/2005 5:25:41 PM

and if hitler was aborted, that one action would save more lives than all the abortions that have ever been performed.

8/4/2005 5:27:23 PM

^ Are you really trying to prove a point with that?

The question really shouldn't be should Hitler have been aborted. You're using a cause/effect relationship here and ignoring everything else

Because Hitler was not aborted, we got the holocaust.

The more important question here is why Hitler did what he did and what we can do to stop acts such as these. There is no way that we can see into the future and abort every bad person. We can make proactive steps to preventing horrible acts.

And if you can say Hitler should have been aborted, abortion is good, I can say Albert Einstein wasn't aborted and he's a good man, so abortion is bad.

We can see how utterly ridiculous such a claim would be.

8/4/2005 5:31:47 PM

^^ And no, over 40 million abortions have been performed LEGALLY IN THE US since Roe v. Wade (stat by Alan Guttmacher Institute and the CDC).

[Edited on August 4, 2005 at 5:38 PM. Reason : source]

8/4/2005 5:32:12 PM

^^youve made my point. its not all good or all bad.

it depends on the case. and in a lot of cases, nobody wants a kid, so its a good thing.

8/4/2005 5:43:02 PM

^ there are ways of keeping yourself from having a kid other than abortion. Its called don't have sex if you aint ready

8/4/2005 6:01:25 PM

How's a man going to argue for or against abortion?

8/4/2005 6:03:16 PM

If a man believes that life starts prior to a baby exiting the woman's body, and values that life, then he is morally obligated to argue against abortion.

8/4/2005 6:06:27 PM

How so?

8/4/2005 6:09:16 PM

Quote :

"there are ways of keeping yourself from having a kid other than abortion. Its called don't have sex if you aint ready"

Unfortunately we live in the real world, not the christian dreamland. People make mistakes.

8/4/2005 6:10:14 PM

I can't stand the "man can't argue abortion" card. Whether we like it or not, the baby inside the woman has human DNA and is of the HUMAN species. I am a man, and also a human. I believe this to be a human rights issue, not a women's rights issue. To narrowly paint this as a women's rights issue removes the humanity from the baby.

Statistically, 50% of babies that are aborted are men. Therefore, I feel that I have more than a right to argue abortion.

8/4/2005 6:16:24 PM

Quote :

"Unfortunately we live in the real world, not the christian dreamland. People make mistakes."

Absolutely people make mistakes. But since when should this mistake, which invariably effects another human life, should go without consequence?

Every mistake has consequences. You should be prepared to live with those consequences if you're willing to do the deed.

8/4/2005 6:17:49 PM

Damn, and I thought this would be the thread where people finally argued intelligently about abortion.

MAYBE THE NEXT ONE WILL BE IT!!!!!11

8/4/2005 6:28:33 PM

Look --

regardless of how you actually feel on the abortion issue, at least understand the position of pro-lifers. This ISN'T a case where religious fanatics are trying to "legislate their morality" on everybody else. Pro-lifers believe that abortion is murder.

The only logically, morally consistent solution to thinking a legal activity is, in essence, murder, is to try and make it illegal. I don't understand why that's so hard to understand.

8/4/2005 6:35:35 PM

Kudos to McDanger for trying, though [e-pat on back]

8/4/2005 6:51:00 PM

Quote :

"the baby inside the woman has human DNA and is of the HUMAN species."

My gallbladder has human DNA, does that mean when they take it out they have to keep it on life support?

Quote :

"But since when should this mistake, which invariably effects another human life, should go without consequence?"

How does it effect another human life? I don't see any other humans involved but her and her doctor.

Quote :

"Pro-lifers believe that abortion is murder."

They say this, but I don't think they think it is as cold-blooded as they say it is. I'd say they veiw it as murder in the same way that some liberals think that the death penalty is murder. If they thought it was cold blooded murder they'd be MUCH more militant.

8/4/2005 6:51:36 PM

although i don't agree with either, how could you compare the death penalty to people who supposedly deserve to die to abortion where you are killing innocent babies?

8/4/2005 9:16:19 PM

Oh shut the fuck up. I'm so tired of sensationalism.

The whole abortion debate is just fucking stupid.

8/4/2005 9:27:58 PM

Well?

Death Penalty = killing convicted murderes

Abortion = killing someone who is guilty of nothing and is probably the definition of pure innocense.

8/4/2005 9:30:40 PM

This whole debate is a fucking circle.

Abortion is murder because it kills a person.

A fetus isn't a person.

Well I don't agree and I'm going to change laws.

Blah blah fucking blah.


[Edited on August 4, 2005 at 9:49 PM. Reason : sigh]

8/4/2005 9:33:07 PM

Quote :

"Abortion = killing someone who is guilty of nothing and is probably the definition of pure innocense."

yea right. if its a black baby its probably gonna kill someone or at least go to jail.

8/4/2005 9:39:26 PM

^ /thread

8/4/2005 9:39:58 PM

Quote :

"although i don't agree with either, how could you compare the death penalty to people who supposedly deserve to die to abortion where you are killing innocent babies?"

That wasn't what I was doing, my point was that pro-life people don't think abortion isn't as bad as murder, just like anti-death penalty people. If you actually TRUELY believe that abortion is the mass-murder of innocent babies than you are a monster for allowing it to happen. What kind of person lets millions of babies be killed? You should be out there blowing up abortion clinics if you really believed abortion was tantamount to murder.

[Edited on August 4, 2005 at 10:07 PM. Reason : ]

8/4/2005 10:07:29 PM

Quote :

"There are only two instances in which I support abortion. If the baby is ugly or if the baby is mine."

ahah

8/4/2005 10:12:14 PM

Abortion is wrong, but when you consider the type of people who have the procedure, it makes more sense. Think of all the brain-dead liberals we've prevented by killing them early on.

http://www.opinionjournal.com/extra/?id=110005277

8/4/2005 11:26:17 PM

^how stupid

they'll still have kids, they'll just have them when they're ready

8/4/2005 11:51:11 PM

I would just like to say to those of you who equate being pro-life with being a religious nut...

I am a pro-life athiest.

Not that anyone cares, but I get so fucking tired of people saying shit like "Otherwise the issue is dominated by hardcore right wing religious nutcases who won't rest until we form a theocracy."

*sigh*

8/4/2005 11:58:18 PM

well you're just stupid then

8/5/2005 12:08:39 AM

^^ Exactly. It's not a religious issue. It's not a women's issue. It's an issue of humanity.

It is not the child that is subhuman, as many would like to label it. Rather, those who are so ready to strip the child of humanity are the ones who are subhuman.

Removing the humanity of the child makes it easier for those who are pro abortion to feel good about their position.

Hitler did the same thing.

[Edited on August 5, 2005 at 12:12 AM. Reason : ^]

8/5/2005 12:10:23 AM

Quote :

"maybe you pro-lifers should remember that hitler's mom seriously considered abortion"

!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!Godwin's Law!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!

[Edited on August 5, 2005 at 12:18 AM. Reason : c]

8/5/2005 12:14:43 AM

Quote :

"Removing the humanity of the child makes it easier for those who are pro abortion to feel good about their position."

Let's keep in mind that doctors always refered to it as a fetus long before this "unborn child" nonsense. Secondly your arguement could be used to give humanity to all sorts of inhuman things. Like sperm or eggs or hearts or ears or or all sorts of human body parts.

8/5/2005 1:18:54 AM