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 Message Boards » » Perpetual US Men's National Soccer Team Thread Page 1 ... 4 5 6 7 [8] 9 10 11 12 ... 138, Prev Next  
bclarke35
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^^^ Iraq not making it is a suprise, they won the Asian cup I believe last year. But from what I hear they may have some political unrest there.

6/4/2008 12:24:59 PM

Thecycle23
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Not sure where to put this question, so I'll put it here.

Why don't the US soccer leagues have the promotion/relegation system thing going on? Do you think that would help our leagues?

I'm just now starting to look into soccer, and the whole idea that if your team does poorly the WHOLE TEAM gets sent to the minors is pretty cool to me. (I know it's not exactly the "minors," but you get what I'm saying.

6/4/2008 12:38:00 PM

vinylbandit
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It all comes down to money and, in another sense, American egalitarianism.

We don't outright sell players from club to club, and we don't knock an entire club and its fans down a notch just because they had a bad season. In fact, when a club finishes poorly (and this is in any sport), we reward them with high draft picks and profit sharing.

6/4/2008 1:41:08 PM

aimorris
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There's no way you can convince interested owners to commit $30 mil + for an expansion fee, all the time it takes to build a team and an identity, and their own money (and all the lobbying required to get government resources/land/etc to help) for their own stadium... if there's a chance they'll be a minor league team the next year.

6/4/2008 1:46:44 PM

aimorris
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Altidore to Villareal for $10 mil... he'll probably be loaned out next season, great news for US fans... although if him and Rossi ever play well together, it'll make us sick at the thought of what could've been

6/4/2008 1:52:20 PM

Thecycle23
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^^^, ^^

Both good points. Maybe there can be an exception for expansion teams then. Obviously, they're the most-likely-to-be-bad teams, but they don't really have a chance to become good if they're relegated immediately. Maybe give expansion teams a couple-year exception. Of course, there are problems with that idea too.

I don't know. It does seem impossible to have this system here.

[Edited on June 4, 2008 at 1:54 PM. Reason : ^]

6/4/2008 1:54:36 PM

aimorris
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I'm watching the Spain-USA game... after we weathered the first 15 minutes or so, we really looked pretty good, mostly through Adu who has had a really good first half

I have to catch the 2nd half on dvr later tonight

6/4/2008 4:49:27 PM

IMStoned420
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I hate having to watch all these games over the internet

6/4/2008 5:04:07 PM

JTMONEYNCSU
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^the game is coming on espn2 right now

6/4/2008 5:35:13 PM

IMStoned420
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I don't have cable. I didn't know it was coming on here on tape delay.

I don't wanna ruin it, so all I'll say is the referee sucked a huge Spanish cock in the second half. Bradley gives him an earfull as soon as he blows the final whistle.

6/4/2008 6:04:10 PM

AC Slater
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pretty nice goal by spain in the 81st

6/4/2008 7:14:13 PM

guitarguy
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pretty nice if you consider 4 defenders standing watching and play lackluster to just let him through...got caught flatfooted.

wolfe has got to go

should have left adu in (i know we're just getting people experience) but everything changed when he went out

tim howard is still our #1

johnson is just not a finisher...nor does he seem like he knows what he wants to do with the ball except just take shots (not good ones albeit that)

6/4/2008 7:34:42 PM

Big4Country
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^Adu got hurt in the first half. He had his foot stepped on twice. There is no need to hurt it more with Qualifying coming up soon. I thought we looked pretty good tonight until Adu went out. Adu and Donovan need to be on the field together in qualifying.

6/4/2008 7:51:38 PM

IMStoned420
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^^ Agree. Onyewu got totally fucked in the ass by Xavi on that goal. It was silly how easily he got through.

I forgot Wolfe was on the field until the end of the game when I noticed I hadn't noticed him. I don't think he touched the ball once. I honestly think I could do a better job out there than him.

Adu was good for the 15 minutes I saw him in the first half. The only one trying to go forward and attack.

I think Bradley is just trying to get Guzan some experience.

Johnson is so gifted physically. He made Puyol look silly on more than one occasion. But that wide open header he had and missed shows how terrible he is. It's not something that he can't necessarily fix, but he is not good enough to play at this level. He doesn't even play for his club.

^ Adu might yet turn out to be the player everyone thought he would be. We need him, Donovan and Altidore out on the field all at once.

I just want to reiterate that the referee was terrible in the second half. Most one sided game I've seen in awhile. I can't believe the black dude on Spain didn't get a card for that tackle from behind on Dempsey. A little more contact and that's a straight red.

6/4/2008 7:57:14 PM

aimorris
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The only problem with having Adu and Donovan is how you play them... they're both better as withdrawn forwards and we all know Bradley likes to play with two defensive midfielders:

---Altidore---
Adu---Donovan
Beaz--Bradley--Edu--Dempsey

I guess you could play them like that, but you're putting a lot of pressure on our not-so-good defense. Oneywu is horrible, I don't see how he can play much longer. I would much rather see Parkhurst in there.

6/4/2008 8:20:24 PM

JTMONEYNCSU
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^lol so we can play the christmas tree formation


..........ST
......AM....AM
..LM ..CDM ..RM
LB...DC....DC...RB
..........GK

in my manager games i play on my computer i always hated that formation, and i crushed any opponent who deployed this tactic.

6/4/2008 8:36:54 PM

aimorris
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yeah I don't like it either... maybe this

Adu--Altidore--Donovan
Beaz--Bradley--Dempsey
DEF-DEF-DEF-DEF

It leaves us weak defensively but it would definitely give us some offense. This formation is also 100% likely to never happen under Bob Bradley.

6/4/2008 8:44:02 PM

PackGuitar
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does the US ever score a fucking goal? every damn game i watch we get shutout, god we suck

6/4/2008 8:48:18 PM

IMStoned420
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I don't really know how that would work either. Maybe a 4-2-3-1?

Have the back 4 like usual. Then Donovan and Bradley play center midfield. Bradley with a defensive role and Donovan with an attacking. Play Beasley and Dempsey high up as wingers. Put Adu in the middle and let him work either side of the field and then Altidore up top. We have a decent number of talented midfielders but no strikers. I know this wouldn't put Donovan in his favored position, but I think he's matured enough to take to this role effectively. He could distribute the ball from a little further back and occasionally break through the opposing midfielders' line to start and attack. Adu would be high enough to run at the defense and create. Dempsey and Beasley could do their things on the wing without having too much responsibility they can't handle. The only problem might be if Altidore doesn't score goals like everyone hopes he can. It'd be a lot of pressure to have a guy that young have so much responsibility for scoring goals. Plus, we'd be playing for a lot of 1-0 results and that doesn't synch well with the fact that we usually have at least one epic fuck up on defense per game.

I also thought Hejduk played really well in the second half today. He's still got a lot of fight left in him and he was the only guy who even got close to Xavi on his goal even though he wasn't responsible for what happened.

6/4/2008 8:49:15 PM

JTMONEYNCSU
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if we had some fuckin wingbacks who were worth a damn, and we had a coach who actually had some balls the best formation to play in my mind is a 4-2-4. something like this:

......ST....ST
LF.................RF
......CM...CM
LWB CD..CD RWB
.........GK

with the wing backs and wingers making forward runs and center mids pushing up and dropping back when tactically needed. this is basically what man utd do...and i think we all know how they fared. we have the speed to do it with the top 6 players, its just we dont have any reliable wing backs to run up and down the field.


i think brazil basically use this formation too...its pretty much a modified 4-4-2, but push forward the wingers a bit more

[Edited on June 4, 2008 at 8:56 PM. Reason : v]

6/4/2008 8:54:09 PM

PackGuitar
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just need some aggression... scoring ZERO every game wont ever win based on my ncsu educated mind

im so sick of being shut out

6/4/2008 8:56:38 PM

JTMONEYNCSU
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well this is what you get when you hire conservative managers. the usa badly needs a european coach, or a south american coach, hell we need more european, african, south american players that become american citizens apparently to field a good team

6/4/2008 8:59:51 PM

PackGuitar
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yea very true

6/4/2008 9:01:35 PM

IMStoned420
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^^^^That's basically what I was thinking of except Adu plays behind Altidore up top. The only thing with that is our defense isn't solid enough to hold without the help that the outside midfielders provide, I don't think. Although, if we had more possession the other team wouldn't get 187384873 attacks on goal per game and that would make the defense's job a little easier. We just look lost in the midfield like we don't know what to do or where to go with the ball. I think that's where Donovan helps a lot and where (in the past) Reyna helped a lot. We're playing with a lot of inexperience in the central midfield right now and when you play teams like England/Spain/Argentina, you're going to get eaten alive if you're not solid enough in the middle of the field.

[Edited on June 4, 2008 at 9:02 PM. Reason : ^]

6/4/2008 9:01:41 PM

JTMONEYNCSU
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and generally when you play with 2 CDM's its gonna be a bit hardpressed to attack, since you got 2 freaking guys playing the same position on the field...that may also be whats screwin up the midfield(i.e. England in euro qualifying with Gerrard and Lampard)

6/4/2008 9:03:37 PM

aimorris
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Quote :
"Have the back 4 like usual. Then Donovan and Bradley play center midfield. Bradley with a defensive role and Donovan with an attacking. Play Beasley and Dempsey high up as wingers. Put Adu in the middle and let him work either side of the field and then Altidore up top."


I'd rather have Donovan play up top, we need to utilize his speed and he's probably the best finisher on the team. Bradley isn't solid enough of a defensive midfielder to handle the middle on his own (maybe he'll learn in England)

-------Altidore--Donovan--------
--Beasley----Adu-----Dempsey--
---------Edu---Bradley----------
Spector?--Parkhurst----Dolo-----

6/4/2008 9:08:20 PM

IMStoned420
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I think Gerrard (and Lampard to a lesser extent) is too good at offense to completely consider him a CDM. He's very good at defense, but he's also really good at offense too. I think England is weak on the wings in midfield and defense. They don't have hardly anything in the midfield and the people they have on defense just don't seem to mesh well with the rest of the team. I think England just needs a good coach and they'll be fine. The core of the team is there, they just need to pick up the right pieces that complement those guys instead of throwing all their all-stars in there and hoping for the best, a la USA Basketball.

6/4/2008 9:11:38 PM

JTMONEYNCSU
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im thinking we need to transition spector into the central defense and get rid of gooch or bocafailgro for now...and i guess put parkhurst in for the other retard in the back


^they cancelled each other out cause they were both trying to play CAM, i was just pointing out that having 2 guys on the field who are playing the same position hurts

[Edited on June 4, 2008 at 9:12 PM. Reason : f]

6/4/2008 9:11:38 PM

IMStoned420
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Playing a 3-5-2 is suicide.

^ I'll agree with you that they ARE basically the same player. I still think England needs to find a way to use both of them though.

[Edited on June 4, 2008 at 9:13 PM. Reason : ]

6/4/2008 9:12:38 PM

JTMONEYNCSU
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if we had 3 quick/big center backs then it would work, like say Ferdinand, Mertesacker, and Nesta...lol then maybe we could have 3 in the back


maybe not so much quick, but definitely a presence in the back

[Edited on June 4, 2008 at 9:14 PM. Reason : f]

6/4/2008 9:13:54 PM

IMStoned420
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Haha. Yes. If you have 3 of the top defenders in the world, then it might work. But sadly, that is a luxury we do not have.

6/4/2008 9:14:57 PM

JTMONEYNCSU
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i just like saying mertesacker's name...

Mertesacker, Per Mertesacker haha

6/4/2008 9:15:55 PM

IMStoned420
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http://usasoccerftw.blogspot.com/
check it out

6/4/2008 10:27:19 PM

Ernie
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Wait, according to that ^, we turned down Klinsmann; I thought he turned down us. Fuck us if we said no to Jurgen Klinsmann.

6/4/2008 10:47:59 PM

IMStoned420
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He laid out his terms and USSoccer Administration didn't agree to them so he didn't take the job, I guess. His terms weren't anything that other national team coaches aren't given though. I look at it as us turning him down because he wanted to coach the US team.

6/4/2008 10:52:46 PM

JTMONEYNCSU
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well because its a blog im not sure how much i can totally believe it, but i havent read into the klinsmann thing...but if its true then god damn...i almost dont feel like watching the game against argentina coming up now...

6/4/2008 11:19:29 PM

aimorris
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nobody knows for sure

I've heard he wanted complete control over every level of USSF, I've also heard it was a salary issue

He's a good coach but I'm not sure he's worth handing over 100% of USSF to, especially considering his only coaching job was leading an already very talented, previous WC runner-ups to the semis in their own country (no host team has never not reached the 2nd round)

If money was the only thing stopping the move, then shame on USSF and Gulati. Actually, shame on them anyway for being fucks

6/4/2008 11:35:36 PM

JTMONEYNCSU
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i guess he thought we were being jewish...



da dum ching...

6/4/2008 11:38:47 PM

IMStoned420
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haha. I heard it was just something about bringing different players in and playing them on the Nats team. Something like the USSoccer people wanted to continue to add some MLS players to the roster probably just for exposure and he wanted to control that part completely, which is not unreasonable to ask at all, IMO.

6/4/2008 11:43:27 PM

Ernie
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I didn't see it posted anywhere but I'm sure everyone already knows: Altidore was sold to Villarreal for $11 million. Hopefully he'll get some kind of experience over there against real competition.

6/5/2008 1:09:04 AM

JTMONEYNCSU
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it was posted earlier in this thread at 10 mil, guess it went up a bit. hes gonna have a bit of time gettin in the starting lineup unless he impresses early, the one good thing he has to look forward to is that villareal's strikers(outside rossi) are aging

6/5/2008 7:10:40 AM

aimorris
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I read that he was immediately getting loaned out

6/5/2008 7:12:51 AM

JTMONEYNCSU
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taht wouldnt surprise me either. i wonder if theyll just loan him right back to the red bulls

6/5/2008 7:20:28 AM

aaronian
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why would they loan him to a team where he can't develop any more

6/5/2008 3:12:34 PM

JTMONEYNCSU
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he hasnt exactly dominated the mls, and is still only 18.

6/5/2008 3:45:53 PM

aaronian
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15 goals 5 assists in 37 games for a 17-18 year old is pretty damn good. theres no way villa loans him to a mls team

[Edited on June 5, 2008 at 4:18 PM. Reason : .]

6/5/2008 4:17:26 PM

aimorris
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^ combined with he hasn't always been a starter and he's been playing out of position for NYRB almost all of this season

The rumor is he's going to be loaned to Recreativo Huelva to get some immediate La Liga experience. The reason he wants to leave is because he wants a chance to improve his game at a higher level. If he was just going to be loaned right back, why would he agree to that deal

6/5/2008 4:26:07 PM

Big4Country
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I thought Klinsmann turned down the job because he couldn't use the players he wanted to? We had no choice because most of our players had to go back to Europe when it was time for Copa America. Even Brazil didn't have all of their stars there. Also, I don't thing a European coach is the answer. All of the European teams seemed to play pretty conservative in the 2006 World Cup and rely on defense to win games 1-0. Germany is the one European team that I can remember seeing score lots of goals.

6/5/2008 7:07:13 PM

JTMONEYNCSU
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i know hes good, and im not puttin him down cause god knows i want a good striker for the USA, but he got a lot of those goals last season because defenders were preoccupied with angel. i just dont want to see him go over to spain and pull an eddie johnson and get demoted to the bench in a hurry. this is the 2nd place team in spain he just moved to...so its like comparing to the EPL, if he was on the 2nd place team there, would he really get to start or ever start at chelsea or even arsenal at 3rd place...

hes got a challenge now over there, and if hes going over to huelva, hopefully they dont get demoted next season so that there isnt any reason to blame an american for that cause.


^in the knockout stage, most every team is going to be conservative/hesitant...not just europeans
also, i think germany scored a lot of goals in the 2002 world cup, not 2006 world cup

[Edited on June 5, 2008 at 7:11 PM. Reason : f]

[Edited on June 5, 2008 at 7:18 PM. Reason : f]

6/5/2008 7:09:41 PM

aimorris
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Germany's 8-0 win over Saudi Arabia skews their 02 goal numbers

As for Altidore, some people that don't watch a lot of MLS should just watch this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vqrrxho0Wb4

I'm not sure how many of those goals were because of the defense's attention to Angel. This kid is automatic around the 6, he can drill some long range shots (I can think of a couple that aren't in that video), he has fantastic finishing ability with his head, he's a great dribbler, he's fast. He might not crack the starting lineup at the beginning of the season but I don't see how he doesn't get any PT. Comparisons to EJ aren't fair at all considering the only tool Johnson has is his speed, and it's not much better against top level opponents and he has nothing else to fall back on. Altidore has plenty.

6/5/2008 7:59:08 PM

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