Quote :

"@mikeelk On the host committee for Biden's 1st Presidential Fundraiser is Steven Cozen, chairman of Cozen O'Connor, a union-busting law firm that proudly boasts on their website of how they help employers beat unions and lockout workers https://t.co/BZfkZVTqJK"

4/25/2019 6:54:36 AM

definitely getting shrike's vote

4/25/2019 8:27:06 AM

biden's launch ad is pretty good, it's refreshing and surprising to see such an establishment politician support antifa
https://youtu.be/VbOU2fTg6cI

his logo is pretty bad

4/25/2019 10:46:19 AM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=370&v=Cf-F2l4I0zI

lol poor klobuchar

4/25/2019 10:57:13 AM

This one is better looking. But then its also a bit presumptuous.

BIDEN. PRESIDENT.

4/25/2019 11:04:09 AM

^^even jeb bush winced at that

^that is much better, they should ditch the joe one. i like how they showed the D uncomfortably violating the E's personal space to really capture biden's essence


[Edited on April 25, 2019 at 11:07 AM. Reason : .]

4/25/2019 11:06:09 AM

yeesh, that was def worse than jeb's "please clap"

4/25/2019 1:03:48 PM

Pretty apt characterization of all three of them.

Warren= great policies, terrible at politics

Klobuchar= abrasive/bitchy, even if she's honest

Buttigieg= absolutely full of shit and insufferably smug


Biden/Harris. BOOK IT.

4/25/2019 1:56:38 PM

I guess the final four will be: Biden, Sanders, Warren and Yang.

4/25/2019 2:09:51 PM

Quote :

"Warren= great policies, terrible at politics "

a weird read for someone elected senator vs an incumbent, even in Mass. Better might be "is a woman" or "unwilling to take PAC/big donor money"

4/25/2019 4:19:57 PM

Still leaning Warren but not certain. I definitely will not be voting for Biden, Harris, Gabbard, Klobuchar, Hickenlooper, O'Rourke, and probably not Sanders either. (In the primary anyway, I will definitely be voting for whoever is going up against Trump)

Also, can't remember if I saw a link to this on here or not, but now that Uncle Joe is in it's worth another watch:


[Edited on April 25, 2019 at 4:47 PM. Reason : -]

4/25/2019 4:44:49 PM

I’m talking about her DNA gaffe and her hokey/folksy style of speaking when going out of her way to seem down to earth/genuine. She’s at her best when she delivers scathing rebukes on Capitol Hill, but when she tried to come across as likeable, it’s almost cringe-worthy.

Harris does a much better job, even if she dodges questions by saying it’s “conversation worthy”

4/25/2019 4:46:11 PM

The DNA thing it's certainly a gaffe but no worse than something pretty much every candidate has. Biden has a history of being a creep. Bernie is stubborn to a fault. The others are well discussed in this thread.

As for the likeability, that comes down to "being a woman." half the articles written about her ask if she's likeable. Bernie shouts at you and Biden is, as stated, a creep, who talks about how likeable they are?

4/25/2019 5:28:53 PM

I literally just named a woman candidate (of color, mind you) that is more charismatic and better at connecting with the public than Warren. I know a lot of people aren’t crazy about Harris on TWW, but she’s actually pretty popular. She does well in town halls and can work a crowd. I have never once heard anyone claim that Warren has that ability, but maybe I’m wrong.

If Warren could somehow completely change her personality and speaking style, she’d absolutely be a great president. But she is who she is, and unfortunately superficial things such as likeability and charm count more than they should, which is why Mayor Pete is doing so well, despite being full of shit, and having very little relevant experience.

4/25/2019 5:50:01 PM

There's still a long way before a woman becomes the most powerful person in the world.

4/25/2019 6:00:42 PM

You’re absolutely right, but unfortunately, it looks like Biden (ugh) is probably the best chance Dems have to beat Trump.

4/25/2019 6:05:13 PM

^^^I wasn't necessarily implying that you yourself have a problem with women, but that Warren gets far more attention on that subject than on her policies (or more than the make candidates anyway). And actually I've seen that she kills at town halls. I think she got raves for the CNN hall the other night and the "she the people" event (yesterday?). She also had to field questions about "electability" that I don't think others had to field (not 100% sure though)

My point is, in general, she gets much less media attn and suffers in the polls bc she is a woman who tries not to take dirty money. I guess the latter is technically being "bad at politics", unfortunately but it makes her an excellent candidate imo.

[Edited on April 25, 2019 at 6:09 PM. Reason : E]

[Edited on April 25, 2019 at 6:10 PM. Reason : ^it's way way too early to make any decisions passed on "candidate X vs Trump" polling ]

4/25/2019 6:06:38 PM

^ fair enough, but in pretty much every poll I've seen Harris is doing better than Warren. You're right that's it's still way too early to be able to predict much of anything, I just don't like Warren's chances very much (at least right now) because of how she played herself with the DNA thing and how different she 'acts' on the campaign trail versus her in the Senate.

4/25/2019 7:07:55 PM

Warren is my top pic but the DNA thing was more than a gaffe, ot showed that she was politically naive enough to let someone else control the narrative and fabricate an issue that she willingly walked into and lost. She could have just not done anything, instead she just willingly let Trump make her look like a fool and also inadvertently pissed off native Americans.

If she cant navigate such a softball issue that she didnt even need to wade into, I'm not convinced she can hold up when the real tests start.

As a gaffe it's no worse than the other things, but as a sign of her abilities as a candidate I think it is.

[Edited on April 25, 2019 at 7:18 PM. Reason : .]

4/25/2019 7:17:10 PM

Mostly agree with that assessment, although people have pretty short memories and forget shit like that pretty easily. The problem I see with her, is just how awkward she acts when she's trying to appeal to a wide audience. She's great at preaching to the choir, but what I've seen from her and Harris during rallies/town halls is night and day. It's just my subjective opinion, but I can see how she'd remind plenty of people of Hillary, which isn't good (fair or not).

Also, I am at the point where I honestly don't even care that much about who gets the nom as long as they beat Trump. I'm fine holding my nose, and since no candidate will be perfect, I hope everyone else decides to do the same instead of being babies about it like in 2016.

[Edited on April 25, 2019 at 7:23 PM. Reason : .]

4/25/2019 7:21:15 PM

she has plenty of time to evolve in that regard

I’ll be voting for her and I think she’ll be the democratic nominee

4/25/2019 7:24:19 PM

Quote :

"I have never once heard anyone claim that Warren has that ability, but maybe I’m wrong."

You are wrong. I've seen her speak live on multiple occasions and she can absolutely work a crowd. She will own Trump in debates because while he's throwing around false adages and insults, she'll be appealing to logic, intelligence, and issues that are relevant to working class people. Doing the DNA test and the followup video were huge mistakes, but now she (and her campaign team) know better than to fall into that trap again.

4/25/2019 7:46:51 PM

I mean, she got her political start by being really, really good on shows like the Daily Show and Real Time (the latter hurt to type)

she’s really appealing

4/25/2019 7:51:48 PM

There's an ocean of difference between being a pittbull and expertly attacking hypocrisy/criminality and trying to appeal to EVERYONE and get them to 'like' you (aka being a realistic candidate for POTUS)

I think she's great at the former, and not at the latter.

4/25/2019 8:53:04 PM

Quote :

"fair enough, but in pretty much every poll I've seen Harris is doing better than Warren."

Well, female isnt the only part of the equation i'm laying out, money is the other. Harris has been much more willing to take that big money donor.


https://www.politico.com/story/2019/04/17/kamala-harris-leads-campaign-money-race-1280546

Quote :

"Warren is my top pic but the DNA thing was more than a gaffe, ot showed that she was politically naive enough to let someone else control the narrative and fabricate an issue that she willingly walked into and lost. "

talk about a fucking gaffe, everything Biden has done since he is announced could count. He met with Anita Hill in theory to make amends and completely bungled it, he used Charlottesville without talking to anyone that was actually involved and without actually ever taking a real position, especially before today. Not to mentions courting Comcast, big insurance and union busters. god i hope i dont have to vote/campaign for him.

4/25/2019 10:30:39 PM

I could go for knocking down our student loan debt from $82k to $16k.

4/25/2019 10:56:48 PM

The Democratic Party is about to split hard.

4/25/2019 11:02:23 PM

I thought that's what would happen with the Tea Party, but somehow the GOP ended up with Trumpers hijacking the whole party. I bet the Tea Party folks are like "hey we were here first, let US be the unreasonable extremist presence slowly poisoning the nation"

4/25/2019 11:27:12 PM

somehoworother, the Tea Party types have, to a significant extent, become Trumpists. It's like they're more motivated by just being extreme than by being for limited government.

4/26/2019 1:48:49 AM

Quote :

"but somehow the GOP ended up with Trumpers hijacking the whole party"

Quote :

"somehoworother, the Tea Party types have, to a significant extent, become Trumpists."

I think that's mostly based in GOP congress people preferring to remain being congress people, and don't want to get primaried out of office. It's certainly not a party buy-in to his crazy agenda, which is a very generous usage of that term, given Trump not giving a shit about actual policy and instead prizing the same thing as GOP congress people: staying in office.

Quote :

"she will own Trump in debates because while he's throwing around false adages and insults, she'll be appealing to logic, intelligence, and issues that are relevant to working class people"

I feel like those proceedings have already happened with the 2016 debates. I hope what you predict happens, but I'm skeptical given 2016. Maybe the Dems will watch the tape and find a hole, but I doubt any owning will happen.

4/26/2019 2:06:41 AM

Quote :

"I have never once heard anyone claim that Warren has that ability, but maybe I’m wrong"

Someone has, in this very thread, regarding her CNN Town Hall appearance.

4/26/2019 2:16:42 AM

^if you mean my post, that was AFTER he said that

Quote :

"trying to appeal to EVERYONE and get them to 'like' you (aka being a realistic candidate for POTUS)"

I missed this yesterday but this seems like an outdated worry. The Dem nominee will be going up against the most unlikable candidate in American history? They just need to be a little more more likeable than Hilary Clinton, who also wasn't very likeable.

4/26/2019 6:55:44 AM

Quote :

"She will own Trump in debates because while he's throwing around false adages and insults, she'll be appealing to logic, intelligence, and issues"

Oh. So, we're fucked, then.

Trump won an election entirely on "false adages and insults." I think it was their backup tagline if "Make America Great Again" didn't work out - "Trump/Pence 2016 - False adages and insults."

Fortunately that's not all she'd be doing; she'll also be appealing to voters' baser instincts, like their desire for free money.

4/26/2019 7:58:26 AM

^

Who didn't get the memo that logic and facts don't matter?

4/26/2019 8:40:15 AM

^ Everyone the majority of the time.

4/26/2019 9:48:55 AM

[Edited on April 26, 2019 at 9:59 AM. Reason : wrong thread]

4/26/2019 9:53:31 AM

https://www.mcsweeneys.net/articles/a-rough-transcript-of-every-interview-with-pete-buttigieg

4/26/2019 10:42:46 AM

Quote :

"if you mean my post, that was AFTER he said that"

naw someone said that weeks back, to me, when I raised a similar concern.

4/26/2019 11:37:11 AM

Either way, it’s A) my subjective opinion (not worth shit), B) a common knock on Warren, C) cause for concern, given her missteps.

I’ve been a fan/supporter or hers for a long, long time, and in an ideal world, charisma/charm/whatever wouldn’t matter nearly as much as it does. It would be wonderful if she wins the nom by evolving into a candidate that is as beloved as Jacinda Arden. I’m just nowhere near that optimistic, simply because America is in shambles.

She may be the candidate America deserves, but I would prepare to be disappointed and be ready to roll with cringey/creepy Joe. And since the Dems are pretty bad at winning presidential elections (see EC), I could see Harris as the VP to pander to POC.

[Edited on April 26, 2019 at 11:45 AM. Reason : Damn, I’m bleak ]

4/26/2019 11:43:59 AM

Quote :

"naw someone said that weeks back, to me, when I raised a similar concern"

Oh I thought the CNN town hall was just a couple days ago

4/26/2019 12:33:58 PM

^ It was you who pointed it out, a month ago. message_topic.aspx?topic=648215&page=14

[Edited on April 26, 2019 at 1:40 PM. Reason : lots of town halls]

4/26/2019 1:40:29 PM

Joe just sent me this.

Quote :

" Our campaign raised $6.3 million in its first 24 hours!! That’s more than any other presidential campaign so far!! And Nick, it’s proof we are running a truly grassroots campaign: 97% of online donations were under $200 We received donations from all 50 states and US territories The average online donation was $41 So thank you so much to all 96,926 people who chipped in on Day One. We couldn’t have achieved this amazing milestone without you."

Is it really grassroots Joe? Is it?

4/26/2019 2:38:17 PM

If there's someone who ever has a chance to beat Trump, then it's Joe.

4/26/2019 2:43:36 PM

^^^ah I didn't remember, thanks

[Edited on April 26, 2019 at 2:44 PM. Reason : E]

4/26/2019 2:44:36 PM

Joe is the least likely to beat trump IMO.

4/26/2019 4:00:08 PM

Loved the moment when Cory Booker was browbeaten into promising a female running mate. Have some pride, dude.

Biden is never going to make it through this process. He has a long, complex history that simply won't pass the smell test in the 2019 "Justice Democrat" version of the party. He can't survive the purity spiral, and that's ignoring the fact that he's an old white male, which is the equivalent of being Literally Hitler in the DNC. I'm not even sure if Obama could make it through in 2020, he looks like a downright fascist at this point.

Warren and Bernie now feel like they need to participate in this race to the progressive bottom in order to have a chance. It's amazing how much of an influence AOC has had on the party as a junior representative, despite the fact that she is not even close to representative of the general American public.

If Biden, or to a lesser degree Buttigieg, can just come across as reasonable, intelligent politicians, they'd have a good shot at beating Trump. That's not going to happen, though.

The focus on giving felons the right to vote is kind of a bizarre hill to die on. Americans don't care about that, and for most, it just sounds insane. We've taken everything away from the prisoners, but somehow the right to vote is so sacred that it must be protected? Who are they pandering to here?

Harris is such a weasel it's unreal. "Let's have the conversation". What a cowardly non-answer. Your job was to put people in jail for smoking weed, now you're trying to whitewash your past and hoping no one calls you on it.

[Edited on April 26, 2019 at 4:18 PM. Reason : ]

4/26/2019 4:15:20 PM

A libertarian lecturing anyone about purity spirals is so 2019.

[Edited on April 26, 2019 at 4:34 PM. Reason : Friday and I caint type]

4/26/2019 4:33:35 PM

Libertarians have horrible purity spiral problems and it's why they are politically irrelevant. Focus less on what you imagine I believe/focus more on what I'm saying.

[Edited on April 26, 2019 at 4:37 PM. Reason : ]

4/26/2019 4:37:26 PM

Quote :

"and that's ignoring the fact that he's an old white male, which is the equivalent of being Literally Hitler in the DNC. "

[Edited on April 26, 2019 at 4:47 PM. Reason : .]

4/26/2019 4:46:14 PM

Lmao of the purity test of "not being a creep" and "not being a corporate stooge"

Btw if Biden wins I will easily vote for him. I would vote for him 100 times over Trump, and 99% of Republicans for that matter.

4/26/2019 4:49:38 PM